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God through Paul calls people who mix the Mosaic law with the Law of Christ fools, he does not say works are not required as the lazy ones that call themselves Christians sitting on the couch expecting God to save them while they do nothing.
You preach another Gospel, you have James and Paul contradicting each other in order to fit your man made doctrine :
Galatians 1:6-7 (NKJV) [SUP]6 [/SUP] I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, [SUP]7 [/SUP] which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ.
You preach another Gospel, you have James and Paul contradicting each other in order to fit your man made doctrine :
Galatians 1:6-7 (NKJV) [SUP]6 [/SUP] I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, [SUP]7 [/SUP] which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ.
Repeat of Post #488:
repent - to change one's mind I was an unbeliever, dead in sins. I heard the word of God and believed what I heard. That in turn lead me to godly sorrow [over my past sins] which lead to my repentance. This "change of mind" lead to "abhorrence of my past sins" into faith of my Lord Jesus Christ. All happened in one moment of time.
It is turning from an unbeliever into a believer - my mind changed and it changed for the better - isn't that what you have for the definition of repent?
2 Corinthians 7:10,11 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death. For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter.
I have no issues - Being born of the flesh - That which is born of the flesh is flesh - I am a child of my earthly parents [flesh] and belong in that family. Being born again of the Spirit - That which is born of the Spirit is spirit - I am a child of God and belong to the household of God.
As a child in my earthly family - I began to crawl, I began to walk, although stumbling often, later I began to walk with more balance, soon I began to run - all the while stumbling but stumbling less and less. As a child in my spiritual family - I began to crawl, I began to walk, although stumbling often, later I began to walk with more balance, soon I began to run - all the while stumbling but stumbling less and less.
That my friend is the Christian's walk - no problemo!
repent - to change one's mind I was an unbeliever, dead in sins. I heard the word of God and believed what I heard. That in turn lead me to godly sorrow [over my past sins] which lead to my repentance. This "change of mind" lead to "abhorrence of my past sins" into faith of my Lord Jesus Christ. All happened in one moment of time.
It is turning from an unbeliever into a believer - my mind changed and it changed for the better - isn't that what you have for the definition of repent?
2 Corinthians 7:10,11 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death. For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter.
I have no issues - Being born of the flesh - That which is born of the flesh is flesh - I am a child of my earthly parents [flesh] and belong in that family. Being born again of the Spirit - That which is born of the Spirit is spirit - I am a child of God and belong to the household of God.
As a child in my earthly family - I began to crawl, I began to walk, although stumbling often, later I began to walk with more balance, soon I began to run - all the while stumbling but stumbling less and less. As a child in my spiritual family - I began to crawl, I began to walk, although stumbling often, later I began to walk with more balance, soon I began to run - all the while stumbling but stumbling less and less.
That my friend is the Christian's walk - no problemo!
how can your eternal destiny be at stake when you can do as you please and still be secure...you teach you have nothing to lose..you have it all already......I teach faith without works is dead....you deny that scripture by saying that is not possible...I teach do not sin ...you deny that scripture and say.... we all sin as if that makes sin OK...
E
No what you are is blind (forgive me for name calling, But when you do things over and over, how else should I put it?
I never said you were name calling or judging anyone, yet you keep accusing me of it. Which PROVES you do not read anything anyone says.
When you actually answer. You have never answered. You have not said, "They do not have faith in God how could they", Or
they had faith, or have it but...."
Look at your posts. you have never said either.
So what your saying is, a person who rejects Gods word about sin and obedience does not have faith in God? Is that what your saying?
I never said you were name calling or judging anyone, yet you keep accusing me of it. Which PROVES you do not read anything anyone says.
When you actually answer. You have never answered. You have not said, "They do not have faith in God how could they", Or
they had faith, or have it but...."
Look at your posts. you have never said either.
So what your saying is, a person who rejects Gods word about sin and obedience does not have faith in God? Is that what your saying?
E
they do not remove those verses. the words fear in those verses can also be translated respect. that is a Godly fear. not the fear your preaching.
I respect (fear) my abba father, But I do not fear that he will kick me out of his family when I screw up I am his child and he loves me, He will chasten me, which will be painful, but I will grow by it.
You preach fear of the law. Because only the law says you can lose salvation if you do not stand up to its standard, the sad part is, you think You can live up to its standard, when you can not.
Your like the pharisees, You do not need Christ, Your good enough, Your not like the sinners, So You go around thinking God for that. While judging sinners.
Take heed Jesus showed who will enter the kingdom. Not the people who boast. but the people who get on their knees and seek Gods mercy and forgiveness.. That person will NEVER forget where he came from, And never wish to go back, FOr he KNOW how hopeless he was.
