Is there anything in the bible that is scientifically inaccurate?

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T

Tintin

Guest
#81
#81
Kerry said:
The dimensions given in the bible is not a cube. The reason people are trying to say it is a cube is because that is what Muslims march around and praise in Mecca good try no dice.
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No, it's because the world at large tells Christians that the ark from Genesis was based on the Gilgamesh myth which in includes a cube-shaped boat to preserve life during a great flood. The problem is that a cube is a terrible shape for a boat and that part of the myth is a very late addition to the Gilgamesh saga.
 
posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#82
Jul 31, 2013
38,931
13,915
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#82
you got me on a source to show definitively whether the ark's dimensions are good for stability. do you know enough of the physics that we can figure out the math ourselves? this is what i've been told and may just be an 'urban rumor' among believers. we do have some of those, for sure :)

but i did find this chart of modern tanker sizes:

[TABLE="class: standardTbl"]
[TR="class: application"]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Class[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Length[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Beam[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Draft[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Overview[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Coastal Tanker[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]205 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]29 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]16 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Less than 50,000 dwt, mainly used for transportation of refined products (gasoline, gasoil).[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Aframax[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]245 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]34 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]20 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Approximately 80,000 dwt (Average Freight Rate Assessment).[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Suezmax[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]285 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]45 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]23 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Between 125,000 and 180,000 dwt, originally the maximum capacity of the Suez Canal.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]VLCC[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]330 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]55 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]28 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Very Large Crude Carrier. Up to around 320,000 dwt. Some can be accommodated by the expanded dimensions of the Suez Canal. The most common length is in the range of 300 to 330 meters.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]ULCC[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]415 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]63 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]35 m[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: white"]Ultra Large Crude Carrier. Capacity exceeding 320,000 dwt. The largest tankers ever built have a deadweight of over 550,000 dwt.[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Tanker Size

a tanker is a good sort of ship to compare to if we don't care to do the physics ourselves, i think, and research comes up short. the ark wasn't concerned with fuel economy or speed like modern ships are, but cargo capacity and stability. i think tankers are alike in this - capacity and stability for this class are also prime concerns. of course their dimensions have economy and speed and other constraints too.
if you calculate the ratios of these ships, they are not far from 1/6. that doesn't prove anything, but it does show that the dimensions of the ark aren't ridiculous for what it was.
 
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JimmieD

JimmieD

Senior Member
#83
Apr 11, 2014
895
18
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#83
Tintin said:
God designed the ark, Noah and his family built the ark. Why do you find it so difficult to believe this part of God's Word?
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The argument was that the ark's design was ideal. The argument was not on whether or not Noah's ark was an actual event.
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#84
#84
Tintin said:
No, it's because the world at large tells Christians that the ark from Genesis was based on the Gilgamesh myth which in includes a cube-shaped boat to preserve life during a great flood. The problem is that a cube is a terrible shape for a boat and that part of the myth is a very late addition to the Gilgamesh saga.
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So why are you promoting a myth?
 
posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#85
Jul 31, 2013
38,931
13,915
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#85
JimmieD said:
Descriptions of naval ship design are contained in official ship drawings which are held by places like Bath Iron Works, not in fact sheets.
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do you think the Genesis account is more like an official ship drawing listing in minute detail every radius and length, or more like a fact sheet?

i'm just as interested as you to see the Almighty's blueprints, for a lot of things.

:)
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#86
#86
nogard said:
Okay, looks like the bat thing wasn't too impressive, how about these scientific contradictions.

1. Proverbs 6:6-8
Claim: Ants have no commander, no overseer, no ruler.
Contradiction: Ants live in colonies which contain ranks and authority. And they have a queen.

2. Leviticus 11:20-23
Claim: There are insects with wings that have four legs.
Contradiction: There are no creatures on earth that have both four legs and wings. Plus, insects are classified as having six legs.

3. Leviticus 11:6
Claim: Rabbits chew their cud.
Contradiction: Rabbits, are lagomorphs, not ruminants; they do not chew their cud.

4. Matthew 13:31-32
Claim: The mustard seed is the smallest of all seeds.
Contradiction: The mustard seed is not the smallest seed. The orchid seed is smaller.

