THE CALLING OUT OF THE BRIDE, to go to The Wedding of the Lamb

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Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
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#21
The Church will be taken up, raptured ( end of 1 Thes 4 --
in 1 Thes 5 start, comes the Day of the Lord, the "tribulation"

Compare Enoch, raptured before the Flood in Genesis:

21 And Enoch lived sixty and five years, and begat Methuselah: 22 and Enoch walked with God after he begat Methuselah three hundred years, and begat sons and daughters: 23 and all the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty and five years: 24 and Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him.

Heb 11:

5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and he was not found, because God translated him:

Genesis:
15 And when the morning arose, then the angels hastened Lot, saying, Arise, take thy wife, and thy two daughters that are here, lest thou be consumed in the iniquity of the city. 16 But he lingered; and the men laid hold upon his hand, and upon the hand of his wife, and upon the hand of his two daughters, Jehovah being merciful unto him: and they brought him forth, and set him without the city. 17 And it came to pass, when they had brought them forth, abroad, that he said, Escape for thy life; look not behind thee, . . .


escape thither; for
I cannot do anything till thou be come thither.


2 Pet

For if God . . .
turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes condemned them with an overthrow,
having made them an example unto those that should live ungodly; and
delivered righteous Lot, . . .
the Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly
 

watcher2013

Senior Member
Aug 6, 2013
1,931
108
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#22
I know that there will be a lot of Christians who do not agree with me on this subject. However, when one studies the Jewish Wedding Traditions and how the apply to Christ Calling Out His Bride to go to the Wedding of the Lamb, it becomes obvious that it will happen prior to the beginning of the Great Tribulation.

Because of false teachers like Harold Camping and many others who have misrepresented and even changed the meaning of the term, I do not even like to use the term Rapture. Instead I prefer to call it what it really is, "The Calling Out of the Bride" for the Wedding of the Lamb, and I have found that most Conservative Evangelicals have pretty much the same beliefs about:

THE CALLING OUT OF THE BRIDE (THE CHURCH - The sum total of all true believers, OT and NT):

To fully understand the significance of expressions, such as: "I go to prepare a place for you", or "a thief in the night", or "with the voice of an archangel", or "only the Father knows", you have to know the Jewish Wedding traditions. I can highly recommend the booklet "A Christian Love Story" by Zola Levitt that may still be available at his website. Or it can be found on Amazon.com, in Kindle format for less than two dollars.

If a man was seeking a bride 2000 years ago, he had to first go to the father and make a contract or covenant with the father for what price he wanted for the bride. The Father's price to redeem the Bride the Church, was a Holy Blood Sacrifice; 1 Cor. 6:20.

The price for the Bride would be payable immediately after the bride accepted the proposal (if she accepted); the man would be invited to a family sitdown supper, where he would propose. The proposal was NEVER VERBAL. He would pour a cup of wine and set it down in front of the woman he wanted to be his Bride. If she took the cup and drank from it, she was accepting his proposal. Jesus on the night of the Last Supper poured the cup of wine and passed it to the Disciples the Foundation of the Church, choosing the Church as his intended Bride. The Disciples drank from the Cup accepting the Proposal of Jesus Christ to the Church; Mat. 26:27.

Once she had taken the cup and drank from it, they immediately became known as Bride and Bridegroom for the entire betrothal period. Before the Bridegroom would leave the dwelling place of the Bride, he would stand and make a verbal announcement, "I go to prepare a place for you." YES, the very words of Jesus, come from the traditional Jewish Wedding Proposal; John 14:2-3.

When the Bridegroom left the old dwelling place of the Bride, he would never set foot in it again until after the Wedding Ceremony in the new dwelling place. Jesus has left the old dwelling place of the Bride, Earth; and He will not set foot on it again until after the Marriage of the Lamb to the Church, which takes place in New City Jerusalem He is building for his Bride; 1 Th. 4:17, Rev. 21:2, Mat. 24:30.

ONLY his father could decide, "The new dwelling place is finished, go get your Bride." He would periodically come and inspect the progress and make the son add this and that until the new dwelling place met his father's standards, because the young man may be too anxious to go get his Bride and cut corners to get done quickly. So literally NO ONE but the father knew when the Wedding would be. Jesus said that very thing, in Mark 13:32.