That is why Jesus said, I did not come to save the righteous (who think they are good enough based on their works) but the sinners.
E
Your wrong.
Paul spoke against works of any type.
He says it is those who are created in christ who do the works. But only those who are saved by faith apart from works.
He never stated the law anywhere in that passage, you are adding to the word of God. That is dangerous.
James is stating a fact. If you claim to have faith, But do not have the works paul said you WILL HAVE when you was saved BY FAITH, then your faith is dead, it can not save you, because it is no faith at all.
Paul spoke against works of any type.
He says it is those who are created in christ who do the works. But only those who are saved by faith apart from works.
He never stated the law anywhere in that passage, you are adding to the word of God. That is dangerous.
James is stating a fact. If you claim to have faith, But do not have the works paul said you WILL HAVE when you was saved BY FAITH, then your faith is dead, it can not save you, because it is no faith at all.
K
All you are doing is just reposting what is already been said by you, and not answering the question. But if you want to go by the scripture you gave lets look at that first part of 2 Corinthians;
For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation ( see here how it says to salvation, not that it gives salvation )
It is part of your walk as a believer after you have heard the word and believed in it, for if you believe in what you heard in the word you would obey it. Turning from your sins is part of repentance, it is not an act of its own.
Now back to my question again, when is a person truly saved ? I will post a few here that show not tell the end.
James 1:12
Blessed is the man who remains steadfast under trial, for when he has stood the test he will receive the crown of life, which God has promised to those who love him.
Matthew 24:10-13
And then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another. And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray. And because lawlessness will be increased, the love of many will grow cold. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
Matthew 10:22
And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
2 Peter 2:20-22
For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”
Hebrews 12:1-3
Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God. Consider him who endured from sinners such hostility against himself, so that you may not grow weary or fainthearted.
Hebrews 10:36
For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive what is promised.
Hebrews 6:4-6
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt.
Hebrews 3:12-14
Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end.
2 Timothy 4:2-8
Preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, and exhort, with complete patience and teaching. For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths. As for you, always be sober-minded, endure suffering, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry. For I am already being poured out as a drink offering, and the time of my departure has come.
1 Timothy 4:16
Keep a close watch on yourself and on the teaching. Persist in this, for by so doing you will save both yourself and your hearers.
1 Corinthians 9:24-25
Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one receives the prize? So run that you may obtain it. Every athlete exercises self-control in all things. They do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable.
Romans 11:19-22
Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God's kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off.
Mark 13:9-13
“But be on your guard. For they will deliver you over to councils, and you will be beaten in synagogues, and you will stand before governors and kings for my sake, to bear witness before them. And the gospel must first be proclaimed to all nations. And when they bring you to trial and deliver you over, do not be anxious beforehand what you are to say, but say whatever is given you in that hour, for it is not you who speak, but the Holy Spirit. And brother will deliver brother over to death, and the father his child, and children will rise against parents and have them put to death. And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
Revelation 20:12 (NKJV)
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books.
Sit on the couch and see if God saves you.
Those who stand before the Great White Throne judgment are all lost souls. Only those written in the book of life are passed from judgment into eternal life.
Stand before God as see if your works are good enough and remember them as you are cast into the lake of fire.
Saved by grace and name written in the book of life judged for your works cast into the lake of fire. Simple.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Stand before God as see if your works are good enough and remember them as you are cast into the lake of fire.
Saved by grace and name written in the book of life judged for your works cast into the lake of fire. Simple.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
No doubt and they erroneously assume that we do nothing for Jesus because we rightly believe that it is faith alone that saves us....judging our lives without knowing what all we have done for the Lord over the last 25 years like.....well, I listed a few things but decided to erase them as we are not to boast of the things we have done so our reward will be in heaven and not the praise of men....
E
Yep..
THE DEAD WERE JUDGED according to their works. No mention of being judged for their sin..And what HAPPENED TO THE DEAD?
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
So much for all your good works. see where it will get you.
You will be one of the ones screaming lf all your good works, when jesus tells you to depart. Notice how those alive in Christ will not be at that judgment. Maybe one day you will figure out what that is.
THE DEAD WERE JUDGED according to their works. No mention of being judged for their sin..And what HAPPENED TO THE DEAD?
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
So much for all your good works. see where it will get you.
You will be one of the ones screaming lf all your good works, when jesus tells you to depart. Notice how those alive in Christ will not be at that judgment. Maybe one day you will figure out what that is.
its works of the law bro.....
[SUP]9 [/SUP]And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]Only they would that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?
[SUP]15 [/SUP]We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,
[SUP]16 [/SUP]Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
[SUP]9 [/SUP]And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]Only they would that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?
[SUP]15 [/SUP]We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,
[SUP]16 [/SUP]Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.