Baptism symbol only ?

[PACEMAKER]

Good to meet you...
I reply.... No water means "No faith in the words of God"!
Faith is: "Believing the words of Jesus!"
The scriptures are the words of Jesus.... ALL THE SCRIPTURES!

Acts 2:40
With many other words he warned them; and he pleaded with them, “Save yourselves from this corrupt generation.”
41 Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.

Note Atwood 3000 people were saved by Baptism the first day of the church!
3000 were "ADDED" to Jesus' body by baptism!

Dogknox, welcome aboard.
Let's clarify something; just what is your Definition of the word "Faith"

These verses in Acts contradicts your Belief about "water baptism"

Acts 2:21 And everyone who calls
on the name of the Lord will be saved. where is the word Baptism???



Acts 2:47 praising God and enjoying the favor of all the people. And the Lord added to their number daily those who were being saved. where is the word Baptism???



Acts 3:19 Repent, then, and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped out,
that times of refreshing may come from the Lord, where is the word Baptism???



Acts 4:4 But many who heard the message believed; so the number of men who believed grew to about five thousand. where is the word Baptism???


These verses are part of Scripture and the word"baptism"
is NOT mentioned
So if you were to include ALL Scriptures
And some people were Saved
WITH OUT "water baptism"
Then we should conclude that other people could be Saved
With Out "water baptism"
RIGHT ???

 

[Kerry]

Neither was Paul baptized in water, yet said I speak in tongues more than you all. Then will go on to say that I speak in the tongues of angels.

 

[Kerry]

Water Baptism is church ritual and nothing more, it something that should be done, but is not a requirement as proposed to be many baptist denominations. Neither was the the thief on the cross baptized, it was a precursor to the real thing and the real thing is Christ and Him crucified and nothing else. Placing your faith in water baptizem is like placing your faith in Buddha. It is works based and not in the cross.

It stems the false doctrine of once saved always saved, But water baptism will not save you. The only thing that will save and deliver is the cross. That's why He gave us the cross, because nothing else would set us free from the power of sin. For by one man sin entered and by one man sin is destroyed. Nothing to do with water.

 

[Atwood]

WHAT YOU POSTED IS SPOT ON, PACE.
In contrast with the few verses where someone might jump to the conclusion that immersion in water saves, there are just an overwhelming number of verses that say nothing about water when the plan of salvation is described. At the least the Lord would be accused of false-advertising.
Suppose there were 1000 ads over 1000 days in the newspaper stating that Acme Brick was permanently offering bricks at 5 cents apiece (nothing else mentioned), but on one day of advertising (in the middle of the ad campaign) ACME put out a second ad and offered bricks for 5 cents apiece plus a glass of water. Could ACME deny the brick for 5 cents without the water & not be guilty of violating its own business offer?

Dogknox, welcome aboard.
Let's clarify something; just what is your Definition of the word "Faith"

These verses in Acts contradicts your Belief about "water baptism"

Acts 2:21 And everyone who calls
on the name of the Lord will be saved. where is the word Baptism???

[Note how everyone or whosoever rules out any other necessary additive, though Rom 10 explains that this is a call of faith]

Acts 2:47 praising God and enjoying the favor of all the people. And the Lord added to their number daily those who were being saved. where is the word Baptism???


Acts 3:19 Repent, then, and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped out,
that times of refreshing may come from the Lord, where is the word Baptism???


Acts 4:4 But many who heard the message believed; so the number of men who believed grew to about five thousand. where is the word Baptism???


These verses are part of Scripture and the word"baptism"
is NOT mentioned
So if you were to include ALL Scriptures
And some people were Saved
WITH OUT "water baptism"
Then we should conclude that other people could be Saved
With Out "water baptism"
RIGHT ???

Don't expect water fanatics to give heed to "all scripture." They are hung up on rare verses.

 

[Atwood]

Water Baptism is church ritual and nothing more, it something that should be done, but is not a requirement as proposed to be many baptist denominations. Neither was the the thief on the cross baptized, it was a precursor to the real thing and the real thing is Christ and Him crucified and nothing else. Placing your faith in water baptizem is like placing your faith in Buddha. It is works based and not in the cross.

It stems the false doctrine of once saved always saved,

Kerry this is no false doctrine; it is the essence of actually trusting the Lord with your salvation
Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for He shall save His people from their sins.

So what is it for you?
Once dunked, always dunked?

Can you deny that such a doctrine is all wet?