5. James 5:3
Claim: Gold is corrosive.
Contradiction: Gold is not corrosive.

6. John 12:24
Claim: If a kernel of wheat falls to the ground and dies, it will produce many seeds.
Contradiction: Dead seeds do not produce new seeds.

Have fun!
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Personally, I don't know the answers, but I've browsed these two books concerning the supposed contradictions within God's Word and both of them look great. And more importantly, they're both available to be viewed online for free. Just look through the Contents for the questions you want answered.

Book 1:
https://answersingenesis.org/answers/books/demolishing-supposed-bible-contradictions-1/

Book 2:
https://answersingenesis.org/answers/books/demolishing-supposed-bible-contradictions-2/
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#87
#87
A cubit is 18 inches and by this design is no cube

15 And this is the fashion which thou shalt make it of: The length of the ark shall be three hundred cubits, the breadth of it fifty cubits, and the height of it thirty cubits.
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#88
#88
JimmieD said:
The argument was that the ark's design was ideal. The argument was not on whether or not Noah's ark was an actual event.
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Fair enough, mate.
 
JimmieD

JimmieD

Senior Member
#89
Apr 11, 2014
895
18
18
#89
posthuman said:

do you think the Genesis account is more like an official ship drawing listing in minute detail every radius and length, or more like a fact sheet?

i'm just as interested as you to see the Almighty's blueprints, for a lot of things.

:)
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I honestly don't think the dimensions of Noah's ark are significant. It's beside the point of the story.

It's like arguing if Mr. Myagi's father was 5'6 or 5"8. It's not the point of Karate Kid.
 
K

Kerry

Guest
#90
#90
oh I love you tin, you are my brother no matter what.
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#91
#91
Kerry said:
So why are you promoting a myth?
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I'm not promoting a myth. I'm saying that too many Christians have listened to what the world says and not enough about what God says. First evolutionary bull and then this. We need to have answers when people question God's Word. Revelation and Reason. A well-reasoned faith is a worthwhile faith. The Holy Spirit guides, but we must still use our God-given brains.
 
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posthuman

posthuman

Senior Member
#92
Jul 31, 2013
38,931
13,915
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#92
JimmieD said:
I honestly don't think the dimensions of Noah's ark are significant. It's beside the point of the story.

It's like arguing if Mr. Myagi's father was 5'6 or 5"8. It's not the point of Karate Kid.
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you're the one who said it was a cube

*shrug*

no harm done :)

& you're right. that's not the point. how about that Noah didn't intend to steer the thing himself? ( ! )


 
K

Kerry

Guest
#93
#93
Tintin said:
I'm not promoting a myth. I'm saying that too many Christians have listened to what the world says and not enough about what God says. First evolutionary bull and then this. We need to have answers when people question God's Word. Revelation and Reason. A well-reasoned faith is a worthwhile faith. The Holy Spirit guides, but we must still use our God-given brains.
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Well you pig brained so and so, you are correct. Throw a shrimp on the barbie for me. Maybe I come see you some day and if I do I want grilled shrimp and some kinda grilled fish or braised kangaroo or just your company. I thank God for tin tin doncha you all.

If not I will see you there, amen.
 
JimmieD

JimmieD

Senior Member
#94
Apr 11, 2014
895
18
18
#94
posthuman said:

you're the one who said it was a cube

*shrug*
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No, a previous post said it was the best ship design. If we take it as described in Genesis, it's not. If we take Genesis as you did, so that it's more like a fact sheet, then we don't have the plans and can't conclude that it's the best ship design.

But it's not the point. It's not a scientific document; it's not intended to be a detailed drawing on how to build a big ship.
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#95
#95
Kerry said:
Well you pig brained so and so, you are correct. Throw a shrimp on the barbie for me. Maybe I come see you some day and if I do I want grilled shrimp and some kinda grilled fish or braised kangaroo or just your company. I thank God for tin tin doncha you all.

If not I will see you there, amen.
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Haha! Love you too, brother! :D
 
N

nogard

Senior Member
#96
Aug 21, 2013
331
2
0
#96
Tintin said:
Personally, I don't know the answers, but I've browsed these two books concerning the supposed contradictions within God's Word and both of them look great. And more importantly, they're both available to be viewed online for free. Just look through the Contents for the questions you want answered.

