Conditional Salvation

[mailmandan]

Quoting a text says nothing. It is the explanation and meaning of it that determines one's understanding. Your view cannot be found until after the Reformation which entails several false teachings as well.
You don't think that the Jehovah Witnesses can quote scripture as well?

I've listened to enough of your faulty human logic and your words which man's wisdom teaches. Fallible writings of men prove nothing. They can be wrong and history can be manipulated. I really don't care about your theories or your fallible writings that prove nothing.

*Now let's get to where the rubber meets the road.

I have stated numerous times that the Gospel is the "good news" of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4) and is the power of God unto salvation for everyone who BELIEVES.. (Romans 1:16). To believe the Gospel is to trust in Christ's finished work of redemption as the all sufficient means of our salvation.

*Now quit dodging my questions and answer them this time:

Is this the Gospel that you accept or do you believe that this is not the Gospel from the beginning? What do you believe the Gospel is and what do you believe it means to BELIEVE the Gospel?

 

[Radius]

You did not explain how one first becomes sinless do he can then be saved.


No one is saved while living in disobedience to God.

Again, John said he that continues to NOT do righteousness CONTINUES to NOT be of God. Therefore one must first do righteousness to be of God " he that doeth righteousness is righteous" 1 Jn 3:7 Nowhere does the bible say "he that doeth UNrighteousness is righteous.

Really, well Paul claims in Romans to keep doing the things he does not want to do (keeps sinning). This must confuse you so much when you come across this part of the Bible. I bet you want to erase this to make your life so much more in tune with what you want to believe.

 

[Jackson123]

About the sin,

I believe after have a faith in Jesus, we still do sin.

But I believe if we was rapist, Killer, and robber, where everyday think about to rob and to rape and to kill, now after have faith in Jesus we stop doing that we will feel sorry for what we do in the past. It may we fall once a while, but we will feel guilty and repent not do it for a while. David kill Urea for his wife, but after confront by Nathan, he cry and felt sorry.

Faith in Jesus will produce a good fruit.

 

[Bride]

About the sin,

I believe after have a faith in Jesus, we still do sin.

But I believe if we was rapist, Killer, and robber, where everyday think about to rob and to rape and to kill, now after have faith in Jesus we stop doing that we will feel sorry for what we do in the past. It may we fall once a while, but we will feel guilty and repent not do it for a while. David kill Urea for his wife, but after confront by Nathan, he cry and felt sorry.

Faith in Jesus will produce a good fruit.

Yeah, what's an occasional theft or rape or murder now and again since we still fall once in awhile...

 

[eternally-gratefull]

One is either doing unrighteousness or righteousness, no inbetween.

You have already said one is NOT saved by working righteousness. That must implies you are saying one must be saved by doing unrighteousness.

dude why are you here? all you do is promote hate and lies.

I am righteous IN CHRIST. Not in myself.

You are not righteous, you never will be, Unless like abraham, Rightiousness is credited to your account. Your righteousness is nothing but filthy rags, until you understand this, you will never know God

 

[Bride]

Really, well Paul claims in Romans to keep doing the things he does not want to do (keeps sinning). This must confuse you so much when you come across this part of the Bible. I bet you want to erase this to make your life so much more in tune with what you want to believe.

No. We just continue reading to the solution in Christ discussed in depth in Romans 8, that delivers from the Roman's 7 "under the law of sin and death" situation. Why does everybody stop reading the Bible at Romans 7 and avoid the continued explanation of HOW THINGS CHANGE in Christ?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I understand how free gifts can come with conditions. Your theology has forced you into a position where you have to purposely not understand such a simple. My conscience would not allow me to sleep at night if I had to deny obvious truths as Naaman's free gift of healing came with the condition of dipping yet the dipping did not earn him his free gift of healing.

Why does God not save EVERYONE that is drowning? God wants most men to drown?

Yeah God wants most men to drown. wow man are you serious? How can you live with yourself.

The fact is, You can not save yourself. Your already took you last breath, there is no strength left in you. SOMEONE HAS TO SAVE YOU.

so why are you still trying to save yourself. How can you do work, when you HAVE NO POWER??

