Dear Church, Here’s Why People Are Really Leaving You

[phil112]

There is a lot of truth in what this man says, sadly enough.

Dear Church, Here’s Why People Are Really Leaving You - ChurchPlants

 

[1still_waters]

I always find it hard to disagree with a man holding a chainsaw.

 

[BradC]

The cross will always be the main reason that we follow Christ or not. The cross will always cause a division in the heart that will crucify the flesh or we will forsake it and go on in the way of the flesh. The church is the body of Christ with many local assemblies that make up one body with Christ as the head. That body will go through trials and testings and will have persecutions ans afflictions. Some will leave, some will leave ans come back and some will be faithful because they know God and trust in His promises. We are never to look at the body of Christ, the church, through the natural mind or think of it as some organization only. We are to see it by faith as a living organism with the life of God within each member.

Those who are continually critical of the church and body of Christ have a problem with being content. There are those who are called to a local assembly but refuse to obey God and become a joint participant with others. There are still others that remain independent of the body and do their own thing because they love this present world. Finally, there is the legalist that likes to legislate what the church should be who condemn and shame others who don't line up with it.

Pray for the local assembly and thank God for every member of it. Pray for the pastors and teachers of these assemblies for they are not perfect and are growing just like others. Pray for the unity of the Spirit and for the edification of the body so that believers can have the unity of the faith. Always look at Christ as the head of each local expression of the body of Christ with its many members, yet one body. Edify, build up, walk by faith and in the lights and always bestow more honor on them who are less honorable and heap comliness on those who are less comely.

 

[GrandHoboMaster]

The worst sin is attempt to speak from behalve of the Lord.
Locating oneself on the place of God is the initial sin by which Eve and Adam were been seduced.

Lord knows better than anyone, who are the church (what, acctually is Church) .
And also He confessed in the Testaments that no one (who was with Him from the beggining) will be lost.

 

[Hizikyah]

The worst sin is attempt to speak from behalve of the Lord.
Locating oneself on the place of God is the initial sin by which Eve and Adam were been seduced.

Lord knows better than anyone, who are the church (what, acctually is Church) .
And also He confessed in the Testaments that no one (who was with Him from the beggining) will be lost.

I have to say this bothers me, especially when a lot of the times what is being spoken is in direct opposition to what Scripture says.

I was invited to a church by a number of people, because they had a "prophet", or so they said. They kept trying to get me to meet with the "prophet" and church leaders.... finally I had a few dinners and phone calls with them, to sum everything up, I was invited to be a leader of their curch and told that I was going to be rich and famous writing books and being on "religious" tv stations. LOL. The so called "prophet" never said anything about doing Yah will, it was all, ohh things are going to be so great, but no talk of what He wanted.... modern day soothsayers. and yet this place had over 70 members that gave money to these "leaders"

just explaining 1 reason why I agree.

 

[phil112]

I always find it hard to disagree with a man holding a chainsaw.

I would say that is generally good wisdom.
Now, if you can convince some others here to stop being argumentative................

 

[Joidevivre]

Having been around for over 60 years, and in many churches because of moving, etc., I have observed that the most dissension is around the Holy Spirit. Some want to just teach about Him - some want to accept a few of His gifts - and others want Him to have free manifestation in their services as He wills.

I have seen people leaving churches because they have grown in spiritual ways and in a way have "outgrown" their church for lack of a better word. Some just need a different teacher. A lot of people have found that small home groups have been more
meaningful to them, both in bible discussions, and being prayed for personally. I see more and more people moving in that direction.

We once left a few churches because for 6 months, we never heard a sermon about Jesus - just about what we "should do or not do -or do better" I kept waiting for the focus to be on Jesus just once, and yet it stayed on how we live.

I think when people leave a church service, they should have spent quality time meditating on the many attributes of Christ and what He gives us and who He is for/to us. A greater awareness of Jesus is what changes people's lives. You become what you focus on. And if the focus is on yourself all the time, it is a dead end.

 

[Utah]

The cross will always be the main reason that we follow Christ or not. The cross will always cause a division in the heart that will crucify the flesh or we will forsake it and go on in the way of the flesh. The church is the body of Christ with many local assemblies that make up one body with Christ as the head. That body will go through trials and testings and will have persecutions ans afflictions. Some will leave, some will leave ans come back and some will be faithful because they know God and trust in His promises. We are never to look at the body of Christ, the church, through the natural mind or think of it as some organization only. We are to see it by faith as a living organism with the life of God within each member.

