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Wow. Really? I won't even further comment on this statement.
New scenario.
The woman goes to a library to pick up a Bible. As she's leaving, a thug sneaks up behind her and knocks her out. He rapes her. She chose to go to the library without believing someone was going to knock her out and rape her, therefore she chose to get raped. At least, she chose to get raped using your logic.
New scenario.
The woman goes to a library to pick up a Bible. As she's leaving, a thug sneaks up behind her and knocks her out. He rapes her. She chose to go to the library without believing someone was going to knock her out and rape her, therefore she chose to get raped. At least, she chose to get raped using your logic.
K
Cycel, God has placed a burden on my heart for you. Are you in good health? I sense a burden for you. Man I love you and Christ loves you. I am in tears. Brother, I fear for you. You have come from a christian family is that not true? If I am wrong then I'm wrong. God is giving you another chance. Throw away what I'm saying, make it a farce. Man, you are in a fix and the doctor can't help. But I know a man who can, if you are willing.
Man stop being so bull headed and accept Him. Your life depends upon it. I love you man and I'm here for you, no matter what.
Good night
Man stop being so bull headed and accept Him. Your life depends upon it. I love you man and I'm here for you, no matter what.
Good night
So keeping children as slaves is unethical but not immoral; or is the practice immoral but not unethical? I suspect your motivation is to escape the obvious immorality of an unethical biblical practice? 
I guess the issue I have, Kerry, is that you're trying to make it sound like atheists choose to go to hell, that women who are raped at bars choose to get raped. But when someone says "choose", they're often suggesting consent.
Even if we accept your definition of "choice", which is a very lousy definition, we'd still have to split it up.
You would have people who choose to go to hell, and consent. This means people believe hell is real and wishes to go there - they give their consent. This doesn't happen. Nobody consents to eternal torture for all eternity. That's just stupid.
You would also have people who choose to go to hell involuntarily, because they didn't believe in it. These people didn't consent to hell.
And though women should be careful when they go to bars or avoid them all together, they still NEVER choose to get raped. But if we do use your definition of the word, then it was non-consensual choice. It's still not justified.
You act like women who are raped at bars or after drinking somehow deserve it or are responsible for it themselves. We should always be cautious, but never confuse carelessness with consent. If a woman is careless and drinks too much and is legitimately raped, she didn't choose to be raped and we can't blame the woman at all - the blame is 100% the rapist. The woman may have been careless, and we can point out how carelessness can lead to rape, but it doesn't make it her fault she was raped.
If I kicked you in the groin, would it be your fault for not wearing a cup? No.
Even if we accept your definition of "choice", which is a very lousy definition, we'd still have to split it up.
You would have people who choose to go to hell, and consent. This means people believe hell is real and wishes to go there - they give their consent. This doesn't happen. Nobody consents to eternal torture for all eternity. That's just stupid.
You would also have people who choose to go to hell involuntarily, because they didn't believe in it. These people didn't consent to hell.
And though women should be careful when they go to bars or avoid them all together, they still NEVER choose to get raped. But if we do use your definition of the word, then it was non-consensual choice. It's still not justified.
You act like women who are raped at bars or after drinking somehow deserve it or are responsible for it themselves. We should always be cautious, but never confuse carelessness with consent. If a woman is careless and drinks too much and is legitimately raped, she didn't choose to be raped and we can't blame the woman at all - the blame is 100% the rapist. The woman may have been careless, and we can point out how carelessness can lead to rape, but it doesn't make it her fault she was raped.
If I kicked you in the groin, would it be your fault for not wearing a cup? No.
K
22 Thou shalt not see thy brother's ox or his sheep go astray, and hide thyself from them: thou shalt in any case bring them again unto thy brother.
2 And if thy brother be not nigh unto thee, or if thou know him not, then thou shalt bring it unto thine own house, and it shall be with thee until thy brother seek after it, and thou shalt restore it to him again.
3 In like manner shalt thou do with his ass; and so shalt thou do with his raiment; and with all lost thing of thy brother's, which he hath lost, and thou hast found, shalt thou do likewise: thou mayest not hide thyself.
4 Thou shalt not see thy brother's ass or his ox fall down by the way, and hide thyself from them: thou shalt surely help him to lift them up again.
5 The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the Lord thy God.
6 If a bird's nest chance to be before thee in the way in any tree, or on the ground, whether they be young ones, or eggs, and the dam sitting upon the young, or upon the eggs, thou shalt not take the dam with the young:
7 But thou shalt in any wise let the dam go, and take the young to thee; that it may be well with thee, and that thou mayest prolong thy days.
8 When thou buildest a new house, then thou shalt make a battlement for thy roof, that thou bring not blood upon thine house, if any man fall from thence.
9 Thou shalt not sow thy vineyard with divers seeds: lest the fruit of thy seed which thou hast sown, and the fruit of thy vineyard, be defiled.
10 Thou shalt not plow with an ox and an ass together.
11 Thou shalt not wear a garment of divers sorts, as of woollen and linen together.
12 Thou shalt make thee fringes upon the four quarters of thy vesture, wherewith thou coverest thyself.
13 If any man take a wife, and go in unto her, and hate her,
14 And give occasions of speech against her, and bring up an evil name upon her, and say, I took this woman, and when I came to her, I found her not a maid:
15 Then shall the father of the damsel, and her mother, take and bring forth the tokens of the damsel's virginity unto the elders of the city in the gate:
16 And the damsel's father shall say unto the elders, I gave my daughter unto this man to wife, and he hateth her;
17 And, lo, he hath given occasions of speech against her, saying, I found not thy daughter a maid; and yet these are the tokens of my daughter's virginity. And they shall spread the cloth before the elders of the city.