When the Bride would see signs that the new dwelling place was nearly finished, she would gather her wedding party at her place, and they all had to bring lamps with oil in them, because the traditional time for the Bridegroom to come and steal the Bride away was at night, usually around midnight. They would sleep over because they were not sure which night, just that it could be soon, and very soon. Hence the parable of Ten Virgins is telling a very familiar Wedding Story that every Jew would recognize, as their Wedding traditions; Mat. 25:1-13, 1 Th. 5:2.

When the father finally told his son, "The new dwelling place is finished, go get your bride." The Bridegroom would quickly gather his Wedding party, choosing one of them to Shout and call the Bride out of her old dwelling place. They would stop just outside the old dwelling place, NOT setting foot in it, while the chosen one would Shout and call the bride out. Jesus has already chosen the Archangel to Shout and call us out of our old dwelling place, Earth; 1 Th. 4:16-18.

The entire wedding party, would all go back to the new dwelling place for the 7 day Wedding Ceremony. Most Evangelicals, believe that the One Week Wedding Ceremony, and the 70th Week of Daniel is the Same Week of Years. After the Ceremony, the entire Wedding party would return to the old dwelling place of the Bride for the Wedding Feast. Then for the first time since the Proposal the bridegroom sets foot in the Old Dwelling Place of the Bride.

What about the Old Testament Saints? I believe the Bride is the some total of all true believers of all time.
We NT saints are those who believe Jesus is the Messiah and received HIM as Lord.
The OT saints are those who believed Messiah would come and received HIM as Lord.
See it, it is the same faith, the Faith of Abraham.

Jeremiah 2:2 (NIV)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] "Go and proclaim in the hearing of Jerusalem: "'I remember the devotion of your youth, how as a bride you loved me and followed me through the desert, through a land not sown.

Isaiah 62:5 (ASV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] For as a young man marrieth a virgin, so shall thy sons marry thee; andas the bridegroom rejoiceth over the bride, so shall thy God rejoice over thee.


Ephesians 5:23 (HCSB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] for the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church. He is the Savior of the body.

Matthew 9:15 (NKJV)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] And Jesus said to them, "Can the friends of the bridegroom mourn as long as the bridegroom is with them? But the days will come when the bridegroom will be taken away from them, and then they will fast.

2 Peter 3:3-4 (HCSB)

[SUP]3 [/SUP] First, be aware of this: Scoffers will come in the last days to scoff, living according to their own desires,
[SUP]4 [/SUP] saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? Ever since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they have been since the beginning of creation.”

Matt 25:1 (NKJV)
1 "Then the kingdom of heaven shall be likened to ten virgins who took their lamps and went out to meet the Bridegroom.

The New Dwelling Place that HE promised build us in John 14:2, is the dwelling place every bridegroom built for his bride, in his father's house. And it will remain there, until after the Millennial Kingdom when it is lowered to the new earth still decorated from the like a bride from the Wedding of the Lamb that took place there. How do we get back and forth if we are to reign with him for that thousand years? It does not specifically say, but maybe that is why the story of Jacob's Ladder is in the Bible, to validate that those of us in our glorified bodies, that we will find that there is a way for us to reign as Priests (teachers of the children born in the KINGDOM to the 144,000 Jews), and still have our dwelling place in Heaven where our citizenship already is.
if the church is the sum of all believers... what part of it are the two witnesses of rev 11?
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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#23
if the church is the sum of all believers... what part of it are the two witnesses of rev 11?
It does not tell us who they are verbatim, but I think there is a VERY STRONG HINT:

Hebrews 9:27 (NASB)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgment,

And the only exception to that Rule that I find is this:

1 Thessalonians 4:16-18 (HCSB)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the archangel’s voice, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Then we who are still alive will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air and so we will always be with the Lord.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] Therefore encourage one another with these words.

ENOCH and ELIJAH did NOT die, HOWEVER:

1 Corinthians 15:50 (NIV)
[SUP]50 [/SUP] I declare to you, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.

So we know GOD did not take them to Heaven, but where did he send them then?

