Whoever cares to answer

[tonto]

If we are saved by grace, why are we judged by our deeds?

I assume you are speaking of Christians here? Christians are judged by their deeds in order to obtain their rewards. The hay, wood, and stubble will be burned away leaving the deeds of gold, silver, and precious stones. We must do good works in order for our works of gold, silver, and precious stones to outweigh our deeds of hay, wood, and stubble.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

If we are saved by grace, why are we judged by our deeds?

salvation then sanctification

 

[seed_time_harvest]

And the good works/deeds are spiritual and in truth

 

[VCO]

I assume you are speaking of Christians here? Christians are judged by their deeds in order to obtain their rewards. The hay, wood, and stubble will be burned away leaving the deeds of gold, silver, and precious stones. We must do good works in order for our works of gold, silver, and precious stones to outweigh our deeds of hay, wood, and stubble.

Yes our deeds are judged to see if we are worthy of rewards and crowns. The laurel wreath crowns we get to cast at the Feet of JESUS, saying, "I won this for you my King."; just like in the Olympic Style of Games of Paul's day.

 

[newbirth]

You have some very good wise scriptures that you go by. When you go to the Lord for cleansing from sin, you accept that as making you, like the old Hymn says, white as snow.

However, you are missing some of scripture that also apply. We are born in sin, meaning that we are born with a sinful nature. As long as we are in this body of flesh, there are desires of the flesh within us. Romans 7 still does apply, we are of the flesh.

There are two ways of handling this. One is to throw our hands in the air and say I just won't try to be sinless because I am never going to make it. That is giving up on Christ, for Christ does cleanse us and forgives us and we are the same as perfect even though we aren't. The other is to say that being Christ has forgiven me and make me clean, I am perfect. You are forgiven, you are accepted the same as a person not of the flesh, but you are in the flesh and you still need to strive for complete oneness with God every minute.

well you were supposed to be born again...and if you are born of the spirit you should not fulfil the lust of the flesh....

Galatians 5:15-23King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP]But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
[SUP]20 [/SUP]Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
[SUP]21 [/SUP]Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

[SUP]22 [/SUP]But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
[SUP]23 [/SUP]Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

 

[newbirth]

In 1 Pet. 4:8 in the modern translations it says LOVE will cover a multitude of sins. THAT MEANS THEY WERE NOT PURGED FROM THE FLESH, you will STILL HAVE THAT SIN NATURE THAT YOU INHERITED FROM ADAM.

You do know that a bad thought, even for an instant, is the SAME AS DOING THE DEED of SIN in God's eyes, don't you?

You just confess flesh is still ruling you VCO ... you inherited nothing from Christ....

 

[newbirth]

READ the rest of the CONTEXT:

1 John 1:8-10 (ESV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
[SUP]9 [/SUP] If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

does it change the meaning of vs 7? it strengthens the point...in vs 9....you are trying to tell me that God does not forgive us our sins and cleans us of all unrighteousness....and you believe ....Dr. John MacArthur....instead ....God does not say sin less...he says sin no more....and that must be your attitude....

 

[Elin]

while I understand what you are saying.....
the power of that scripture is in vs 9...so we do not allow sin to dwell ( make it's home) in us

The truth is in all of it, 1Jn 1:8-10, one no more true than another.

 

[Elin]

when God says your sins are forgiven .....is he saying you are still in sins?...

When God says in 1Jn 1:8-10 that if we say we do not sin we are liars, is he saying we do not sin?

Your setting the Scriptures against themselves shows you do not understand them correctly.

 

[Elin]

The man says he was rescued from that way in vs 25....he now controls the flesh by being a servant of God...
1 Corinthians 9:26-27Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
[SUP]26 [/SUP]Therefore I do not run like one who runs aimlessly or box like one beating the air. [SUP]27 [/SUP]Instead, I discipline my body and bring it under strict control, so that after preaching to others, I myself will not be disqualified.

And God says we still sin (1Jn 1:8-10).

 

[Elin]

Quote: word of God....
1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

I choose the word of God over ... Dr. John MacArthur

And I choose the word of God in 1Jn 1:8-10 over newbirth.

 

[newbirth]

The truth is in all of it, 1Jn 1:8-10, one no more true than another.

not agreeing.... yet not disagreeing....but responding just to show disapproval....if you don't like what I stated just say so

 

[Elin]

You just confess flesh is still ruling you VCO ... you inherited nothing from Christ....

Tell it to God, he is the one who says in his word that we sin (1Jn 1:8-10).

