For not even the Son of Man knows the day of his return?

[Trailblazer]

I was talking with someone who wants to turn to Christ, but keep hitting roadblocks.
This is what came to his mind shortly after our first conversation.
Jesus is 100% God and 100% man. Why would he not know the day of his return?
He does know, so he lied?
He does not know, because he is not 100% God?

I personally think/speculate while Jesus was 100% God and 100% man. Being in the flesh. he prayed to the father for many request.
His flesh did not know the day of his return. But if he prayed to the father. The answer would have been given to him.

 

[Dan58]

Perhaps the exact day had not been decided. Only the Father knows because only the Father will decide.

 

[fredjames]

I was talking with someone who wants to turn to Christ, but keep hitting roadblocks.
This is what came to his mind shortly after our first conversation.
Jesus is 100% God and 100% man. Why would he not know the day of his return?
He does know, so he lied?
He does not know, because he is not 100% God?

I personally think/speculate while Jesus was 100% God and 100% man. Being in the flesh. he prayed to the father for many request.
His flesh did not know the day of his return. But if he prayed to the father. The answer would have been given to him.

Friend, peace be with you and be still and know HE is LORD and GOD over all of us. Today everyone in Heaven and on earth cannot go to GOD directly. Only through JESUS the MESSIAH, who have been chosen and given the authority of being GOD Himself to all. To JESUS, HE is still subjected to GOD HIS FATHER, in all GOD allow and disallow only through HIM only and none other or ever.

So GOD in SPIRIT and invisible, HIS fullness and likeness is seen only in the physical person called JESUS, whom GOD Himself proclaimed to witnesses, as HIS only begotten SON, whom HE is well pleased with only. JESUS do not live for HIS own at all like us, even while here on earth, but in submission and obedience and fully to the will of GOD His FATHER.

Just a brief example from the Biblical story of Joseph and Pharaoh in Egypt. Even though Pharaoh was the ruler of Egypt, but Joseph was the only one allowed by the Pharaoh Himself to govern/rule the whole of Egypt and even the Egyptians. Because when the Egyptians went to Pharaoh regarding a matter, the Pharaoh instructed them to go and see Joseph. And the whole of Egypt gave the same honor that they gave Pharaoh and it was a decree.

i hope this helps in your sharing and GOD is not at all like any of HIS creation, for HE is their creator. HE is without any form and invisible. HE cannot directly speak to man, because remember what happen at Mount Sinai when HE spoke to the Israelite, that they fell in fear hearing HIS voice.

So JESUS is the perfect spirit man in the fullness and likeness of GOD and HIS will, made as the only representative of GOD and as GOD, to govern/rule over all creation.

 

[Trailblazer]

Perhaps the exact day had not been decided. Only the Father knows because only the Father will decide.

With the trinity. You would think the father, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit all have the same knowledge. They are equal but maybe have different knowledge.

The guy would be upset thinking that Jesus should have worded it as,... It is not for man to know the day of my return.
He thinks he knows of other faults in the bible also.
He did mention that in the original writings. words have different meanings. Its tough not having a good solid answer for those who ask Biblical questions.

My faith and sharing has lots of testimonies. Interesting the conversation was with a man working behind the counter at a motel in Las Vegas. Another Christian man came up with a calling to share the Gospel. He did not have the answer either.
But I did point out how interesting it is for two Christian strangers to show up within minutes and speak with you about the Lord. Both with 100% faith that Jesus is who he says he is. And the Bible is 100% accurate and true.
Neither one of us had any issue with the wording on Jesus return. Was all of this a coincidence? I think not.
This conversation between us three lasted four hours in the motel lobby.

So much personal sharing of the Lord in our lives from two strangers. And your not coming to Christ because you do not like the words Jesus used? Hopefully we planted a seed with him.