GOD is Omnipresent Not only in ever cubic inch that exists, but ALSO in every second of TIME as we know it at the same time. That is why HE is called the I AM. HE is not a created being traveling through time like we do, HE IS LITERALLY THE CREATOR OF TIME as we know it. HE declares the End from the Beginning because HE is the I AM simultaneously in all time. Don't put GOD in a box called TIME, HE does not fit there, because HE is thee ETERNAL BEING, GOD. Since we know NOTHING IS IMPOSSIBLE WITH GOD, is it not possible that GOD grabbed ENOCH and ELIJAH out of their time frame and put them in the End Times to Lead HIS CHOSEN NATION ISRAEL to believe in Yeshua as Messiah?

What would be the effect on Jews if those two returned and they they were miraculously recognized like on the Mount of Transfiguration, and they were doing miracles like the Prophets of Old to validate they were sent by GOD?
Would there not be a MASSIVE conversion in ISRAEL?


AND then the two witnesses are killed in the streets of Jerusalem by the Antichrist, keeping GOD's word 100% accurate, about GOD giving men once to die, EXCEPT those who are caught up to meet HIM in the air, when He calls out HIS BRIDE (True Believers of all time).

Acts 1:6-7 (HCSB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] So when they had come together, they asked Him, “Lord, are You restoring the kingdom to Israel at this time?”
[SUP]7 [/SUP] He said to them, “It is not for you to know times or periods that the Father has set by His own authority.

GOD IS NOT FINISHED WITH ISRAEL, and the 70th WEEK of Daniel has not happened, YET.

READ Joel Chapter 2, about the END of the Tribulation WEEK of Years. You will see absolute proof that GOD is not finished with Israel, AND you will find that the Bride, the Church, IS IN THE NEW DWELLING PLACE IN HEAVEN, and leaves to come with the Bridegroom, CHRIST to set up HIS KINGDOM on Earth. These things were hidden until the time of the END. I believe we are rapidly approaching that DAY.
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
19,212
2,547
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#24
I would like to say that while it is a valiant effort when it comes to debating the rapture Im afraid there really is no winning situation. discussing it is good even debating to a point but in the end you will not convince most people your views on the rapture, its basically like two stubborn donkeys going at each others neither one will back down and they only stop when they are worn out.
This is why when I debate about the rapture I don't do it to try to convince others I do it simply to teach and learn, but convincing someone of your views on the rapture is something I have never seen and I have been to lots of forums specifically made for heated debates.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
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#25
if the church is the sum of all believers... what part of it are the two witnesses of rev 11?
the Church is the Body of Christ, not the sum of all believers. The Church was still future in Mat 16 ("I will build My Church"). Abraham was not in the Church, nor Moses. In the Tribulation or Dan's 70th week in scripture, the Church is never mentioned. The witnesses are evidently saints of a different age, not the Church Age.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
48
#26
I would like to say that while it is a valiant effort when it comes to debating the rapture Im afraid there really is no winning situation. discussing it is good even debating to a point but in the end you will not convince most people your views on the rapture, its basically like two stubborn donkeys going at each others neither one will back down and they only stop when they are worn out.
This is why when I debate about the rapture I don't do it to try to convince others I do it simply to teach and learn, but convincing someone of your views on the rapture is something I have never seen and I have been to lots of forums specifically made for heated debates.
Christians do not agree on the timing of the Rapture, the order of events in Eschatology, what is literal and what is figurative. That doesn't bother me. What does bother me is when someone gets on the high horse and accuses another of heresy for figuring it out the best he can.

What stands out as important on the Rapture is to expect Christ's return at any time, even now; judge at the doors (Jas 5). Persons with different POV on the Rapture can agree on that. I think it is bad to claim that Christ can't come back for 7 more years, and worse to claim he already came back & won't come back again.

Pre-tribbers easily believe in the imminence of Christ's return, but mid-tribbers & post-tribbers also can have that belief on the POV that the tribulation is nebulous or figurative -- we may already have gone thru it & not noticed it! Also some preterists may believe Christ could come today, though they write off a lot or prophecy as fulfilled in AD 70 and may think the tribulation already happened long ago.