 

[Atwood]

Before 1611 the word Baptize did not exist in the English language. It was created by the transcribers of the 1611 KJV bible. If you look at the strong' s it is used literately and figuratively.. To be baptized in Christ means to be immersed in Christ. To baptized in water means to be immersed in water. Which one will save you, your work or His work?

So then, when did they come up with the word, Babtize & Babtist?

Kerry, can't you do any better than Strong's? Can't you get yourself at least a Vine's?

 

[Kerry]

Kerry this is no false doctrine; it is the essence of actually trusting the Lord with your salvation
Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for He shall save His people from their sins.

So what is it for you?
Once dunked, always dunked?


Can you deny that such a doctrine is all wet?

I don't know what your saying?
But not dunked and faith in the work of the cross and dunked or not. The main thing is faith in the cross and not a work of the flesh as dunking is.

Nothing wrong with water Baptism, but it is not the focus, I meant demon possed people can get baptized and join the church. It 's all about faith in the cross and it cuts our flesh to the bone. Because it shows us there is nothing we can do and that steps on our sacred cow so we come with these traditions that please the flesh. Oh I just need to dunk my head in some water and I'm good.

 

[Kerry]

Jesus did not start His ministry until He was baptized in the Holy Ghost. I wish that preachers today would take that into account. With oiut the Holy Spirit it just you and the world don't need you. It needs the Holy Ghost.

 

[Atwood]

I don't know what your saying?
But not dunked and faith in the work of the cross and dunked or not. The main thing is faith in the cross and not a work of the flesh as dunking is.

Nothing wrong with water Baptism, but it is not the focus, I meant demon possed people can get baptized and join the church. It 's all about faith in the cross and it cuts our flesh to the bone. Because it shows us there is nothing we can do and that steps on our sacred cow so we come with these traditions that please the flesh. Oh I just need to dunk my head in some water and I'm good.

What is your verse for having faith in the cross.
It bothers me how you keep repeating that mantra
instead of having faith in the Lord Jesus.

 

[Atwood]

Jesus did not start His ministry until He was baptized in the Holy Ghost.

Prove that one or retract.

I wish that preachers today would take that into account. With oiut the Holy Spirit it just you and the world don't need you. It needs the Holy Ghost.

Then why do you post here if the world doesn't need you?
And BTW, He is not a ghost.

All Christians are Spirit-baptized, but it didn't start until Acts 2.

 

[Dogknox]

Dogknox, welcome aboard.
Let's clarify something; just what is your Definition of the word "Faith"

These verses in Acts contradicts your Belief about "water baptism"

Acts 2:21 And everyone who calls
on the name of the Lord will be saved. where is the word Baptism???



Acts 2:47 praising God and enjoying the favor of all the people. And the Lord added to their number daily those who were being saved. where is the word Baptism???



Acts 3:19 Repent, then, and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped out,
that times of refreshing may come from the Lord, where is the word Baptism???



Acts 4:4 But many who heard the message believed; so the number of men who believed grew to about five thousand. where is the word Baptism???


These verses are part of Scripture and the word"baptism"
is NOT mentioned
So if you were to include ALL Scriptures
And some people were Saved
WITH OUT "water baptism"
Then we should conclude that other people could be Saved
With Out "water baptism"
RIGHT ???

PACEMAKER Good to meet you...You ask: where is the WORD "Baptism"?!!
Acts 2:21 And everyone who calls
on the name of the Lord will be saved. where is the word Baptism???

Acts 2:47 praising God and enjoying the favor of all the people. And the Lord added to their number daily those who were being saved. where is the word Baptism???

I reply, Right here... ACTS 2:40 With many other words he warned them; and he pleaded with them, “Save yourselves from this corrupt generation.”41 Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.

Clearly 3000 were SAVED by Baptism!
3000 were "ADDED to the body of Jesus" by BAPTISM!
Clearly 3000 were made God' Children by Baptism!
PACEMAKER God' Children are saved, baptism ADDS Christians to Jesus' body!!

LOOK.. The crowd asked Peter what they should do after Peter told them they killed God' son.. He told them..
ACTS 2:38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Acts 47 tells us, there were DAILY baptism's because we both know from the verse (above) 41 Baptism adds people to their number!

Jesus himself tells you "WATER SAVES"!
John 3:5
Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit.

The word "AND" (above are the words of God) tells you WATER saves!
PACEMAKER Right after Jesus said "you must be REBORN of WATER" he goes out and BAPTIZES with WATER!!!!
John 3:22
After this, Jesus and his disciples went out into the Judean countryside, where he spent some time with them, and baptized. 23 Now John also was baptizing at Aenon near Salim, because there was plenty of water, and people were coming and being baptized.

