I don't think the Two Witnesses are here just yet, but very soon will God send them to testify. There are two mortals written of in the scriptures whom were both great believers of God and whom were taken from off the earth up to the heavens without yet dying the first death. So it would seem obvious to me whom the Two Witnesses could be.
The Two Witnesses Were Already Here
- Thread starter GreatisHisGlory
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
I did read it. One witness represents House of Judah (Gentile) and the other House of Israel (Jewish). Similarly, the two witnesses have been identified as Israel and the Christian Church. Read the King James Version since it is described as the most accurate translated version.
Original Manuscripts
According to Codex Alexandrinus (A), Codex Vaticanus, Codex Ephraemi (C), as the oldest manuscripts, as well as early church theologians such as Arethas of Caesarea, the original Greek text of Revelation 11:8 uses the word 'body' instead of 'bodies', whereas later the text switches back to using the plural form 'bodies' in verse 9. The plural v. singular ambiguity is reinforced in Rev. 11:5 where the original Greek text of the oldest manuscripts uses the term 'mouth' in the singular instead of 'mouths' in the plural. Therefore verse 11:5 reads: "If any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies," and verse 11:8 reads "And their dead body shall lie in the street of the great city." Some authors have suggested that this grammar is the strongest clue to identifying who this end time prophets.
The text requires that the "two" witnesses have one common i.e. shared mouth, and one shared body, and therefore "they" have to be a single person. However, others have suggested to use the scriptural definition of the meaning of one body from Genesis 2:24, where a husband and a wife are united to form one flesh. In Mark 10:8 Jesus emphasizes that after marriage a husband and a wife "are no longer two, but one flesh." There are many Bible readers and theologians who share this view, and they have pointed out that this fact of the possibility of an end-time female prophet should be allowed to surface to greater public awareness. Now that I have explained in greater depth, [FONT="]Elijah, Enoch, and Moses ascended… the beast that comes up from the Abyss will attack them, and overpower and kill them. “Rev. 11:7 these great Prophets will not descend to be martyred. Also so you know”…clothed in sackcloth” Rev. 11:3 is figurative because they are mourning since they know what is in the immediate future (presently happening now-future). Also, "Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom." Matthew 16:28– For those that believe “For each life there must be a death” and that there is no rapture, there is in fact a rapture so be ready.
[/FONT]
Original Manuscripts
According to Codex Alexandrinus (A), Codex Vaticanus, Codex Ephraemi (C), as the oldest manuscripts, as well as early church theologians such as Arethas of Caesarea, the original Greek text of Revelation 11:8 uses the word 'body' instead of 'bodies', whereas later the text switches back to using the plural form 'bodies' in verse 9. The plural v. singular ambiguity is reinforced in Rev. 11:5 where the original Greek text of the oldest manuscripts uses the term 'mouth' in the singular instead of 'mouths' in the plural. Therefore verse 11:5 reads: "If any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies," and verse 11:8 reads "And their dead body shall lie in the street of the great city." Some authors have suggested that this grammar is the strongest clue to identifying who this end time prophets.
The text requires that the "two" witnesses have one common i.e. shared mouth, and one shared body, and therefore "they" have to be a single person. However, others have suggested to use the scriptural definition of the meaning of one body from Genesis 2:24, where a husband and a wife are united to form one flesh. In Mark 10:8 Jesus emphasizes that after marriage a husband and a wife "are no longer two, but one flesh." There are many Bible readers and theologians who share this view, and they have pointed out that this fact of the possibility of an end-time female prophet should be allowed to surface to greater public awareness. Now that I have explained in greater depth, [FONT="]Elijah, Enoch, and Moses ascended… the beast that comes up from the Abyss will attack them, and overpower and kill them. “Rev. 11:7 these great Prophets will not descend to be martyred. Also so you know”…clothed in sackcloth” Rev. 11:3 is figurative because they are mourning since they know what is in the immediate future (presently happening now-future). Also, "Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom." Matthew 16:28– For those that believe “For each life there must be a death” and that there is no rapture, there is in fact a rapture so be ready.