18 And the elders of that city shall take that man and chastise him;
19 And they shall amerce him in an hundred shekels of silver, and give them unto the father of the damsel, because he hath brought up an evil name upon a virgin of Israel: and she shall be his wife; he may not put her away all his days.
20 But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel:
21 Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you.
22 If a man be found lying with a woman married to an husband, then they shall both of them die, both the man that lay with the woman, and the woman: so shalt thou put away evil from Israel.
23 If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her;
24 Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you.
25 But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her: then the man only that lay with her shall die.
26 But unto the damsel thou shalt do nothing; there is in the damsel no sin worthy of death: for as when a man riseth against his neighbour, and slayeth him, even so is this matter:
27 For he found her in the field, and the betrothed damsel cried, and there was none to save her.
28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;
29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.
30 A man shall not take his father's wife, nor discover his father's skirt.
2 And if thy brother be not nigh unto thee, or if thou know him not, then thou shalt bring it unto thine own house, and it shall be with thee until thy brother seek after it, and thou shalt restore it to him again.
3 In like manner shalt thou do with his ass; and so shalt thou do with his raiment; and with all lost thing of thy brother's, which he hath lost, and thou hast found, shalt thou do likewise: thou mayest not hide thyself.
4 Thou shalt not see thy brother's ass or his ox fall down by the way, and hide thyself from them: thou shalt surely help him to lift them up again.
5 The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the Lord thy God.
6 If a bird's nest chance to be before thee in the way in any tree, or on the ground, whether they be young ones, or eggs, and the dam sitting upon the young, or upon the eggs, thou shalt not take the dam with the young:
7 But thou shalt in any wise let the dam go, and take the young to thee; that it may be well with thee, and that thou mayest prolong thy days.
8 When thou buildest a new house, then thou shalt make a battlement for thy roof, that thou bring not blood upon thine house, if any man fall from thence.
9 Thou shalt not sow thy vineyard with divers seeds: lest the fruit of thy seed which thou hast sown, and the fruit of thy vineyard, be defiled.
10 Thou shalt not plow with an ox and an ass together.
11 Thou shalt not wear a garment of divers sorts, as of woollen and linen together.
12 Thou shalt make thee fringes upon the four quarters of thy vesture, wherewith thou coverest thyself.
13 If any man take a wife, and go in unto her, and hate her,
14 And give occasions of speech against her, and bring up an evil name upon her, and say, I took this woman, and when I came to her, I found her not a maid:
15 Then shall the father of the damsel, and her mother, take and bring forth the tokens of the damsel's virginity unto the elders of the city in the gate:
16 And the damsel's father shall say unto the elders, I gave my daughter unto this man to wife, and he hateth her;
17 And, lo, he hath given occasions of speech against her, saying, I found not thy daughter a maid; and yet these are the tokens of my daughter's virginity. And they shall spread the cloth before the elders of the city.
18 And the elders of that city shall take that man and chastise him;
19 And they shall amerce him in an hundred shekels of silver, and give them unto the father of the damsel, because he hath brought up an evil name upon a virgin of Israel: and she shall be his wife; he may not put her away all his days.
20 But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel:
21 Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you.
22 If a man be found lying with a woman married to an husband, then they shall both of them die, both the man that lay with the woman, and the woman: so shalt thou put away evil from Israel.
23 If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her;
24 Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you.
25 But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her: then the man only that lay with her shall die.
26 But unto the damsel thou shalt do nothing; there is in the damsel no sin worthy of death: for as when a man riseth against his neighbour, and slayeth him, even so is this matter:
27 For he found her in the field, and the betrothed damsel cried, and there was none to save her.
28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;
29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.
30 A man shall not take his father's wife, nor discover his father's skirt.
Kerry, I have a good deal of respect for you, but I think you are overly stressed by the need to guide a lost soul (that doesn't really feel lost).
I very much take after my father, except that he viewed Adam and Eve as historical figures; however, his grandmother became a Jehovah's Witness in later life and I think some of her views rubbed off on him, and perhaps on me through him.
I don't know Kerry. There was a time I very much wanted God in my life, and that would have been the time for Him to put in an appearance. He never did.
Who I really need is Dr. McCoy.
I know it seems that way to you, but from my tower it looks as though someone else is being bull headed.
I am touched. Thank you. Sleep well.
I very much take after my father, except that he viewed Adam and Eve as historical figures; however, his grandmother became a Jehovah's Witness in later life and I think some of her views rubbed off on him, and perhaps on me through him.
I don't know Kerry. There was a time I very much wanted God in my life, and that would have been the time for Him to put in an appearance. He never did.
Who I really need is Dr. McCoy.
I know it seems that way to you, but from my tower it looks as though someone else is being bull headed.
I am touched. Thank you. Sleep well.
H
According to God...people are all sinners or, we all choose hell because our hearts are wicked and we are separated from God. We might not like to hear that but...b/c of Adam's sin all of the human race is separated from God. That's why Jesus died so that we don't have to be separated from Him anymore. The only choice, really, is to choose God or stay the way u are. But I am sure u have heard all of this already, being a member of this site and all