Let us not lose our blessed hope or our love for each other over eschatology.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
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#27
It does not tell us who they are verbatim, but I think there is a VERY STRONG HINT:

Hebrews 9:27 (NASB)
[SUP]27 [/SUP] And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgment,

And the only exception to that Rule that I find is this:

1 Thessalonians 4:16-18 (HCSB)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the archangel’s voice, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
I like to think that the 2 witnesses are Elijah & Enoch, though I really can't prove it. I think that at the Rapture there might be a moment of death when the body is glorified. Of course then we have to ask about Lazarus and others Christ raised during His ministry, & those who rose at the time Christ was crucified & rose from the dead -- I think of these as resuscitated, not resurrected to a glorified body. It looks like some died twice.

Probably Heb 9 is a general statement.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
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#28
Pardon me while I step outside for a moment & look up. You never know what you might see, and there is this crown for loving His appearing. Maybe the trumpet music will start as I look up.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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#29
Pardon me while I step outside for a moment & look up. You never know what you might see, and there is this crown for loving His appearing. Maybe the trumpet music will start as I look up.
Luke 17:22-24 (NKJV)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] Then He said to the disciples, "The days will come when you will desire to see one of the days {plural} of the Son of Man, and you will not see it.
[SUP]23 [/SUP] And they will say to you, 'Look here!' or 'Look there!' Do not go after them or follow them.
[SUP]24 [/SUP] For as the lightning that flashes out of one part under heaven shines to the other part under heaven, so also the Son of Man will be in His day.

THAT IS NOT THE SECOND COMING, because HE does NOT set foot on Earth at the time HE appears to Call Out His BRIDE to go to the Wedding of the Lamb in Heaven. NOTICE, it happens VERY QUICKLY.

THIS IS THE SECOND COMING:


Revelation 17:13-14 (ESV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] These are of one mind, and they hand over their power and authority to the beast.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] They will make war on the Lamb, and the Lamb will conquer them, for he is Lord of lords and King of kings, and those with him are called and chosen and faithful {The Bride}.

Revelation 19:19 (NIV)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth and their armies gathered together to make war against therider {Jesus Christ} on the horse and his army.

NOTICE: The Second COMING IS NOT FAST, it is very SLOW, so that the Armies of the World have time to gather at Armageddon, and they KNOW they are going there to try to stop Christ from Coming Back to take possession of HIS creation.

READ JOEL Chapter 2, especially this VERSE:

Joel 2:16 (ESV)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] gather the people. Consecrate the congregation {The Bride is made up of true believers from the OT times and NT times}; assemble the elders {of the Church}; gather the children, even nursing infants. {We in the lightning fast Appearing were taken to Heaven in our immortal bodies that no longer marry and give birth to mortals, so these must be the 144,000 mortal Jews sealed during the Great Tribulation.] Let the bridegroom leave his room, and the bride her chamber. {The Bride always on the final evening of a week long Wedding Ceremony in a Jewish Wedding, leaves her New Dwelling place in His Father's House, to journey back to her Old Dwelling Place for the Wedding Supper.}

Revelation 19:9 (NIV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] Then the angel said to me, "Write: 'Blessed are those who are invited to the wedding supper of the Lamb!'" And he added, "These are the true words of God."

The Truth has always been there, but it is only NOW in the End Times, understood, just like Daniels Prophecies.

Daniel 12:4 (NKJV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] "But you, Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book until the time of the end; many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase."
 
J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#30
All the rapture related scripture aside, I've never understood how the people who believe there is one second coming of Christ, that the rapture is at the end of the tribulation (the "yo-yo theory"), how they can explain these verses?

Matthew 25:31-33 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

Who is there to separate, if the justified have just been raptured? Wouldn't one have nothing but goats remaining?
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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#31
the Church is the Body of Christ, not the sum of all believers. The Church was still future in Mat 16 ("I will build My Church"). Abraham was not in the Church, nor Moses. In the Tribulation or Dan's 70th week in scripture, the Church is never mentioned. The witnesses are evidently saints of a different age, not the Church Age.

Matthew 16:18 (Young's Literal Translation)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] `And I also say to thee, that thou art a rock, and upon this rock I will build my assembly, and gates of Hades shall not prevail against it;

Ephesians 5:23 (YLT)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] because the husband is head of the wife, as also the Christ is head of the assembly, and he is saviour of the body,

Numbers 16:3 (NIV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] They came as a group to oppose Moses and Aaron and said to them, "You have gone too far! The whole community is holy, every one of them, and the LORD is with them. Why then do you set yourselves above the LORD's assembly?"