 

[Trailblazer]

Friend, peace be with you and be still and know HE is LORD and GOD over all of us. Today everyone in Heaven and on earth cannot go to GOD directly. Only through JESUS the MESSIAH, who have been chosen and given the authority of being GOD Himself to all. To JESUS, HE is still subjected to GOD HIS FATHER, in all GOD allow and disallow only through HIM only and none other or ever.

So GOD in SPIRIT and invisible, HIS fullness and likeness is seen only in the physical person called JESUS, whom GOD Himself proclaimed to witnesses, as HIS only begotten SON, whom HE is well pleased with only. JESUS do not live for HIS own at all like us, even while here on earth, but in submission and obedience and fully to the will of GOD His FATHER.

Just a brief example from the Biblical story of Joseph and Pharaoh in Egypt. Even though Pharaoh was the ruler of Egypt, but Joseph was the only one allowed by the Pharaoh Himself to govern/rule the whole of Egypt and even the Egyptians. Because when the Egyptians went to Pharaoh regarding a matter, the Pharaoh instructed them to go and see Joseph. And the whole of Egypt gave the same honor that they gave Pharaoh and it was a decree.

i hope this helps in your sharing and GOD is not at all like any of HIS creation, for HE is their creator. HE is without any form and invisible. HE cannot directly speak to man, because remember what happen at Mount Sinai when HE spoke to the Israelite, that they fell in fear hearing HIS voice.

So JESUS is the perfect spirit man in the fullness and likeness of GOD and HIS will, made as the only representative of GOD and as GOD, to govern/rule over all creation.

Nice response.
I know that Jesus is not any sort of his creation. The Angel Gabriel giving the Virgin Mary what was to come proves that.
I could not answer when someone asked me why God did not know the day of his own return. When a non Christian is struggling with this passage. He wants to be a believer. Then Jesus lied, or the the Bible is not accurate and truthful come to his mind. One really wants to be helpful and have a good answer for them.

This does lead to some speculation on the Trinity. Separate yet One ? They all three are egual. But maybe they decided its the fathers decision of when Jesus returns. So this information was not given by the father to Jesus when he walked the earth. This seems like a fair answer to give in the future. Example!.. If you had three 4 star generals in one room.
All three are equal in power. yet they have different knowledge and personality.

 

[Mem]

Suppose it has something to do with all those the Father has given to the Son of which none can snatch away. That may be something the Father knows, having given them, and the Son might not know, having yet to receive that last one, afterwhich receiving, He will then know He is full, and the books will be completed

 

[fredjames]

Nice response.
I know that Jesus is not any sort of his creation. The Angel Gabriel giving the Virgin Mary what was to come proves that.
I could not answer when someone asked me why God did not know the day of his own return. When a non Christian is struggling with this passage. He wants to be a believer. Then Jesus lied, or the the Bible is not accurate and truthful come to his mind. One really wants to be helpful and have a good answer for them.

This does lead to some speculation on the Trinity. Separate yet One ? They all three are egual. But maybe they decided its the fathers decision of when Jesus returns. So this information was not given by the father to Jesus when he walked the earth. This seems like a fair answer to give in the future. Example!.. If you had three 4 star generals in one room.
All three are equal in power. yet they have different knowledge and personality.

Dearly beloved, blessed infant in the Kingdom of GOD, JESUS was truly flesh and blood, same like any man but fully, inwardly HIS body, spirit and soul were Spiritual and was obedient and was only to the will of GOD, here on earth. That's why in the beginning chapter of the epistle to the Hebrews, GOD Himself say to HIS SON and not even to any other the angels, that;

"You are God."

As a spirit man towards only to the things of Heaven, the will of GOD the FATHER here on earth, had no friendship nor relationship to the pattern of this world of carnal/fleshly men, enslaved in sins. JESUS's birth was as i believe, similar to the Isaac's birth, when Abraham was 100 years old and Sarah was 96, they were given a promised child and as similar to a promised MESSIAH. According to the flesh, JESUS is referred as the SON of man, meaning = SON of GOD came from man, from the line of David, that is Joseph HIS man father, engaged to virgin Mary, in order to fulfill GOD's prophecy for man.