Book 1:
https://answersingenesis.org/answers/books/demolishing-supposed-bible-contradictions-1/

Book 2:
https://answersingenesis.org/answers/books/demolishing-supposed-bible-contradictions-2/
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Why does there have to be answers? Can't they just be accepted as what they are. Jesus said the mustard seed was the smallest of all seeds. It turns out it is not. Woops, he made a mistake. He probably didn't know about the orchid seed. Why does any other defense have to be given?

Now, I admit, other contradictions are a little more hard to shrug off. Leviticus 11 is supposedly direct language from God. Leviticus 11:1 starts off saying, "Now the Lord spoke to Moses and Aaron, saying to them,"

So this should be pretty flawless stuff. No contradictions should be found here. Yet God makes a mistake in saying that flying insects have four feet, when they obviously have six feet. Verse 23 specifically says "[SUP]23 [/SUP]But all other flying insects which have four feet shall be an abomination to you." There are no flying insect with four feet...so...why would he say this.....

I guess I can see why it's important for y'all to brush these contradictions aside rather than stare them in the face.
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#97
#97
nogard said:
Why does there have to be answers? Can't they just be accepted as what they are. Jesus said the mustard seed was the smallest of all seeds. It turns out it is not. Woops, he made a mistake. He probably didn't know about the orchid seed. Why does any other defense have to be given?

Now, I admit, other contradictions are a little more hard to shrug off. Leviticus 11 is supposedly direct language from God. Leviticus 11:1 starts off saying, "Now the Lord spoke to Moses and Aaron, saying to them,"

So this should be pretty flawless stuff. No contradictions should be found here. Yet God makes a mistake in saying that flying insects have four feet, when they obviously have six feet. Verse 23 specifically says "[SUP]23 [/SUP]But all other flying insects which have four feet shall be an abomination to you." There are no flying insect with four feet...so...why would he say this.....

I guess I can see why it's important for y'all to brush these contradictions aside rather than stare them in the face.
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Are you really saying Jesus didn't know about the orchid seed? What poppycock! Jesus was with His Father and Holy Spirit when the Triune God created everything, including the orchids. Also, have you not heard of the praying mantis etc? They walk on four feet. Most other insects could be eaten. It's not rocket science.
 
T

Tintin

Guest
#98
#98
nogard said:
Why does there have to be answers? Can't they just be accepted as what they are. Jesus said the mustard seed was the smallest of all seeds. It turns out it is not. Woops, he made a mistake. He probably didn't know about the orchid seed. Why does any other defense have to be given?

Now, I admit, other contradictions are a little more hard to shrug off. Leviticus 11 is supposedly direct language from God. Leviticus 11:1 starts off saying, "Now the Lord spoke to Moses and Aaron, saying to them,"

So this should be pretty flawless stuff. No contradictions should be found here. Yet God makes a mistake in saying that flying insects have four feet, when they obviously have six feet. Verse 23 specifically says "[SUP]23 [/SUP]But all other flying insects which have four feet shall be an abomination to you." There are no flying insect with four feet...so...why would he say this.....

I guess I can see why it's important for y'all to brush these contradictions aside rather than stare them in the face.
Click to expand...
You're right, such things should be taken on faith but there are also answers for those who need to appeal to reason. Finally, no-one's brushing aside contradictions. I provided you with a link to two books worth of answers. If you can't be bothered browsing through them, that's not my problem.
 
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nogard

Senior Member
#99
Aug 21, 2013
331
2
0
#99
Tintin said:
Are you really saying Jesus didn't know about the orchid seed? What poppycock! Jesus was with His Father and Holy Spirit when the Triune God created everything, including the orchids. Also, have you not heard of the praying mantis etc? They walk on four feet. Most other insects could be eaten. It's not rocket science.
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So if Jesus knew about the orchid seed, why didn't he say that was the smallest seed?

Also, who said anything about walking on four feet? God said in Leviticus 11:23, insects that HAVE four feet. If you satisfied yourself with that uninspring dismissal to that contradiction then I feel sorry for you. And don't forget that God also said that rabbits chew their cud in Leviticus 11 as well. That is also utterly and completely untrue.
 
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K

Kerry

Guest
#100
#100
Jesus knew about spores that seed mushrooms but the people He was speaking to the mustard seed was the smallest they knew. Get a grip folks.
 
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