Deuteronomy 23:3 (NASB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] "No Ammonite or Moabite shall enter the assembly of the LORD; none of their descendants, even to the tenth generation, shall ever enter the assembly of the LORD,

Judges 21:5 (NASB)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] Then the sons of Israel said, "Who is there among all the tribes of Israel who did not come up in the assembly to the LORD?" For they had taken a great oath concerning him who did not come up to the LORD at Mizpah, saying, "He shall surely be put to death."

1 Chronicles 28:8 (ESV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] Now therefore in the sight of all Israel, the assembly of the LORD, and in the hearing of our God, observe and seek out all the commandments of the LORD your God, that you may possess this good land and leave it for an inheritance to your children after you forever.

1 Chronicles 29:20 (ESV)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] Then David said to all the assembly, “Bless the LORD your God.” And all the assembly blessed the LORD, the God of their fathers, and bowed their heads and paid homage to the LORD and to the king.

Psalm 89:5 (NIV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] The heavens praise your wonders, O LORD, your faithfulness too, in the assembly of the holy ones.

John 10:15-16 (NASB)
[SUP]15 [/SUP] even as the Father knows Me and I know the Father; and I lay down My life for the sheep.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] "I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; I must bring them also, and they will hear My voice; and they will become one flock with one shepherd.

The ASSEMBLY HE IS BUILDING IS TRUE BELIEVERS, from both the OT times and NT times.

THAT ONE FLOCK is made up of two folds, who both have the same Shephard.

O.T. Saints, believed GOD that Messiah would come.

N.T. Saints, believe GOD that Messiah did come, in the body we know as Jesus.

We both have the same faith:

Romans 4:3 (HCSB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] For what does the Scripture say? Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him for righteousness.

The exact same thing is TRUE about the Bride of Christ.

Jeremiah 2:1-3 (NIV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] The word of the LORD came to me:
[SUP]2 [/SUP] "Go and proclaim in the hearing of Jerusalem: "'I remember the devotion of your youth, how as a bride you loved me and followed me through the desert, through a land not sown.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] Israel was holy to the LORD, the firstfruits of his harvest; all who devoured her were held guilty, and disaster overtook them,'" declares the LORD.

Isaiah 57:16 (HCSB)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] For I will not accuse ⌊you⌋ forever, and I will not always be angry; for then the spirit would grow weak before Me, even the breath ⌊of man⌋, which I have made.

Isaiah 62:5 (HCSB)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] For as a young man marries a young woman, so your sons will marry you; and as a groom rejoices over ⌊his⌋ bride, so your God will rejoice over you.

THE ASSEMBLY THAT THE LORD IS BUILDING IS HIS BRIDE, AND IT IS MADE UP OF BOTH O.T. AND N.T. SAINTS.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
113
#32
I would like to say that while it is a valiant effort when it comes to debating the rapture Im afraid there really is no winning situation. discussing it is good even debating to a point but in the end you will not convince most people your views on the rapture, its basically like two stubborn donkeys going at each others neither one will back down and they only stop when they are worn out.
This is why when I debate about the rapture I don't do it to try to convince others I do it simply to teach and learn, but convincing someone of your views on the rapture is something I have never seen and I have been to lots of forums specifically made for heated debates.
No matter what the subject, I do not debate expecting to win the person with a different view. I debate for those who are truly seeking the Truth, or the new Christians who are just reading these threads, and prone to being tossed to and fro by every wind of Doctrine. The goal is get those readers GROUNDED in the Word and Sound Doctrine.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
113
#33
I like to think that the 2 witnesses are Elijah & Enoch, though I really can't prove it. I think that at the Rapture there might be a moment of death when the body is glorified. Of course then we have to ask about Lazarus and others Christ raised during His ministry, & those who rose at the time Christ was crucified & rose from the dead -- I think of these as resuscitated, not resurrected to a glorified body. It looks like some died twice.

Probably Heb 9 is a general statement.
Yes they were resurrected to continue Mortal Life. The First Resurrection described in this verse is talking about the Resurrection to Eternal Life in a Glorified body like HIS:

Revelation 20:6 (HCSB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of the Messiah, and they will reign with Him for 1,000 years.
 