PACEMAKER Question:
From the verses above; Why were Jesus and John BAPTIZING at Aenon near Salim??
Please reply!!

 

[Dogknox]

Atwood Thank you for your reply:
You said... DogK,
1) where does the word by occur?
2) The text says 2 things a) were baptized & b) were added to their number. No instrumental relationship is expressed.
Spirit baptism is what puts one in the Body of Christ 1 Cor 12:13, not water.
3) water does not even occur in Acts 2.
4) context of Acts 2 is the prophecy of Acts 1 that they would be Spirit baptized not many days hence.
5) Your text doesn't say that the baptism saved them.
6) The verb in 2:39 is Σώθητε, Aorist passive, not "save yourselves," but "be saved."
Water is never the means of salvation in the Bible. And water-immersion cannot be essential to salvation as many, many times salvation is offered just for believing. In fact the list of verses is too long for one post on this forum. So I just post a sample.
The only MUST I DO for salvation is believe/have faith/trust. Sirs, what MUST-I-DO to be saved? Answer:
Believe on the Lord Jesus and thou shalt be saved.
Water immersion is an human work, and as Eph 2 points out, by grace you are saved through faith . . . not of works!

I reply: There is NO place that says, Do not use water to baptize, there is NO place that says Peter did NOT baptize with water!!
LOOK...
30 Then Philip ran up to the chariot and heard the man reading Isaiah the prophet. “Do you understand what you are reading?” Philip asked.
31 “How can I,” he said, “unless someone explains it to me?” So he invited Philip to come up and sit with him.
32 This is the passage of Scripture the eunuch was reading:
“He was led like a sheep to the slaughter,
and as a lamb before its shearer is silent,
so he did not open his mouth.
33 In his humiliation he was deprived of justice.
Who can speak of his descendants?
For his life was taken from the earth.”[b]

34 The eunuch asked Philip, “Tell me, please, who is the prophet talking about, himself or someone else?” 35 Then Philip began with that very passage of Scripture and told him the good news about Jesus.
36 As they traveled along the road, they came to some water and the eunuch said, “Look, here is water. What can stand in the way of my being baptized?” [37] 38 And he gave orders to stop the chariot. Then both Philip and the eunuch went down into the water and Philip baptized him. 39 When they came up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord suddenly took Philip away, and the eunuch did not see him again, but went on his way rejoicing.

Atwood Clearly God wants the Eunuch BAPTIZED!!!!!!
God sent Philip to the Eunuch to baptize him; Philip was not finished with the Eunuch until the Eunuch was >>Baptized with WATER!<<!
Verse 36 (above) They came to >>WATER<<! "Look; here is water" said the Eunuch!!

Atwood.... Clearly Philip MUST have been teaching the Eunuch about: "BAPTISM"!
Atwood.... He MUST have been teaching; Baptism saves and Baptism is done with >>WATER<< !!!
No other explanation is possible the Eunuch was excited to find water!

THINK: If Philip was teaching symbolic Baptism then why did the Eunuch not wait to get home first to be baptized, so he could show his family and friends?! NO....
The Eunuch was excited to find water.... Philips work was not completed until the Eunuch was BAPTIZED WITH WATER!

 

[newbirth]

PACEMAKER Good to meet you...You ask: where is the WORD "Baptism"?!!
Acts 2:21 And everyone who calls
on the name of the Lord will be saved. where is the word Baptism???

Acts 2:47 praising God and enjoying the favor of all the people. And the Lord added to their number daily those who were being saved. where is the word Baptism???

I reply, Right here... ACTS 2:40 With many other words he warned them; and he pleaded with them, “Save yourselves from this corrupt generation.”41 Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.

Clearly 3000 were SAVED by Baptism!
3000 were "ADDED to the body of Jesus" by BAPTISM!
Clearly 3000 were made God' Children by Baptism!
PACEMAKER God' Children are saved, baptism ADDS Christians to Jesus' body!!

LOOK.. The crowd asked Peter what they should do after Peter told them they killed God' son.. He told them..
ACTS 2:38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Acts 47 tells us, there were DAILY baptism's because we both know from the verse (above) 41 Baptism adds people to their number!

Jesus himself tells you "WATER SAVES"!
John 3:5
Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit.

The word "AND" (above are the words of God) tells you WATER saves!
PACEMAKER Right after Jesus said "you must be REBORN of WATER" he goes out and BAPTIZES with WATER!!!!
John 3:22
After this, Jesus and his disciples went out into the Judean countryside, where he spent some time with them, and baptized. 23 Now John also was baptizing at Aenon near Salim, because there was plenty of water, and people were coming and being baptized.