[/FONT]
Minus the greater detail, I share with you what I know (providence). Please believe what I share with you. I cannot stress this enough as the time of deception is now, so you must be on your guard. "For there is nothing hidden that will not be disclosed, and nothing concealed that will not be known or brought out into the open. Luke 8:17" I don't think it is relevant but so you know, the House of Israel is represented by the prophetess.
Peace be with you,
Albert Mascheroni
Peace be with you,
Albert Mascheroni
2 witnesses = OT and NT. "On the exact date of November 10, 1793, the French National Assembly decreed in Paris that the Christian religion should be abolished, and the Bible suppressed at all costs."
source:The Two Witnesses defined
The two witnesses/prophets are here now. Both were unsuspecting that they were going to be chosen to be witnesses and both feel that they are equally unworthy for the task. Both are currently mourning about what is to come. They wake up daily horrified with this knowledge of the upcoming events. I highly suspect moreover sure, that they are currently doing what they can to warn the unsuspecting people (believers, unbelievers, Gentile & Jew) that the end time is in fact now, before they are given their powers.
"26Just as it was in the days of Noah, so also will it be in the days of the Son of Man. 27People were eating, drinking, marrying and being given in marriage up to the day Noah entered the ark. Then the flood came and destroyed them all.
It was the same in the days of Lot. People were eating and drinking, buying and selling, planting and building.
Luke 17:26"
Again, please follow me on https://www.facebook.com/al.masch.50, and use your own gifts to help the cause. "Each of you should use whatever gift you have received to serve others, as faithful stewards of God's grace in its various forms."
1 Peter 4:10
"26Just as it was in the days of Noah, so also will it be in the days of the Son of Man. 27People were eating, drinking, marrying and being given in marriage up to the day Noah entered the ark. Then the flood came and destroyed them all.
It was the same in the days of Lot. People were eating and drinking, buying and selling, planting and building.
Luke 17:26"
Again, please follow me on https://www.facebook.com/al.masch.50, and use your own gifts to help the cause. "Each of you should use whatever gift you have received to serve others, as faithful stewards of God's grace in its various forms."
1 Peter 4:10
So, according to your way of interpretation, the following would be literal as well.
Revelation 12:13-15 "And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child. And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent. And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood."
I will stick with letting the Bible do the interpreting.
God Bless
Revelation 12:13-15 "And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child. And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent. And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood."
I will stick with letting the Bible do the interpreting.
God Bless
K
1 Thessalonians chap 4. We are the salt of the Earth and have the comforter. The church is the witness, once removed, then the two witnesses.
I am not going to write a book tonight as that is what it would take to show what will happen.
The two witnesses in my opinion are Elijah and Enoch as these are the only two men in the bible that did not die. Power is given them that if any man should try to harm them they are consumed in fire. Then they will be killed as it is given unto man once to die. I don't see that happening at present.
And so on and so on.
I am not going to write a book tonight as that is what it would take to show what will happen.
The two witnesses in my opinion are Elijah and Enoch as these are the only two men in the bible that did not die. Power is given them that if any man should try to harm them they are consumed in fire. Then they will be killed as it is given unto man once to die. I don't see that happening at present.
And so on and so on.
But Elijah has already come according to Jesus ?
Matthew 17:12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.
Matthew 17:13 Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.
Matthew 17:12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.
Matthew 17:13 Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.
E
(speaking of the two witnesses) ARE the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.”
Romans 11:17-25 and read,
“And if some of the branches be broken off, and YOU, being a WILD OLIVE TREE, and were grafted in among them, and with them are partakers of the root and fatness of THE OLIVE TREE:
Boast not against the branches. But if you boast, you bear not the root, but the root you.
You will say then, The branches were broken off, that I may be grafted in.
Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Be not high minded, but fear:
For if God spared not the NATURAL BRANCHES, take heed that he spare not you.
