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BeanieD

Guest
Deeds are the fruits of the spirit, and without the Holy Spirit living in us then we cannot produce. We are saved, but we also need that close personal relationship with God that allows the Spirit to work in and through us and gives us the true desire to do as God wills and our fruits will then be seen.
 
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Hoffco

Guest
Deeds are the fruits of the spirit, and without the Holy Spirit living in us then we cannot produce. We are saved, but we also need that close personal relationship with God that allows the Spirit to work in and through us and gives us the true desire to do as God wills and our fruits will then be seen.
When you say," we are saved, but" You don't understand Bible salvation. I would never assure anyone of their salvation ,If they don't have a fruit producing relationship with GOD our Savior, Father , Son and Holy Spirit. The true desire to be holy, is a necessary part of the Born Again experience, with out it, we are not saved. And if one doesn't FEEL saved, it is not saved or is in a backslidden state. Love to all Hoffco
 
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Newbirth I am thinking ,you must be "oneness" , OTHERWISE, I have liked your comments. My last post ,had you in mind and i was seeking to draw you out to state your opinions on all I stated as problems with the "oneness" people. God bless, Hoffco
I am not align to any particular doctrine I believe in God.not doctrine of men...Nowhere in scripture is God identified as three...He is identified as one...
Mark 12:32
And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he:

Romans 3:30

Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.

1 Corinthians 8:4
As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.

1 Corinthians 8:6


But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.


Galatians 3:20
Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.

Ephesians 4:6
One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

1 Timothy 2:5
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

James 2:19
Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.


The scripture says God is one...Gal 3 :20 ...doctrine of man says God is three ...Who must I believe?????
The scripture says there is one mediator between God and men...the man Christ Jesus.....
Doctrine of men take different scriptures join them up and conclude according to their understanding that God is a trinity...God never said that......
 
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Hoffco

Guest
To newbirth, God is one God in three persons; You destroy so much of the scripture text, narrative, when you won't accept the natural meaning of words, you make God to be a deceitful pretender. Just a simple reading of the Bible tells us the Father and the Son are separate persons, who talk to each other, The Son is the only begotten one ,in the bosom of the Father, from all eternity to all eternity. If Jesus is not God eternal , He can not be the "only Savior" for sinners. Jesus claimed to be the eternal "I am". God is ACHAD, ONE with PLURALITY. Love to all, Hoffco
 
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cfultz3

Guest
Doctrine of men take different scriptures join them up and conclude according to their understanding that God is a trinity...God never said that......
General question please,

Is that not what you just did with those verses?
 
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Hoffco

Guest
It is very easy to establish that there is only one God. But the very fact that there is a Father suggests there is a Son, there is no Father without offspring. And the fact that this son is the ONLY BEGOTTEN of the Father would tell us that This son is not created but eternally begotten, in the bosom of the Father ,eternally begotten, since God is LOVE. Love to all Hoffco
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
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Deeds are the fruits of the spirit, and without the Holy Spirit living in us then we cannot produce. We are saved, but we also need that close personal relationship with God that allows the Spirit to work in and through us and gives us the true desire to do as God wills and our fruits will then be seen.
I take it you have never read what the fruit of the Spirit really are:

Galatians 5:22-23 (NKJV)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering {the opposite of short tempered}, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,
[SUP]23 [/SUP] gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
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It is very easy to establish that there is only one God. But the very fact that there is a Father suggests there is a Son, there is no Father without offspring. And the fact that this son is the ONLY BEGOTTEN of the Father would tell us that This son is not created but eternally begotten, in the bosom of the Father ,eternally begotten, since God is LOVE. Love to all Hoffco
I am pretty sure that I have told you before. SON of GOD is a HEIRSHIP TITLE that does not mean offspring. In Jewish life traditions, the owner of property chooses WHOMEVER he wants to be the legal heir of all that HE has, and it DOES NOT HAVE TO BE AN OFFSPRING. The Father being part of the ETERNAL TRIUNE GOD, CHOSE to give that TITLE designating the rightful HEIR to all that the FATHER HAS (INCLUDING HIS DEITY), to the Part of HIMSELF that CREATED EVERYTHING.

Colossians 1:16-19 (HCSB)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] For everything was created by Him, in heaven and on earth, the visible and the invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities— all things have been created through Him and for Him.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] He is before all things, and by Him all things hold together.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] He is also the head of the body, the church; He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He might come to have first place in everything.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] For God was pleased ⌊to have⌋ all His fullness dwell in Him,



Still don't believe me, then ASK A JEWISH LAWYER.
 
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Hoffco

Guest
To VCO, Sorry you have just SLAPPED the ONLY BEGOTTEN SON of GOD in the face. By giving HIM a title that you and I and millioms of Born again redeamed sons of God are given, as the adopted Sons heirs, of
 
Jan 19, 2013
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I am pretty sure that I have told you before. SON of GOD is a HEIRSHIP TITLE that does not mean offspring. In Jewish life traditions, the owner of property chooses WHOMEVER he wants to be the legal heir of all that HE has, and it DOES NOT HAVE TO BE AN OFFSPRING.
And if it's not his offspring, he does not call him "Son."