PACEMAKER Question:
From the verses above; Why were Jesus and John BAPTIZING at Aenon near Salim??
Please reply!!

spot on except for one error....
John 4:2
(Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples,) but don't let that deter you because errors reminds us we are humans....

 

[newbirth]

Neither was Paul baptized in water, yet said I speak in tongues more than you all. Then will go on to say that I speak in the tongues of angels.

the scripture says Paul was baptised brother....unless you think Saul is not Paul...or he disobed Ananias...and I am careul to note Ananias said... be baptized, and wash away thy sins..... calling on the name of the Lord....that is proof something happens at baptism ...aside from getting wet...
Acts 22:12-16King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And one Ananias, a devout man according to the law, having a good report of all the Jews which dwelt there,
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Came unto me, and stood, and said unto me, Brother Saul, receive thy sight. And the same hour I looked up upon him.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]For thou shalt be his witness unto all men of what thou hast seen and heard.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

 

[newbirth]

Jesus did not start His ministry until He was baptized in the Holy Ghost. I wish that preachers today would take that into account. With oiut the Holy Spirit it just you and the world don't need you. It needs the Holy Ghost.

Did this happen when he was water baptised?

 

[tylerbones1313]

Acts 2:38 Says: Then Peter said unto them, Repent, (and) be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. *emphasis mine.

The conjunction and joins two thoughts together always. Therefore repentance and baptism are both necessary for remission of sins. Let me put it another way. You borrow a friends shirt and drop it in the mud you tell your friend sorry and he forgives you. But until you wash the shirt it is still dirty.

Repentance is for the forgiveness of sins and baptism is for the removal of sins it takes both.

This was what Peter said after preaching when they asked a direct question "Men and Brethren what shall we do?" in effect they were saying what should we do to be saved.

As for the thief on the cross water baptism in Jesus name wasn't instituted til Christ died. We can't baptize in His name while he was yet alive.

All the way up until christ died we were still in the Old Testament it wasn't until he died the we came into the New Testament salvation. He is scripture backing: Hebrews Chapter 9 15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

I absolutely believe that you must have faith in Christ and the Cross. We identify in his death, burial and resurrection. Repentance is dying (crucifying the flesh), Baptism is our burial of our old self, and Holy Ghost is Resurrection into new life.

 

[Dogknox]

spot on except for one error....
John 4:2
(Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples,) but don't let that deter you because errors reminds us we are humans....

newbirth Good to meet you....
I reply... Think about this....
It takes TWO, TWO, "TWO parents" to form a child!
The Bride FORMS the child the Groom sends the Gift!
The Father never ever forms the child the Mother does the forming.

Church forms us with the waters of Baptism; The waters ">RE-Form<" the child of Adam into a child of the second Adam- Jesus!
newbirth Adams children are NOT God' children, they are all born corrupted, born into a corrupted creation!
Adams children "You and me" are re-formed into the form of God' Children un corrupted, by the waters of Baptism.
THINK: Jesus is without sin and ALL people "Formed into the Body of Jesus" are also without sin.

Acts 22:16
And now what are you waiting for? Get up, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on his name.’


newbirth... Jesus did not baptize because the Bride does the baptizing...
The Church baptizes with water, the Groom sends the gift.
acts 2:38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

"BE BAPTIZED" Church does the baptizing!! (Bride)
"RECEIVE THE GIFT" God sends the Holy Spirit as a Gift! (Groom)

 

[Kerry]

it just means you got wet and nothing else.

 

[Kerry]

the scripture says Paul was baptised brother....unless you think Saul is not Paul...or he disobed Ananias...and I am careul to note Ananias said... be baptized, and wash away thy sins..... calling on the name of the Lord....that is proof something happens at baptism ...aside from getting wet...
Acts 22:12-16King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And one Ananias, a devout man according to the law, having a good report of all the Jews which dwelt there,
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Came unto me, and stood, and said unto me, Brother Saul, receive thy sight. And the same hour I looked up upon him.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]For thou shalt be his witness unto all men of what thou hast seen and heard.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

I said the 12 when was Peter baptized in water?

 

[Kerry]

Water baptism is your work and not Gods. Water baptism is the same as communion. it is done as an outward show of an inner change and nothing more. I can get my head dunked by a preacher and then leave and rob a bank or rape some girl or smack my kid in the face, it does nothing for me. I meant its like buying a diet coke and triple fat cheeseburger.