In 1 Corinthians chapter 15, JESUS is referred to as the second Adam born of flesh and blood and of the SPIRIT/spirit and is the spirit man and Spiritual. Unlike the first Adam, born of flesh and blood and is the carnal/fleshly fashioned man, chose to live to the necessities and pleasures of this. That is why man, the first Adam and all the other man came from and after him, even those who were still with GOD in Israel, could not understand GOD even through HIS Old Covenant and also fulfill HIS requirement, those who were created in HIS image, due to the bondage of 'lawlessness' and lawlessness is 'sin'.

So JESUS is the ordinary flesh and blood and inwardly the new spirit man, created also in the image of GOD, but in 'GOD's fullness and likeness', not turning to the left or right like us, but understood everything and fulfilled and accomplished everything, as GOD and for GOD, that JESUS is not wrong to call GOD, His FATHER and with GOD, the HOLY SPIRIT, for fellow man in bondage to the pattern of this world of satan and liberate them and be reconciled with GOD, the FATHER, sanctify/set apart for now in the Kingdom of GOD, here on earth, under the New Covenant/Testament teachings written in the HOLY BIBLE, taught by the Teacher the HOLY SPIRIT, in order to 'abide' in JESUS's words and love and be fruitful.

You are not alone because i was like you struggling to explain to others but the HOLY SPIRIT has taught me only in revelation from the Holy Scripture, what i needed to know and am able to share in service to you. Sometimes the Gentiles ignorantly like to test us, asking a lot of questions that deviate from initial discussion. JESUS did not answer every question that were thrown onto HIM but HE was wise to know their hearts and throw to them accordingly for them to repent first from hypocrisy.

i hope the Helper/Comforter, the HOLY SPIRIT have broaden your spiritual understanding in the sharing. Ask HIM for guidance and continue with HIM HOLY BIBLE reading and witnessing.

Thank you, be blessed in the name of LORD JESUS CHRIST, in GOD's kindness and peace

 

[dcontroversal]

Well Jesus disrobed himself of the Glory HE had with the Father before the casting down of the world.....Jesus was somewhat limited by his flesh when He walked the earth and the Key to that statement is...The SON of MAN!

As God he knows all things so....Jesus did not know at that time!

 

[GodIsSalvation]

Jesus doesn't need to know the day of his return if the Father knows for as Jesus does the will of the Father as his only begotten Son then he need only to do what the Father says when he says so.

 

[john832]

Perhaps the exact day had not been decided. Only the Father knows because only the Father will decide.

That is a particularly cogent thought.

There is another passage that seems to indicate that God has not decided something yet...

Rev 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

Now let's think about this for a moment. More intelligent people than me have speculated that by the time of the Great White Throne Judgment, there could possibly be as many as 100 billion (with a 'b') people in this general resurrection. Is that a number that no man can count? That has to be a larger number than the multitude in Rev 7. I would probably tire of it rather quickly but I do have the ability to count into the trillions and so do you.

This brings us to the line of thinking that the reason no one can number this group of people is because the number isn't fixed yet. Same for the day and the hour. Who has control over all events?

Mat 24:36 "But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only.

The Father has reserved unto Himself the times and seasons...

Act 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

 

[Trailblazer]

Dearly beloved, blessed infant in the Kingdom of GOD, JESUS was truly flesh and blood, same like any man but fully, inwardly HIS body, spirit and soul were Spiritual and was obedient and was only to the will of GOD, here on earth. That's why in the beginning chapter of the epistle to the Hebrews, GOD Himself say to HIS SON and not even to any other the angels, that;

"You are God."