Behold therefore the goodness and the severity of God n which them which fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, IF you CONTINUE in his goodness: otherwise you also shall be cut off.
And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in; for God is able to graft them in again.
For if it were cut out of the OLIVE TREE which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a good OLIVE TREE; how much more shall these, which be the natural branches be grafted into their own olive tree?
For I would not, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to ISRAEL, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.”
Romans 11:17-25 and read,
“And if some of the branches be broken off, and YOU, being a WILD OLIVE TREE, and were grafted in among them, and with them are partakers of the root and fatness of THE OLIVE TREE:
Boast not against the branches. But if you boast, you bear not the root, but the root you.
You will say then, The branches were broken off, that I may be grafted in.
Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Be not high minded, but fear:
For if God spared not the NATURAL BRANCHES, take heed that he spare not you.
Behold therefore the goodness and the severity of God n which them which fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, IF you CONTINUE in his goodness: otherwise you also shall be cut off.
And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in; for God is able to graft them in again.
For if it were cut out of the OLIVE TREE which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a good OLIVE TREE; how much more shall these, which be the natural branches be grafted into their own olive tree?
For I would not, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to ISRAEL, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.”
E
That is where the problem is. Opinions are what has created the thousands of theories and mass confusion in Christianity today. Allow the Bible and history to interpret, and your opinion then becomes fact. It is easy and fun 
God Bless
God Bless
the TWO OLIVE trees, which ARE the TWO WITNESSES are in fact two GROUPS of people rather than just two individual people
The TWO GROUPS of people who are the ONLY TWO WITNESSES in all the earth who stand for the only true and wise God ARE , the true believers in Christ Jesus the Son of God, otherwise know as Christians or formally known as the WILD OLIVE TREE;
the other witness standing before the one true God is ISRAEL, which is the NATURAL OLIVE TREE.
So the TWO different GROUPS of people who stand for the God of the earth, and it is these TWO GROUPS who are the TWO WITNESSES spoke of in the book of Revelation.
these TWO GROUPS, the Jews, who believe in Almighty God the Father, and the Christians, those who believe in Jesus, the Son of God as their savior all through the book of Revelation as well as the rest of the word of God.
Hello Sola,
Your comparison is in error, as you are comparing what is literal with symbolism. The two witnesses are two actual men, just as scripture states that they are. They will prophecy for 1,260, that is, during the first 3 1/2 years of that seven year period. On the other hand, the dragon with seven heads and ten horns is obvious symbolism, just as is the woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and wearing a crown of twelve stars.
The best way to read the book of Revelation is to take it at face value, that is, if the literal sense makes good sense, then don't seek any other sense. One of the biggest problems for expositors interpreting the book of Revelation is that many go in applying symbolism to everything and thereby distort the meaning that God is conveying. Therefore, one should read it as being literal until symbolism or metaphors become obvious.
Your comparison is in error, as you are comparing what is literal with symbolism. The two witnesses are two actual men, just as scripture states that they are. They will prophecy for 1,260, that is, during the first 3 1/2 years of that seven year period. On the other hand, the dragon with seven heads and ten horns is obvious symbolism, just as is the woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and wearing a crown of twelve stars.
The best way to read the book of Revelation is to take it at face value, that is, if the literal sense makes good sense, then don't seek any other sense. One of the biggest problems for expositors interpreting the book of Revelation is that many go in applying symbolism to everything and thereby distort the meaning that God is conveying. Therefore, one should read it as being literal until symbolism or metaphors become obvious.