The Father being part of the ETERNAL TRIUNE GOD, CHOSE to give that TITLE designating the rightful HEIR to all that the FATHER HAS (INCLUDING HIS DEITY), to the Part of HIMSELF that CREATED EVERYTHING.

Colossians 1:16-19 (HCSB)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] For everything was created by Him, in heaven and on earth, the visible and the invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities— all things have been created through Him and for Him.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] He is before all things, and by Him all things hold together.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] He is also the head of the body, the church; He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He might come to have first place in everything.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] For God was pleased ⌊to have⌋ all His fullness dwell in Him,

Still don't believe me, then ASK A JEWISH LAWYER.
The Triune God is not a doctrine of the OT Jews.
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
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I think it's a matter of perception. There is only one God but He shows Himself to us in 3 forms - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. The 'trinity' belief tends to separate these three into individualities, but they're not. It's like water - all water is water, but it can take 3 forms - ice, liquid, and vapor. But it's still just one single thing. So if you perceive the 'trinity' as three separate things then your perception is wrong. They are but three manifestations of one solitary Being.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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I think it's a matter of perception. There is only one God but He shows Himself to us in 3 forms - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. The 'trinity' belief tends to separate these three into individualities, but they're not. It's like water - all water is water, but it can take 3 forms - ice, liquid, and vapor. But it's still just one single thing. So if you perceive the 'trinity' as three separate things then your perception is wrong. They are but three manifestations of one solitary Being.
Nope. . it's not just a matter of perception, it's a matter of Biblical revelation.

And the Trinity are not just different forms of God.
 
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To newbirth, God is one God in three persons; You destroy so much of the scripture text, narrative, when you won't accept the natural meaning of words, you make God to be a deceitful pretender. Just a simple reading of the Bible tells us the Father and the Son are separate persons, who talk to each other, The Son is the only begotten one ,in the bosom of the Father, from all eternity to all eternity. If Jesus is not God eternal , He can not be the "only Savior" for sinners. Jesus claimed to be the eternal "I am". God is ACHAD, ONE with PLURALITY. Love to all, Hoffco
This discussion is about knowing God.....everyman does not have the knowledge ...as explained in vs 6 and 7 not what we think we know about God

1 Corinthians 8:5-7King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP]For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
[SUP]6 [/SUP]But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Howbeit there is not in every man that knowledge: for some with conscience of the idol unto this hour eat it as a thing offered unto an idol; and their conscience being weak is defiled.




John 10:30King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]30 [/SUP]I and my Father are one.



1 Corinthians 15:28
And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
 
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If we are saved by grace, why are we judged by our deeds?
"Deeds are according to the New Covenant sound doctrine knowledge, by the Help of the HOLY SPIRIT and in 'practicing', made Covenant by the Living GOD, to every 'born again' believers of LORD JESUS CHRIST."
 
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Hoffco

Guest
Sorry, I had to crash my PC to let it reboot itself, it got froze and nothing worked. It is working good now. AS, I was trying to say: God does not Change! God is eternally the same. He is the eternal NOW, the "I AM" Who never can or will never, create a Son for Himself. The "The only begotten Son" of the Father is not a created Son of God the Father, The only begotten Son is eternally begotten and eternally in the bosom of the eternal Father. This is why God is said to be love, God has always been the Father of His "only begotten Son"; If there ever was a time when there was no Son, then God would not be eternally love, or be the eternal Father. This is why we are commanded to honor the Son as we honer the Father; Because they are the same eternal God and the Holy Spirit is a part of the eternal Godhead. The eternal LORD, the "only begotten Son" of the Father, became man, Jesus who is the Christ. The LORD walked on earth, and yet, was still in Heaven as the "only begotten of Son" the Father. Jesus Christ the "same yesterday today and forever" is talking of Jesus' humanity , He is human forever, not eternally. Eternally, He is the eternally "only begotten Son" of the Father. Love Hoffco
 
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I think it's a matter of perception. There is only one God but He shows Himself to us in 3 forms - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. The 'trinity' belief tends to separate these three into individualities, but they're not. It's like water - all water is water, but it can take 3 forms - ice, liquid, and vapor. But it's still just one single thing. So if you perceive the 'trinity' as three separate things then your perception is wrong. They are but three manifestations of one solitary Being.
you forgot God is called light also...light is a manifestation of God....is it not a fourth manifestation? No one has authority to try to box in God
James 1:17
Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

Revelation 21:23
And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

1 Timothy 6:16
Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
 

RickyZ

Senior Member
Sep 20, 2012
9,635
787
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Nope. . it's not just a matter of perception, it's a matter of Biblical revelation.

