Jesus is God
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If you deny that Jesus is God, you are denying the deity of Jesus. Your illustration of demon occupation has nothing in common with the nature of God. You are trying to find some way to marginalize what scripture says about Jesus for the reason I presented in my previous post. There is no truth in scripture that is more profoundly attested to than the fact that Jesus is GOD! If you are having trouble with some of those passages, perhaps we could look at them together.
Hi oldhermit,
I do not believe Jesus is God. Jesus says he is the Son of God and he says it many times but no where does he specifically say "I am God". He does say God dwells in him and that he is not speaking but the Father is speaking through him. The bible also points out that God is not a man and that Jesus is a man in many places. Also in the Bible it says Jesus has a God.
1 Corinthians 8:6 yet to us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things, and we in Him, and one Lord Jesus Christ by whom are all things, and we by Him
John 20:17 Jesus said unto her, "Touch Me not, for I am not yet ascended to My Father; but go to My brethren and say unto them, 'I ascend unto My Father and your Father, and to My God and your God.'"
Luke 18:19 And Jesus said unto him, "Why callest thou Me good? None is good save One, that is, God.
There is even a heirarchy
1 Corinthians 11:3 But I would have you know that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is the man, and the head of Christ is God.
It does not say the head of Christ is Christ.
Luke 4:1 And Jesus, being full of the Holy Ghost, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness
John 5:30 "I can of Mine own self do nothing. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is just, because I seek not Mine own will, but the will of the Father who hath sent Me.
Luke 22:42 saying, "Father, if Thou be willing, remove this cup from Me; nevertheless not My will, but Thine be done."
John 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? The words that I speak unto you I speak not of Myself; but the Father that dwelleth in Me, He doeth the works.
God is not a man.
numbers 23:19 God is not a man, that He should lie; neither the son of man, that He should repent. Hath He said, and shall He not do it? Or hath He spoken, and shall He not make it good?
God is a spirit.
John 4:24 God is a Spirit, and they that worship Him must worship Him in spirit and in truth."
Jesus is not a spirit but a man.
1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
Luke 24:39 Behold My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself. Handle Me and see, for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see Me to have."
God proves His reality in Creation, His power through miracles, His grace and mercy through love for the sinner, and his wisdom through a Plan that never fails. He has countless ways to "prove" Himself to each soul on earth. I, however, cannot prove anything i just said; but, I have witnessed the proof of God by God. (Of course, anyone can make a similar claim about other gods or non-gods, but this is what i write in faith.) God is more than i can describe, though I agree with the original poster.
I do not feel like I am being attacked. I am just showing the other side. I have felt God my whole life and I know my position is not held by many. The Trinity is believed by the bulk of Christians but when has the majority ever been right?
Shalom
Of course, I agree with everything said in all of these passages. What you are not addressing is all of the passages that present the nature of Jesus as God. You cannot pit one list of scriptures against another and hope to arrive at truth. Perhaps we could start at the beginning. What kind of picture doe scripture give us about the nature of God?
Hi oldhermit,
Many of the scripure I picked because they are absolute truths like God is not a man and that Christ is a man.
I would gladly discuss the nature of God. Will you lead the way with some scripture to start.
Shalom
Perhaps the first place we need to start is with the fact that Jesus is indeed man but, he is not just man. Jesus is eternal and existed as God before assuming human form just as John tells us in John 1.
K
Kerry
Guest
John 3:12 I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things?
1 Corinthians 15:40 There are also heavenly bodies and there are earthly bodies; but the splendor of the heavenly bodies is one kind, and the splendor of the earthly bodies is another.
Colossians 3:2 Set your minds on things above, not on earthly things.
John 14:9 Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?
Matthew 7:16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thorn-bushes, or figs from thistles?
Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,
The only way a person can recognize God is that you have to feel for His presence, not by touch or sight, but by knowing how He make you feel when you are in His presence. The people that were around Him, was always feeling alive, but they were poor. By being in His presence make you forget all about your problems in life, because you will be overwhelm with the things that come while you are in His presence.
Matthew 1:23 “The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and they will call him Immanuel” (which means “God with us”).
John 1:4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind.
Matthew 9:15 Jesus answered, “How can the guests of the bridegroom mourn while he is with them? The time will come when the bridegroom will be taken from them; then they will fast.
Several of us addressed John 1 earlier in the posts when we talked about the Word or in Greek logos. Logos was translated into different words in the bible including Torah, instructions, law and Word. Jesus was the walking torah. He was sinless and performed the law perfectly. He is also indwelled with by God who teaches and instructs him everything.
Joh 1:32 And John bore witness, saying, "I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and He remained upon Him.
Joh 1:32 And John bore witness, saying, "I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and He remained upon Him.
Yes, I read that post. This explanation does not address how the text represents the word Logos. Would you be willing to examine the grammatical construction of this text from the Greek?
K
Kerry
Guest
well if you want to break it down into syntax and not take it for what it say's then nothing in the word is reliable. It is a matter of faith and take it for what it say's. You can break down electricity if you want to and call it theory. I meant you can't see it but you can dang sure feel it. You make the bible say what you want it to say. Just goes to show how much we need the Holy Spirit.
I get your point but syntax is all important. What you have to remember is that any syntax in scripture is revealed syntax. All truth exists exclusively withing the grammatical structure of the text.
K
Kerry
Guest
The main feature in the book of the bible is the cross and it comes through in any language, we are the ones that question and in disbelief look to our own means.
I am afraid my greek is not fluent. I mostly use Strongs when questioning a translation. Even greek experts have trouble translating John 1.
Psalm 2
1 Why do the nations conspire
and the peoples plot in vain?
2 The kings of the earth rise up
and the rulers band together
against the Lord and against his anointed, saying,
3 “Let us break their chains
and throw off their shackles.”
4 The One enthroned in heaven laughs;
the Lord scoffs at them.
5 He rebukes them in his anger
and terrifies them in his wrath, saying,
6 “I have installed my king
on Zion, my holy mountain.”
7 I will proclaim the Lord’s decree:
He said to me, “You are my son;
today I have become your father.
8 Ask me,
and I will make the nations your inheritance,
the ends of the earth your possession.
9 You will break them with a rod of iron;
you will dash them to pieces like pottery.”
10 Therefore, you kings, be wise;
be warned, you rulers of the earth.
11 Serve the Lord with fear
and celebrate his rule with trembling.
12 Kiss his son, or he will be angry
and your way will lead to your destruction,
for his wrath can flare up in a moment.
Blessed are all who take refuge in him.