A drowning man can not get baptized. HE NEEdS SAVED so he is ABLE to get baptized.

 

[Bride]

For you sinners who didn't realize that Romans 8 contains the deliverance suffered to a man under the law of Romans 7,.. so here it is...

(Rom 8:1)
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
(Rom 8:2)
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
(Rom 8:3)
For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
(Rom 8:4)
That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
(Rom 8:5)
For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
(Rom 8:6)
For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
(Rom 8:7)
Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
(Rom 8:8)
So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
(Rom 8:9)
But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
(Rom 8:10)
And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
(Rom 8:11)
But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
(Rom 8:12)
Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
(Rom 8:13)
For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.


There! See? No one who lives in Christ has any more concern of living as in Romans 7 Good news huh!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

For him maybe, because of His continual sinning against God. But it is evil and of the devil to accuse that that to everyone.

Those people who do that are called "accuser of the brethren" (devils) and have a lousy end:

(Rev 12:10)
And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

says the accuser. How many people have you accused?

The power of Christ. Not the power of Bride and Sea Bass.

But you people will probably never see this. You want to keep to much power and control yourself.

 

[mailmandan]

Yeah, what's an occasional theft or rape or murder now and again since we still fall once in awhile...

Proverbs 24:16 - For a righteous man may fall seven times and rise again, But the wicked shall fall by calamity. Did Peter fall when he denied Christ three times? Did Peter fall/stumble when he played the part of the hypocrite and was not straightforward about the truth of the gospel around the Jews in Galatians 2:11-15? No theft, rape or murder was involved.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

No verse says such a thing.

Heb 10:38,39 how can one draw back unto perdition if he were always in perdition? Evidently one must be first saved for him to go back unto perdition.

oh it does not? I even posted it for ya but you did not see it.

They departed from us, but they were NEVER OF US. For IF THEY WERE OF US, They NEVER WOULD HAVE DEPARTED

Great words of the apostle john.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You did not explain how one first becomes sinless do he can then be saved.


No one is saved while living in disobedience to God.

Again, John said he that continues to NOT do righteousness CONTINUES to NOT be of God. Therefore one must first do righteousness to be of God " he that doeth righteousness is righteous" 1 Jn 3:7 Nowhere does the bible say "he that doeth UNrighteousness is righteous.

He also said those born of God can not sin.

so you have a major problem.

if a christian can not live in sin, then he can not live in disobedience. or is that to hard for you to comprehend?

your stating something the apostle john said is impossible. why do you argue with him?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You have no valid argument for you REFUSE to understand free gifts can and do come with conditions.

so in other words, You made a claim against me, but can;t prove it.

Thanks, Go away please. You lie about others, you make false claims about them, and when confronted, you can never prove your things against them are true.

Yes, A condition is to receive the gift. I have said it over and over (another false claim against me) another reason for you to GO AWAY!

 

[ChristIsGod]

Can two walk together, except they be agreed?


I have no brothers or sisters that believe in eternal security.

Two opposite, contradictory mutually exclusive positions cannot be right, so someone is not following the truth of the bible.

Those in error will not be saved. The idea of "go along to get along" does not work and is condemned by the bible.

Well, I'm sorry that that makes just 2 things that you & I have disagreed on.

1st was your belief that a person that had just gave their lives completely to The LORD by faith but CAN'T get to water for some reason or another before they die are not saved. Sigh!

And 2ndly, now this statement quoted above.

You Do Not Know people Until you've been with them LONG ENOUGH. [not yelling at all, Brother - just need to get the main point out there].

I agree with that command to those who are of age that know WHO & what they have just commited their life to, to be baptized by immersion. BUT, I've Church hopped for all the years that I've been saved because I've moved so very many times since then that I've had no choice and actually have had The LORD to lead me to whatever churches were in those towns. Consevative all --- Methodists, Baptist, AoG, CoG, CoC, many non-denominationals with varied beliefs in each, PCA, Etc., and I found that each were full [not totally filled. Which are? None.] again, full with sincerely born-of-the Spirit of Christ humans in them. You'll ask me how I know they were/are saved .... by their love for HIM, for even their enemies but especially for the household of faith and how they lived their lives but most of all for their love of The Word of GOD. You can't 'counterfeit' His genuine Love & Love for His Word.

