THE GREAT DEBATE...LAW AND GRACE

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M

Mitspa

Guest
#1,101
#1,101
Here is hypocrisy...to judge others by a standard you do not keep and cannot keep yourself...Now there is nothing wrong with wanting to keep the law...that's good! the issue with God is when you judge others by the law you do not keep yourself...you see there is something evil in the heart of a person that would condemn another person by a standard they do not keep.. Fear the Lord..find the standard of love and then you will never judge another in such a wicked way.
 
Hizikyah

Hizikyah

Senior Member
#1,102
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
#1,102
Hebrews 10:16, "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says Yahweh: I will put My Law into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them."

the word Law is: 3551. nomos
nomos: that which is assigned, hence usage, law
 
P

passinthru

Guest
#1,103
#1,103
Kerry said:
And if you break one you have broken them all.
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Yep...and that would mean we are all doomed :). It's all about what Jesus did folks!! When we accept that we are a new creation and not under the law. The law was man's schoolmaster. What did it teach us as a schoolmaster? If you want to ge t an A the answer is it taught us that we cannot keep the law. Jesus did and he paid the sacrifice for us so that we could be saved FROM the law of sin and death. This is Love and grace ... we do good works but they do not earn the gift that has already been given.
 
K

kennethcadwell

Guest
#1,104
#1,104
Kerry said:
I will ask again. If it were possible for man to keep them. Then why did Jesus die on the Cross?
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Because the law did not forgive people of sins, it was a tutor to show us our sinful ways to lead us to the only sacrifice that can truly forgive our sins. And that is through our Lord Jesus Christ.
Lord Jesus coming to die for our sins had nothing to do with being able to keep or not keep the law, plus you have to remember that the Jews also had 613 laws to go by in the mosaic covenant. All those 613 laws, written ordinances do not apply to new covenant believers. This is why Paul got on Peter, because he was trying to push the old traditional laws on new covenant converts.
I do not find having God as my only God hard, nor do I find it hard to not make idols, use His name in vain, honor my parents, not murder, not steal, not bear false witness. None of them do I find hard.

The not commit adultery is still a struggle when you go by the Lords standard, but I am being perfected by Him and if I start having those bad thoughts. I stop them before they rise and take control and then become action.

The not covet is another thing that is being perfected in me by Him. As He is teaching me how to completely satisfied with what I have and not want more. He has humbled me.

Keeping the Sabbath holy is not hard, but this one I singled out because it determines how one looks at the Sabbath still.
Some debate Saturday, some Sunday, and others we give every day to God. Plus the other way that some of us look at it is that Lord Jesus is our Sabbath rest now. In Him we have our rest.

By giving each day to Him, and showing that in my walk to follow His guidance to perfect me in the faith I feel as though I am obeying the greatest command to love Him with all my heart, soul, mind. I am letting Him guide me to better my life.

Then not holding no ill will, or hatred toward others I am following the love thy neighbor.
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#1,105
#1,105
Do folks understand what they really desire when they say a person is not saved or cannot be saved? Many seem to rejoice in that others may be condemned? They condemn others even as they are full on sin themselves...what is wrong with such a heart that it would desire to see another soul lost and suffer eternal damnation? Its sad it does grieve the Spirit of grace.
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#1,106
#1,106
kennethcadwell said:
Because the law did not forgive people of sins, it was a tutor to show us our sinful ways to lead us to the only sacrifice that can truly forgive our sins. And that is through our Lord Jesus Christ.
Lord Jesus coming to die for our sins had nothing to do with being able to keep or not keep the law, plus you have to remember that the Jews also had 613 laws to go by in the mosaic covenant. All those 613 laws, written ordinances do not apply to new covenant believers. This is why Paul got on Peter, because he was trying to push the old traditional laws on new covenant converts.
I do not find having God as my only God hard, nor do I find it hard to not make idols, use His name in vain, honor my parents, not murder, not steal, not bear false witness. None of them do I find hard.

The not commit adultery is still a struggle when you go by the Lords standard, but I am being perfected by Him and if I start having those bad thoughts. I stop them before they rise and take control and then become action.

The not covet is another thing that is being perfected in me by Him. As He is teaching me how to completely satisfied with what I have and not want more. He has humbled me.

Keeping the Sabbath holy is not hard, but this one I singled out because it determines how one looks at the Sabbath still.
Some debate Saturday, some Sunday, and others we give every day to God. Plus the other way that some of us look at it is that Lord Jesus is our Sabbath rest now. In Him we have our rest.

By giving each day to Him, and showing that in my walk to follow His guidance to perfect me in the faith I feel as though I am obeying the greatest command to love Him with all my heart, soul, mind. I am letting Him guide me to better my life.

Then not holding no ill will, or hatred toward others I am following the love thy neighbor.
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Do you keep the law? give us the biblical standard you keep ...or stop trying to teach others
 
K

kennethcadwell

Guest
#1,107
#1,107
Mitspa said:
Here is hypocrisy...to judge others by a standard you do not keep and cannot keep yourself...Now there is nothing wrong with wanting to keep the law...that's good! the issue with God is when you judge others by the law you do not keep yourself...you see there is something evil in the heart of a person that would condemn another person by a standard they do not keep.. Fear the Lord..find the standard of love and then you will never judge another in such a wicked way.
Click to expand...

Who condemned another ?
 