Those who are continually critical of the church and body of Christ have a problem with being content. There are those who are called to a local assembly but refuse to obey God and become a joint participant with others. There are still others that remain independent of the body and do their own thing because they love this present world. Finally, there is the legalist that likes to legislate what the church should be who condemn and shame others who don't line up with it.

Pray for the local assembly and thank God for every member of it. Pray for the pastors and teachers of these assemblies for they are not perfect and are growing just like others. Pray for the unity of the Spirit and for the edification of the body so that believers can have the unity of the faith. Always look at Christ as the head of each local expression of the body of Christ with its many members, yet one body. Edify, build up, walk by faith and in the lights and always bestow more honor on them who are less honorable and heap comliness on those who are less comely.

Big handclap regarding the red bolded letters. Modern day Pharisees who are themselves stumbling blocks. They harm people's relationships with Christ, causing many people to either walk away from the faith or discourage them to never embrace the faith in the first place.

God walked among us and we killed Him, (obviously He rose again) but we've been killing His gift of grace ever since.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Good article.

I agree, people are leaving the church, because the church has nothing to offer them but ritual, tradition and self righteousness. it has become a sunday/wed social meeting with only select people allowed in. and not a 24/7 function of people being used by the power of God to serve others.

It stopped being the body of Christ serving each other, serving others, and making sacrifices for the world.

 

[Chopper]

How about adding the corporation syndrome to it... all of them are very similar, pews and pulpit, with one guy preaching and all the rest listening as if this one guy was our high priest, to which he is not, that position belongs to Yahushua.

Should not the House of Elohim be more like it was in the day, where it was someone different each time reading from the scriptures? We should not be subjected to just one group or person's view of the scriptures, because all parts of the body are needed.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

How about adding the corporation syndrome to it... all of them are very similar, pews and pulpit, with one guy preaching and all the rest listening as if this one guy was our high priest, to which he is not, that position belongs to Yahushua.

Should not the House of Elohim be more like it was in the day, where it was someone different each time reading from the scriptures? We should not be subjected to just one group or person's view of the scriptures, because all parts of the body are needed.

if we look at the book of acts. they did not meet at a building, they met in each others homes. And not just on sunday and wed, they met continually, breaking bread, fellow shipping, doctrine and prayer.

not sure where the building concept came from. most likely from the pegans when the roman church changed the christian church to a pagan church.

 

[Angela53510]

People come to church for a variety of reasons, but fellowship is one of the highest reasons people come to churches. The goal of any church is to bring people to the Lord through equipping the saints to do this work.

If people come to a church, and there are tight cliques and no one is friendly, they won't stay for more than one service. The preaching can be great, the music wonderful, but what brings people back to church is a sense of belonging and their needs being met.

I truly believe that disciplehship is the way to move a congregation forward, so they are reaching out to the comunity, and people are coming to the Lord. Churches should not be about sheep stealing, but rather about the church growing through an effective outreach program, in which all the members are involved. This can include "attractional" events. But the main emphasis should be reaching our neighbours.

And as Jesus says in the parable of the good Samaritan, a neighbour is anyone in our reach.

So how much are you praying and caring for your neighbour?

 

[Yet]

if we look at the book of acts. they did not meet at a building, they met in each others homes. And not just on sunday and wed, they met continually, breaking bread, fellow shipping, doctrine and prayer.

not sure where the building concept came from. most likely from the pegans when the roman church changed the christian church to a pagan church.

Constantine in about 326ad pronounced all of Rome/Roma christian. He intermingled paganism with Christianity and dubbed the pagan temples churches. Lo and behold ....church buildings. The Catholic Church. Christianity downhill ever since.

 

[Joidevivre]

I know that I go for good "meat on the bone" teaching mostly. And the corporate worship where God's presence seems somehow magnified in our midst.

If no one spoke to me, and the things I just spoke of were there, I would not leave that church. But I would find other Christians (who might even go to other churches) to spend time with in meaningful discussions, prayer, and just plain fun.

If a poll was taken, you find so many reasons why we seek out certain churches. And why we leave. But, in the long run, aren't we all in actually one church? One body, just broken up into little sections here and there.

 

[Hizikyah]

I know that I go for good "meat on the bone" teaching mostly. And the corporate worship where God's presence seems somehow magnified in our midst.

If no one spoke to me, and the things I just spoke of were there, I would not leave that church. But I would find other Christians (who might even go to other churches) to spend time with in meaningful discussions, prayer, and just plain fun.

If a poll was taken, you find so many reasons why we seek out certain churches. And why we leave. But, in the long run, aren't we all in actually one church? One body, just broken up into little sections here and there.