Just as I do not believe in the 'sinless-perfection' theory - I do not believe in the 'doctrinal perfection' belief neither.

We will Still be Learning all Through Eternity!

Bless you, Friend.

 

[newbirth]

dude why are you here? all you do is promote hate and lies.

I am righteous IN CHRIST. Not in myself.

You are not righteous, you never will be, Unless like abraham, Rightiousness is credited to your account. Your righteousness is nothing but filthy rags, until you understand this, you will never know God

Romans 6:13
Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.

 

[Brainfreeze]

Yeah, what's an occasional theft or rape or murder now and again since we still fall once in awhile...

Yes Ms. Bride, people love to take things out of context, say if one gets carried away at a celebration, drinks to much wine. This person gets drunk, he looks foolish and I call that sin, now if this person repents and remembers for next time. I believe this person is forgiven for their wrong. As for murdering and stealing there's a biggg difference, the COMMANDMENTS, say not to steal, commit adultery, murder, and so forth... Different penalties will apply as well. Again, God knows your heart.

 

[newbirth]

I've listened to enough of your faulty human logic and your words which man's wisdom teaches. Fallible writings of men prove nothing. They can be wrong and history can be manipulated. I really don't care about your theories or your fallible writings that prove nothing.

*Now let's get to where the rubber meets the road.

I have stated numerous times that the Gospel is the "good news" of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4) and is the power of God unto salvation for everyone who BELIEVES.. (Romans 1:16). To believe the Gospel is to trust in Christ's finished work of redemption as the all sufficient means of our salvation.

*Now quit dodging my questions and answer them this time:

Is this the Gospel that you accept or do you believe that this is not the Gospel from the beginning? What do you believe the Gospel is and what do you believe it means to BELIEVE the Gospel?

James 1:22
But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

 

[newbirth]

Yes Ms. Bride, people love to take things out of context, say if one gets carried away at a celebration, drinks to much wine. This person gets drunk, he looks foolish and I call that sin, now if this person repents and remembers for next time. I believe this person is forgiven for their wrong. As for murdering and stealing there's a biggg difference, the COMMANDMENTS, say not to steal, commit adultery, murder, and so forth... Different penalties will apply as well. Again, God knows your heart.

yea different penalties like ...the wages of sin is death.....unless your sins are forgiven the wage is death...

James 1:12-15King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
[SUP]14 [/SUP]But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

 

[Cassian]

I've listened to enough of your faulty human logic and your words which man's wisdom teaches. Fallible writings of men prove nothing. They can be wrong and history can be manipulated. I really don't care about your theories or your fallible writings that prove nothing.

*Now let's get to where the rubber meets the road.

I have stated numerous times that the Gospel is the "good news" of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4) and is the power of God unto salvation for everyone who BELIEVES.. (Romans 1:16). To believe the Gospel is to trust in Christ's finished work of redemption as the all sufficient means of our salvation.

*Now quit dodging my questions and answer them this time:

Is this the Gospel that you accept or do you believe that this is not the Gospel from the beginning? What do you believe the Gospel is and what do you believe it means to BELIEVE the Gospel?

I have already explained the Orthodox view. We believe whole heartedly in the texts you quoted of I Cor 15:1-4 and Rom 1:16.
We also believe that His finished work not just sufficient for our salvation, but in fact saved all men and the world from death sin and Satan. Christ's work makes it possible to be united in faith with Christ and to attain eternal life.

If you want a very detailed reason why we do not accept sola fide you can read the Book, Ausburg Confessions where Patriarch Jeremiah II rejected the overtures of the Tubningen Theologians (Lutherans) on the issue of sola fide

 

[Bride]

says the accuser. How many people have you accused?

The power of Christ. Not the power of Bride and Sea Bass.

But you people will probably never see this. You want to keep to much power and control yourself.

Perfect example lol, I knew I could count on you.