 

[newbirth]

And I choose the word of God in 1Jn 1:8-10 over newbirth.

newbirth did not write ...1 John 1:7 that is also the word of God...so you simply chose the word of God over the word of God...I think they call it wrestling with the word....

 

[Elin]

does it change the meaning of vs 7? it strengthens the point...in vs 9....you are trying to tell me that God does not forgive us our sins and cleans us of all unrighteousness....and you believe ....Dr. John MacArthur....instead ....God does not say sin less...he says sin no more....and that must be your attitude....

And we still sin (1Jn 1:8-10).

 

[Elin]

newbirth did not write ...1 John 1:7 that is also the word of God...so
you simply chose the word of God over the word of God...I think they call it wrestling with the word....

Your setting the word of God against itself in 1Jn 1:7-10 is ipso facto proof that you do not understand it correctly.

 

[newbirth]

Tell it to God, he is the one who says in his word that we sin (1Jn 1:8-10).

well.... we all know that..... but there are those who don't know, he also cleanses us from sins......but they quote the scripture repeatedly.....1 John 1:8-10Names of God Bible (NOG)
[SUP]8 [/SUP]If we say, “We aren’t sinful” we are deceiving ourselves, and the truth is not in us. [SUP]9 [/SUP]God is faithful and reliable. If we confess our sins, he forgives them and cleanses us from everything we’ve done wrong. [SUP]10 [/SUP]If we say, “We have never sinned,” we turn God into a liar and his Word is not in us.

 

[newbirth]

And we still sin (1Jn 1:8-10).

but you seem to be comfortable in it because the scripture says .....
1 John 2:1
My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:

 

[newbirth]

Your setting the word of God against itself in 1Jn 1:7-10 is ipso facto proof that you do not understand it correctly.

So you are saying this verse is not a fact in itself....what part of scripture does this verse contradict or needs to explained?
1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

Ephesians 5:8-12King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP]For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
[SUP]9 [/SUP](For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth
[SUP]10 [/SUP]Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret.

 

[VCO]

So you are saying this verse is not a fact in itself....what part of scripture does this verse contradict or needs to explained?
1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

Ephesians 5:8-12King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP]For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
[SUP]9 [/SUP](For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth
[SUP]10 [/SUP]Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret.

My how you like to take a verse out of the context and ignore the rest:

Paul goes on to tell us about the rebellion that is in the human heart. He says, "...the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be" (Rom. 8:7). We are living in a world today that is in rebellion against almighty God. God is holy. I am a sinner. I am saved by grace, yes, but how am I going to have fellowship with Him? How am I going to walk with Him? Men have attempted to do this in three different ways which are presented here, and two of those ways are wrong.

False Doctrine of trying to Reduce God To Man's Level? (1:6-7)

The first method is to bring God down to the level of man.
If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth [1John 1:6].

"If we say that we have fellowship with him" -- there are a lot of folk claiming to have fellowship with Him when they do not in reality at all.


"We lie, and do not the truth." Do you understand what John says in this verse? He is rather blunt, don't you think so? He says that we lie. It is not a nice thing to call another man a liar. John says that if you say that you have fellowship with God and you walk in darkness -- that is, in sin -- you are lying.

. . .

Noticing that the cleansing of the blood depends upon our walking in the light, he read it as though it said, "If we walk according to the light, the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanseth us from all sin." He thought it meant that if he was very punctilious about obeying every command of God, God would cleanse him. Then he noticed that it does not say if we walk according to light, but if we walk in the light. The important thing is where we walk, not how we walk. Have we come into the presence of God and allowed the Word of God to shine upon our sinful hearts? You see, it is possible to walk in darkness, thinking you are all right.

. . .


Confess Sin (1:8-10)

Another method which is often used is an attempt to bring man up to God's level. They say that man has reached sinless perfection and that he is living on that very high plateau. Well, John deals with that approach. Listen to him --
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us [1John 1:8].

This is even worse than being a liar. When you get to the place where you say you have no sin in your life, there is no truth in you at all. This doesn't mean you are simply a liar; it means you don't even have the truth. You are deceiving yourself. You don't deceive anyone else. You deceive only yourself.

. . .


My friend, if you feel that you have reached the state of perfection, I really feel sorry for your spouse because it is hard to live with someone who thinks he is perfect. John says, "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us." We cannot bring ourselves up to God's level. It is impossible to reach perfection in this life.
. . .
Thru The Bible with J. Vernon McGee.