As a spirit man towards only to the things of Heaven, the will of GOD the FATHER here on earth, had no friendship nor relationship to the pattern of this world of carnal/fleshly men, enslaved in sins. JESUS's birth was as i believe, similar to the Isaac's birth, when Abraham was 100 years old and Sarah was 96, they were given a promised child and as similar to a promised MESSIAH. According to the flesh, JESUS is referred as the SON of man, meaning = SON of GOD came from man, from the line of David, that is Joseph HIS man father, engaged to virgin Mary, in order to fulfill GOD's prophecy for man.

In 1 Corinthians chapter 15, JESUS is referred to as the second Adam born of flesh and blood and of the SPIRIT/spirit and is the spirit man and Spiritual. Unlike the first Adam, born of flesh and blood and is the carnal/fleshly fashioned man, chose to live to the necessities and pleasures of this. That is why man, the first Adam and all the other man came from and after him, even those who were still with GOD in Israel, could not understand GOD even through HIS Old Covenant and also fulfill HIS requirement, those who were created in HIS image, due to the bondage of 'lawlessness' and lawlessness is 'sin'.

So JESUS is the ordinary flesh and blood and inwardly the new spirit man, created also in the image of GOD, but in 'GOD's fullness and likeness', not turning to the left or right like us, but understood everything and fulfilled and accomplished everything, as GOD and for GOD, that JESUS is not wrong to call GOD, His FATHER and with GOD, the HOLY SPIRIT, for fellow man in bondage to the pattern of this world of satan and liberate them and be reconciled with GOD, the FATHER, sanctify/set apart for now in the Kingdom of GOD, here on earth, under the New Covenant/Testament teachings written in the HOLY BIBLE, taught by the Teacher the HOLY SPIRIT, in order to 'abide' in JESUS's words and love and be fruitful.

You are not alone because i was like you struggling to explain to others but the HOLY SPIRIT has taught me only in revelation from the Holy Scripture, what i needed to know and am able to share in service to you. Sometimes the Gentiles ignorantly like to test us, asking a lot of questions that deviate from initial discussion. JESUS did not answer every question that were thrown onto HIM but HE was wise to know their hearts and throw to them accordingly for them to repent first from hypocrisy.

i hope the Helper/Comforter, the HOLY SPIRIT have broaden your spiritual understanding in the sharing. Ask HIM for guidance and continue with HIM HOLY BIBLE reading and witnessing.

Thank you, be blessed in the name of LORD JESUS CHRIST, in GOD's kindness and peace

I am struggling to explain about God ? I think not.
Broaden my Spiritual understanding? I am awestruck of the Spiritual events that have taken place in my life. Even the ones with massive emotional hurt. For they can all be backed up with what the Bible teaches. This is more then faith alone to share with others that the Bible is true. That Jesus, the Angels, good and bad, and Jesus adversary are very much at work still today.

I may have been tested by this Man/Gentile? He wants to believe. He just wanted a good honest explanation why God did not know the day of his own return. Thats a fair question.

I have been tested before with a self proclaimed intellectual agnostic who enjoys rattling Christians cages.
This Agnostic and I had a xlnt three hour conversation even after I was up all night driving. He said that I was the only Christian that he had ever met that answered his questions, did not get angry or frustrated with him and storm off bent out of shape.

I actually had fun standing my ground with faith, Getting the word out. Knowing that God is real and has been with me for many years now. I truly enjoyed answering all of the Agnostics questions, as he was also making statements like,... Terrorist are freedom fighters, Christians and Muslims read from the same Bible. therefore believe and follow the same God.

When I see the Gentile again. My answer will be. The son of man is the flesh/man part of Jesus. That is what Jesus was referring to when he said. Not even the son of man knows the day of his return.

dccontroversal,
That is basically the answer that you give. Thanks!

 

[Trailblazer]

That is a particularly cogent thought.

There is another passage that seems to indicate that God has not decided something yet...

Rev 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

Now let's think about this for a moment. More intelligent people than me have speculated that by the time of the Great White Throne Judgment, there could possibly be as many as 100 billion (with a 'b') people in this general resurrection. Is that a number that no man can count? That has to be a larger number than the multitude in Rev 7. I would probably tire of it rather quickly but I do have the ability to count into the trillions and so do you.