And the Trinity are not just different forms of God.
Exactly, it's how you perceive revelation. And I'm not familiar with revelation that says, in form, there's more than Father Son and Holy Ghost.

you forgot God is called light also...light is a manifestation of God....is it not a fourth manifestation? No one has authority to try to box in God
James 1:17
Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

Revelation 21:23
And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

1 Timothy 6:16
Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
No, I didn't forget that. Light is among a multitude of other things that are in manifestation of God. And God can indeed never be boxed in. It's just that the discussion of the 'trinity' focuses on these three states of being. I didn't mean by omission to exclude light and all the other manifestations, for they are as many as the stars in the sky. Good point newbirth.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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And if it's not his offspring, he does not call him "Son."


The Triune God is not a doctrine of the OT Jews.
I told you the truth about the use of "SON OF" being an heirship title in Jewish Traditions. If the father {say Benjamin is his name}, thought NONE of his sons were worthy to inherit his property and possessions; the father could literally name his servant, or a neighbor, or even the mailman as his rightful HEIR. From that very moment, according to Jewish LAW, that non-family member would have the LEGAL RIGHT to use the Title: Son of Benjamin, and Traditionally even the father would introduce him by that Title. That Custom existed for many centuries prior to Christ. AND IT IS LEGAL AND BINDING if there are two or three Witnesses to the Naming of the HEIR.

John 16:15 (HCSB)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] Everything the Father has is Mine. This is why I told you that He takes from what is Mine and will declare it to you.

Here is an example:

Joseph obviously had died before Jesus was crucified. While there is no direct verse that tells us which male inherited the property of Joseph, there is strong suggestive evidence that points to JESUS as the one who inherited the property of Joseph. NO MARY COULD NOT INHERIT IT. It was illegal for any woman to own property in Israel, it had to be another male.

John 19:25-27 (KJV)
[SUP]25 [/SUP] Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his mother, and his mother's sister, Mary the wife of Cleophas, and Mary Magdalene.
[SUP]26 [/SUP] When Jesus therefore saw his mother, and the disciple standing by, whom he loved, he saith unto his mother, Woman, behold thy son!
[SUP]27 [/SUP] Then saith he to the disciple, Behold thy mother! And from that hour that disciple took her unto his own home.


That is it, that is all that was required for JESUS to pass the heirship title to the property of Joseph on to John. AND HE MADE A POINT TO SHOW US THAT THERE WERE THE LEGALLY REQUIRED TWO OR THREE WITNESSES PRESENT. Thus from that very moment, John's LEGAL TITLE, Son of Joseph gave him the LEGAL right to take over the property of Joseph, and even sell it if need be, to help support MARY. That really is the LAW in Israel.

If the father dies before he names a male heir, and the father has no sons, then the husband of one of the daughters, becomes the SON of the father in TITLE. That is exactly what happened with Mary, her father Joachim had no sons, THUS that is why Joseph's name shows up in Mary's genealogy list. Joseph became Son of Joachim by marriage, because Joachim had not named a male heir. So Joseph inherited all the property of Joachim.

And you thought studying Jewish Law was a waste of time.

OH, by the way the Trinity certainly is in the OT also, you have just blinded yourself to it.

Jeremiah 29:13 (ASV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart.

Here is the company you keep, when you deny the Deity of Jesus Christ.

Romans 1:19-22 (NKJV)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made (Jesus Christ is GOD the Creator - {Col. 1:16-19}), even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse,
[SUP]21 [/SUP] because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened.
[SUP]22 [/SUP] Professing to be wise, they became fools,
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
113
Sorry, I had to crash my PC to let it reboot itself, it got froze and nothing worked. It is working good now. AS, I was trying to say: God does not Change! God is eternally the same. He is the eternal NOW, the "I AM" Who never can or will never, create a Son for Himself. The "The only begotten Son" of the Father is not a created Son of God the Father, The only begotten Son is eternally begotten and eternally in the bosom of the eternal Father. This is why God is said to be love, God has always been the Father of His "only begotten Son"; If there ever was a time when there was no Son, then God would not be eternally love, or be the eternal Father. This is why we are commanded to honor the Son as we honer the Father; Because they are the same eternal God and the Holy Spirit is a part of the eternal Godhead. The eternal LORD, the "only begotten Son" of the Father, became man, Jesus who is the Christ. The LORD walked on earth, and yet, was still in Heaven as the "only begotten of Son" the Father. Jesus Christ the "same yesterday today and forever" is talking of Jesus' humanity , He is human forever, not eternally. Eternally, He is the eternally "only begotten Son" of the Father. Love Hoffco
Sounds like you do not have Advanced SystemCare. Even their free program does enough to prevent it from freezing up:

Advanced SystemCare Free 7/6/5/4/3 Download Review for Windows XP/Vista/7 - IObit

The best system cleaner that I have ever tried, :)

Good explanation of the Holy Triune Godhead, by the way.
 
Mar 28, 2014
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General question please,

Is that not what you just did with those verses?
No my friend ...take a closer look every verse states God is one like it or not you cannot deny that...