Hizikyah

Hizikyah

Senior Member
#1,108
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
#1,108
Mitspa said:
Do folks understand what they really desire when they say a person is not saved or cannot be saved? Many seem to rejoice in that others may be condemned? They condemn others even as they are full on sin themselves...what is wrong with such a heart that it would desire to see another soul lost and suffer eternal damnation? Its sad it does grieve the Spirit of grace.
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Dang..

That's out there... Who said that? or did nobody say that and you are just throwing random unfounded accusations hoping they stick?
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#1,109
#1,109
Hizikyah said:
Hebrews 10:16, "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says Yahweh: I will put My Law into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them."

the word Law is: 3551. nomos
nomos: that which is assigned, hence usage, law
Click to expand...
How about you...what biblical standard do you keep...not break...keep? we know you are a sinner...so how can you judge others by a standard you do not keep?
 
K

kennethcadwell

Guest
#1,110
#1,110
Mitspa said:
Do you keep the law? give us the biblical standard you keep ...or stop trying to teach others
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Obviously by this response you once again did not even read what I posted.
 
K

kennethcadwell

Guest
#1,111
#1,111
Hizikyah said:
Dang..

That's out there... Who said that? or did nobody say that and you are just throwing random unfounded accusations hoping they stick?
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That is what I asked to. Who condemned another, or is it just another reading more into something that was not said.
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#1,112
#1,112
Hizikyah said:
Dang..

That's out there... Who said that? or did nobody say that and you are just throwing random unfounded accusations hoping they stick?
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Why do you like to condemn people? does it make you feel good?
 
K

kennethcadwell

Guest
#1,113
#1,113
passinthru said:
I love God and I know he loves me more. Loving neighbor as myself can have it's challenges but it is easy if we focus on others and not self. Are there struggles? Yes of course. And from time to time we all slip here and there. Does God condemn us for this? No. However we can feel pretty crummy when we slip here and there. I praise God daily for his grace and his love towards us. We are all on a journey of sorts and sometimes we take a wrong turn here or there but he is faithful as a loving father to his kids. Sheep are not the brightest animal on the planet but they certainly do trust their Shepard. Did this make sense ? :)
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Thank you for giving a straight answer as that is all I asked, for others to say what commandments they find hard to keep and why ?
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#1,116
#1,116
kennethcadwell said:
Thank you for giving a straight answer as that is all I asked, for others to say what commandments they find hard to keep and why ?
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Well it don't matter if you break one you break them all...and you cant keep them most of the day and real good on sunday... What part of the royal law of love is hard for you? the part where you don't judge others by standards you cant keep?
 
Hizikyah

Hizikyah

Senior Member
#1,117
Aug 25, 2013
11,634
372
0
#1,117
Mitspa said:
How about you...what biblical standard do you keep...not break...keep? we know you are a sinner...so how can you judge others by a standard you do not keep?
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First quote where I judged someone? If you can not I ask you apologize for misrepresenting me, as you have done multiple times in the past few days...

and calling a sin a sin is not judgement of a person.

"what biblical standard do you keep...not break...keep?"

I fully submit to every Instruction of Yahweh that applies to me, a Law for a woman or a priest does not apply, every other Law does apply to me.

AM I perfect? No. But that doesnt mean I reject all righteous instruction. That would be error unto death.

Luke 16:17, "But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one yodh of the Law to fail."

Mattithyah 5:19, "Whosoever, therefore, will break one of the least of these Laws, and will teach men so, he will be called the least in the Kingdom of Yahweh; but whosoever will do and teach them, the same will be called great in the Kingdom of Yahweh."



Isayah 8:20, "To the Law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them."

Revelation 12:17, "And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and went to make war with those who forsook her seed; her seed being those who keep the Laws of Yahweh, and have the testimony of Yahshua Messiah."

"Laws" is word #1785 entolé
Definition: an ordinance, injunction, command, law.

You seem to be fighting those who seek obedience as Revelation 12:17 foretold.
 
A

authorgracebook

Guest
#1,119
#1,119
That which was done away refers to the Old Covenant, not the 10 Commandments. Compare Jer. 31:31-33 with Heb. 8:8-10 and you will see the same law is now in our HEARTS under the New Covenant. The law only changed to make it more difficult to keep in the Spirit, not the letter, by the GRACE that is JESUS, the empowerment to KEEP THE LAW.
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#1,120
#1,120
Hizikyah said:
First quote where I judged someone? If you can not I ask you apologize for misrepresenting me, as you have done multiple times in the past few days...

and calling a sin a sin is not judgement of a person.

"what biblical standard do you keep...not break...keep?"

I fully submit to every Instruction of Yahweh that applies to me, a Law for a woman or a priest does not apply, every other Law does apply to me.

AM I perfect? No. But that doesnt mean I reject all righteous instruction. That would be error unto death.

Luke 16:17, "But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one yodh of the Law to fail."

Mattithyah 5:19, "Whosoever, therefore, will break one of the least of these Laws, and will teach men so, he will be called the least in the Kingdom of Yahweh; but whosoever will do and teach them, the same will be called great in the Kingdom of Yahweh."



Isayah 8:20, "To the Law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them."

Revelation 12:17, "And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and went to make war with those who forsook her seed; her seed being those who keep the Laws of Yahweh, and have the testimony of Yahshua Messiah."

"Laws" is word #1785 entolé
Definition: an ordinance, injunction, command, law.

You seem to be fighting those who seek obedience as Revelation 12:17 foretold.
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So you cant tell others a standard you keep but only that they are under a law that you don't keep?
 
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