Hello albert,
The word "Martus" translated "Witnesses" is in the masculine and is plural and therefore are two males. Personally, I believe that the best candidates for these two witnesses are Elijah and Enoch, who were both taken by God and who have never died and are therefore those who are represented as the two olive branches and two lamp stands before Lord. This is my personal belief of who the two witnesses will be. That being said, though they will be literal men, God will have endued them with power, since they will be able to bring every kind of plague upon the earth and as many times as they want to. Also, the reference to them killing their enemies with fire proceeding from their mouths should be taken literally. It is not until that beast, that angel of the Abyss, who is let out at the sounding of the 5th trumpet, that he kills the two witnesses. That these two are literal men is obvious also in that, scripture states that their bodies are not allowed to be buried and are left in the streets of Jerusalem for 3 1/2 days while the world looks on and celebrates and sends gifts back and forth, because these two witnesses who were bringing these plagues will have been killed.
The word "Martus" translated "Witnesses" is in the masculine and is plural and therefore are two males. Personally, I believe that the best candidates for these two witnesses are Elijah and Enoch, who were both taken by God and who have never died and are therefore those who are represented as the two olive branches and two lamp stands before Lord. This is my personal belief of who the two witnesses will be. That being said, though they will be literal men, God will have endued them with power, since they will be able to bring every kind of plague upon the earth and as many times as they want to. Also, the reference to them killing their enemies with fire proceeding from their mouths should be taken literally. It is not until that beast, that angel of the Abyss, who is let out at the sounding of the 5th trumpet, that he kills the two witnesses. That these two are literal men is obvious also in that, scripture states that their bodies are not allowed to be buried and are left in the streets of Jerusalem for 3 1/2 days while the world looks on and celebrates and sends gifts back and forth, because these two witnesses who were bringing these plagues will have been killed.
Hi birdie,
Again, what you are you doing is comparing the ten virgins, which is an obvious parable, with the two witnesses, which is meant to be literal, that is, they are two literal men that will show up during the time of God's wrath and will be given power by God to bring every kind of judgment as often as they want, and that is in addition to the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments. There is nothing in the context regarding the two witnesses that would infer symbolism, but is simply implied by expositors.
Again, what you are you doing is comparing the ten virgins, which is an obvious parable, with the two witnesses, which is meant to be literal, that is, they are two literal men that will show up during the time of God's wrath and will be given power by God to bring every kind of judgment as often as they want, and that is in addition to the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments. There is nothing in the context regarding the two witnesses that would infer symbolism, but is simply implied by expositors.
F
I just wrote a full page but it didn't go through.
So to the point. The key is in Zechariah 4. it took a little more to unlock the true meaning of it. Look at Zechariah 3:8 it states Joshua and the friends before him are a sign, symbol (of things to come). Joshua symbolizes the Branch (Christ). That can be shown, but the focus is on the witness. Remember there are other friends in front of Joshua that are a sign (of things to come), Zerubbabel is there. 3 verses later with the same encounter, with the same angel, and the same prophet is roused from a sleep like state. He awakens to a vision of a lampstand with several other objects. That vision of objects is the Word of the Lord to Zerubbabel. It has NOTHING to do with the second temple era and NOTHING to do with the Zerubbabel of that era. This is Gods message to the one whom He calls Zerubbabel. He is a sign or a symbol of the witness. NOTHING in Zechariah 4 has anything to do with the second temple era. I explained some of it but it got erased maybe I can explain it later.
So to the point. The key is in Zechariah 4. it took a little more to unlock the true meaning of it. Look at Zechariah 3:8 it states Joshua and the friends before him are a sign, symbol (of things to come). Joshua symbolizes the Branch (Christ). That can be shown, but the focus is on the witness. Remember there are other friends in front of Joshua that are a sign (of things to come), Zerubbabel is there. 3 verses later with the same encounter, with the same angel, and the same prophet is roused from a sleep like state. He awakens to a vision of a lampstand with several other objects. That vision of objects is the Word of the Lord to Zerubbabel. It has NOTHING to do with the second temple era and NOTHING to do with the Zerubbabel of that era. This is Gods message to the one whom He calls Zerubbabel. He is a sign or a symbol of the witness. NOTHING in Zechariah 4 has anything to do with the second temple era. I explained some of it but it got erased maybe I can explain it later.