E

ELECT

Guest
#34
I wish that the secret rapture theory should just be raptured away seriously
 

Word_Swordsman

Senior Member
Sep 16, 2014
1,666
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#35
The Lamb's wife is a city, the New Jerusalem Jesus is building for the children of God to enjoy with Jesus. Revelation 21:9-11 (KJV) [SUP]9 [/SUP] And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that
great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;


The Jewish culture around a bride (female) was used to describe some attributes of the Kingdom of God. Jesus IS the body of Christ, is likened to the ancient Jewish groom (male) by culture, but will not be marrying Himself. Our entry together into that great city will be initiated with a great feast like the ancient Jewish cultural feasting of a marriage between a man and woman.
The term "Bride of Christ" is not in the Bible, "bride" and "Christ" not in any verse. The Church is made up of the brethren of Christ, His friends.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
113
#36
I wish that the secret rapture theory should just be raptured away seriously
There is NO such thing as a Secret Rapture Theory. YES, HE said that no man will know the Day or the Hour that He comes to Call Out His Bride, but that in NO WAY makes it a secret.

John 14:3 (ASV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] And if I go and prepare a place for you, I come again, and will receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

THAT literally is what every Jewish Bridegroom said to the Bride right after she accepted his proposal, as he left the Bride's Old Dwelling Place, to go to his Father's House to build a New Dwelling Place for his Bride. NO SECRET THERE AT ALL.

Matthew 25:1-13 (HCSB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP]Then the kingdom of heaven {Notice it is NOT the 1000 Year Kingdom here on Earth.}
will be like 10 virgins who took their lamps and went out to meet the groom.
{NO SECRET HERE AT ALL, EITHER.}
[SUP]2 [/SUP] Five of them were foolish and five were sensible.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] When the foolish took their lamps, they didn’t take olive oil with them.
[SUP]4 [/SUP] But the sensible ones took oil in their flasks with their lamps.
[SUP]5 [/SUP] Since the groom was delayed, they all became drowsy and fell asleep.

[SUP]6 [/SUP] “In the middle of the night there was a shout:
Here’s the groom! Come out to meet him.’
[SUP]7 [/SUP] “Then all those virgins got up and trimmed their lamps.
[SUP]8 [/SUP] But the foolish ones said to the sensible ones, ‘Give us some of your oil, because our lamps are going out.’

[SUP]9 [/SUP]
“The sensible ones answered, ‘No, there won’t be enough for us and for you.
{Only those who KEEP READY, get to go to the Wedding of the Lamb.}
Go instead to those who sell, and buy oil for yourselves.’
[SUP]10 [/SUP] “When they had gone to buy some, the groom arrived. Then those who were ready went in with him to the wedding banquet, and the door was shut.

[SUP]11 [/SUP] “Later the rest of the virgins also came and said, ‘Master, master, open up for us!’

[SUP]12 [/SUP] “But he replied, ‘I assure you:
I do not know you! {That inner personal LOVE relationship that every born again Christian has with Christ when they submit to Him as LORD.}
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Therefore be alert, because you don’t know either the day or the hour.
{NOTICE: WE were to start KEEPING READY and WATCHING from that hour on.}

THE SECRET RAPTURE IDEA is a lie, made up by post tribbers,
while in reality;
the Calling Out of the BRIDE is a KNOWN PROPHESIED FACT.


1 Thessalonians 4:16-18 (HCSB)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the archangel’s voice
{
Here’s the groom! Come out to meet him.’}, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Then we who are still alive will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air and so we will always be with the Lord.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] Therefore encourage one another with these words.

1 Thessalonians 5:9 (NASB)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] For God has not destined us for wrath, but for obtaining salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ,

Revelation 3:10 (NASB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] 'Because you have kept the word of My perseverance, I also will keep you from the hour of testing, that hour which is about to come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth.


NO, it has NEVER BEEN A SECRET.
So you think you have to go through the Tribulation time?
So do I think you will
have to go through the Tribulation time.
Because ONLY those who KEEP READY, WATCHING AND EXPECTING
THE BRIDEGROOM to come and CALL US OUT at any time;
get to go to HEAVEN with HIM before the Tribulation begins,
FOR THE WEDDING OF THE LAMB.