This brings us to the line of thinking that the reason no one can number this group of people is because the number isn't fixed yet. Same for the day and the hour. Who has control over all events?

Mat 24:36 "But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only.

The Father has reserved unto Himself the times and seasons...

Act 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

ACT 1:7 I really think that is the answer per scripture. The father hath put in his own power. Sure sounds to me like the father is keeping this one to himself.

Matthew 24:36 also shows that there are things that only the father knows. Very good. Thanks a bunch.

 

[Trailblazer]

That works for us believers.
The discussion with the non believer went as follows!... Jesus is God. So he knows all things. So Jesus lied?
What not did Jesus Say, ..Only the father knows the day of my return? The non believer was not being argumentative.
He was seeking solid correct biblical answers.

What is interesting. I came into the Motel lobby with a sandwich that I needed to put it in the fridge. We had a 15 min talk before I headed upstairs. Think my sandwich spoiled. :-(
I then came back down to the lobby to speak with him again after a few mins. He then said that Jesus not knowing of his 2nd coming issue only came to his mind while I was gone. He went on to say, every time that he almost believes. Something comes to his mind that gives him some doubt.

 

[JesusLives]

If we ask God to give us the Holy Spirit and to help us in situations like this He will.

I have always looked at our job as seed planters or watering seeds as we can share and teach. We are not to judge and condemn those are not our jobs and it is the Holy Spirits job to convict and convince of sin.

Taking the time with these people and not judging them will have an impact on them at some point as you have given them a point of reference to compare with another Christian and the way situations are handled. They will remember your kindness above the self-righteous ones and God can give them a nudge in these thought and cause them to resurface in God's timing not ours.

Thank you for giving your time and effort to these people with questions - keep planting and watering seeds.

 

[fredjames]

I am struggling to explain about God ? I think not.
Broaden my Spiritual understanding? I am awestruck of the Spiritual events that have taken place in my life. Even the ones with massive emotional hurt. For they can all be backed up with what the Bible teaches. This is more then faith alone to share with others that the Bible is true. That Jesus, the Angels, good and bad, and Jesus adversary are very much at work still today.

I may have been tested by this Man/Gentile? He wants to believe. He just wanted a good honest explanation why God did not know the day of his own return. Thats a fair question.

I have been tested before with a self proclaimed intellectual agnostic who enjoys rattling Christians cages.
This Agnostic and I had a xlnt three hour conversation even after I was up all night driving. He said that I was the only Christian that he had ever met that answered his questions, did not get angry or frustrated with him and storm off bent out of shape.

I actually had fun standing my ground with faith, Getting the word out. Knowing that God is real and has been with me for many years now. I truly enjoyed answering all of the Agnostics questions, as he was also making statements like,... Terrorist are freedom fighters, Christians and Muslims read from the same Bible. therefore believe and follow the same God.

When I see the Gentile again. My answer will be. The son of man is the flesh/man part of Jesus. That is what Jesus was referring to when he said. Not even the son of man knows the day of his return.

dccontroversal,
That is basically the answer that you give. Thanks!

Please read my HOLY SPIRIT guided written in the New Covenant reply again and ask for guidance and pray that you may by the will of GOD to honor CHRIST, explain to the lost soul, in details which is given to you and others and do not cut short, as a faithful servant.

You are a disciple of CHRIST and you did not have an answer to such question and we gave them to you. Please do not make the mistakes like disciple Peter did, in the beginning for CHRIST. He has left with us a lesson to learn. i am not at all interested about you ministry for CHRIST but the lack of Spiritual Knowledge of the Kingdom of GOD, written in the HOLY BIBLE. You even confess that, JESUS lied then HE is GOD.

Repent and honor the LORD JESUS CHRIST, by taking HIS given message to you in full and understand them patiently first. And then minister onto the Gentiles in full.