 
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VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
4,615
113
#37
The Lamb's wife is a city, the New Jerusalem Jesus is building for the children of God to enjoy with Jesus. Revelation 21:9-11 (KJV) [SUP]9 [/SUP] And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that
great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;


The Jewish culture around a bride (female) was used to describe some attributes of the Kingdom of God. Jesus IS the body of Christ, is likened to the ancient Jewish groom (male) by culture, but will not be marrying Himself. Our entry together into that great city will be initiated with a great feast like the ancient Jewish cultural feasting of a marriage between a man and woman.
The term "Bride of Christ" is not in the Bible, "bride" and "Christ" not in any verse. The Church is made up of the brethren of Christ, His friends.
Revelation 21:2 (NASB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband.

The expression is describing how the NEW DWELLING PLACE is decorated in the same manor as a Bride deocorates herself; implying that is the LOCATION of the WEDDING, including the Wedding Chamber, not the Bride herself. THUS it is the inhabitants of the City who are the Bride. IT DOES NOT SAY as THE Bride. AND WHO are the inhabitants? O.T. Saints and N.T. Saints.

Isaiah 62:5 (NKJV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] For as a young man marries a virgin, So shall your sons marry you; And as the bridegroom rejoices over the bride, So shall your God rejoice over you.

NOTICE: The word "as" ahead of what I highlighted, is NOT IN THE ORIGINAL LANGUAGE MANUSCRIPT, that is what the italics mean. Therefore, TRUE BELIEVERS who had the Faith of Abraham, are part of the Bride, so is the Church, and the Tribulation Saints.

Ephesians 5:23 (HCSB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] for the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church. He is the Savior of the body.

Revelation 6:9-11 (NKJV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] And they cried with a loud voice, saying, "How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?"
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed.

Revelation 7:13-14 (NKJV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, "Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?"
[SUP]14 [/SUP] And I said to him, "Sir, you know." So he said to me, "These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
 
J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#38
Yes they were resurrected to continue Mortal Life. The First Resurrection described in this verse is talking about the Resurrection to Eternal Life in a Glorified body like HIS:

Revelation 20:6 (HCSB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of the Messiah, and they will reign with Him for 1,000 years.
With this scripture in mind, is it not perfect and remarkable that Enoch and Elijah neither died in their time, were raptured, but that the two witnesses to come will die? (They would not, in fact, be dying twice, therefore.)

Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment.

Though apocryphal, I've found this intriguing, anyway, from the Apocalypse of Peter,

And the Master (Lord) answered and said unto me: Understandest thou not that the fig-tree is the house of Israel? Even as a man that planted a fig-tree in his garden, and it brought forth no fruit. And he sought the fruit thereof many years and when he found it not, he said to the keeper of his garden: Root up this fig-tree that it make not our ground to be unfruitful. And the gardener said unto God: (Suffer us) to rid it of weeds and dig the ground round about it and water it. If then it bear not fruit, we will straightway remove its roots out of the garden and plant another in place of it. Hast thou not understood that the fig-tree is the house of Israel? Verily I say unto thee, when the twigs thereof have sprouted forth in the last days, then shall feigned Christs come and awake expectation saying: I am the Christ, that am now come into the world. And when they (Israel) shall perceive the wickedness of their deeds they shall turn away after them and deny him [whom our fathers did praise], even the first Christ whom they crucified and therein sinned a great sin. But this deceiver is not the Christ. And when they reject him he shall slay with the sword, and there shall be many martyrs. Then shall the twigs of the fig-tree, that is, the house of Israel, shoot forth: many shall become martyrs at his hand. Enoch and Elias shall be sent to teach them that this is the deceiver which must come into the world and do signs and wonders to deceive. And therefore shall they that die by his hand be martyrs, and shall be reckoned among the good and righteous martyrs who have pleased God in their life.
 
J

JesusIsAll

Guest
#39
The term "Bride of Christ" is not in the Bible, "bride" and "Christ" not in any verse. The Church is made up of the brethren of Christ, His friends.
Sure, let's just throw out the parable of the ten virgins and all references to Christ as the Bridegroom of actual people.
 

Word_Swordsman

Senior Member
Sep 16, 2014
1,666
100
48
#40
Sure, let's just throw out the parable of the ten virgins and all references to Christ as the Bridegroom of actual people.
Please don't do that! That parable teaches how Jesus will suddenly come back. That is all that parable is about.