1 Corinthians 12:12-18, "For just as the body is a unity, but yet has many members; and though all its members are many, they are one body: so it is with Messiah. For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body--whether Yahdaim or Greeks, whether slaves or free--and have all been made to drink into one Spirit; For the body is not one member, but many. If the foot should say: Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? And if the aear should say: Because I am not the eye, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? If the whole body were an eye, where would be the sense of hearing? If the whole were hearing, where would be the sense of smelling? But now Yahweh has set the members, each one of them in the body, as it has pleased Him."

Phillipians 3:20, "But our citizenship is in heaven, out from which we also eagerly wait for our Ruler, Yahshua Messiah the King."

 

[Joidevivre]

A better question: Has the church left the people?

 

[BradC]

The gathering together with the saints is not just for a home body of believers. The word ekklesia has to do with a gathering of believers from their homes into a public setting that involves a council of elders (presbuteros) for the purpose of being edified by the word and doctrine and to be built up in the faith which is the highest form of worship for believers (John 4:24). This is what took place in (Acts 2) and in (v.42-47) we see a continuation of this...

46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,
47 Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

The apostles were gathering the church together is many locations because of the persecution they were facing in the early days of the church after Pentecost. There were homes that believers were gathered together because it was available and open.

If believers were gathered in homes today without a central public location and the owner of the home got disgruntled and permitted them not to gather anymore, that would be disorderly and confusing to many. When you have a central location that believers can gather you eliminate that along with others things like accommodating larger groups of people. I have been a part of group of believers that met in a home of a precious couple that grew in grace and in numbers that the home was no longer able to accommodate. A building was rented and they met weekly in that location which was purchased a few years later. This became their meeting place and a location to the public, a whosoever will may come kind of location.

People came from everywhere because the word of God was so rich and God drew those people to that location to hear His word, to love them, to heal them, to comfort them, to build them up and so that they could have a place of worship, prayer and fellowship with others. The love of God permeated that assembly of believers which became a daily affair among the believers that branched out into other locations with the gospel and never lost sight of their beginnings. Believers should be able to leave that place they have gathered and return to their homes built up in the word and in the love of God.

Aside Note: What do you think Jesus meant in the following passage (Mark 10). Can this be applied to the church and body of Christ?

28 Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
29 And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this life, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.

 

[Yet]

The gathering together with the saints is not just for a home body of believers. The word ekklesia has to do with a gathering of believers from their homes into a public setting that involves a council of elders (presbuteros) for the purpose of being edified by the word and doctrine and to be built up in the faith which is the highest form of worship for believers (John 4:24). This is what took place in (Acts 2) and in (v.42-47) we see a continuation of this...

46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,
47 Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

The apostles were gathering the church together is many locations because of the persecution they were facing in the early days of the church after Pentecost. There were homes that believers were gathered together because it was available and open.

If believers were gathered in homes today without a central public location and the owner of the home got disgruntled and permitted them not to gather anymore, that would be disorderly and confusing to many. When you have a central location that believers can gather you eliminate that along with others things like accommodating larger groups of people. I have been a part of group of believers that met in a home of a precious couple that grew in grace and in numbers that the home was no longer able to accommodate. A building was rented and they met weekly in that location which was purchased a few years later. This became their meeting place and a location to the public, a whosoever will may come kind of location.

People came from everywhere because the word of God was so rich and God drew those people to that location to hear His word, to love them, to heal them, to comfort them, to build them up and so that they could have a place of worship, prayer and fellowship with others. The love of God permeated that assembly of believers which became a daily affair among the believers that branched out into other locations with the gospel and never lost sight of their beginnings. Believers should be able to leave that place they have gathered and return to their homes built up in the word and in the love of God.

Aside Note: What do you think Jesus meant in the following passage (Mark 10). Can this be applied to the church and body of Christ?

28 Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
29 And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this life, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.

eliminate along with other things indeed, such as close family interaction, the open meeting that Paul espoused, every member using their gifts in turn, the absence of paid clerics, the absence of idolizing one man above others.
Saul knew right where to go to arrest christians in their homes, meaning the believers were not really trying to hide. After all, they were attending meetings at the temple....openly!
To continue with a central place to meet later on, the open meeting with everyone participating is fried.
At the time of the temple meetings, Christianity was new. Perfect place to gather a crowd and preach the gospel.
If Jesus thought a big church building is what was to be established why then did He say about the temple you refer to that not one stone will remain on another?

Why did He tell the Samaritan woman that neither 'the church building in this mountain or the one in Jerusalem would be the places of worship but those that would worship God must worship Him in Spirit and in Truth.' ?


The church buildings design stagnates participation with the seating facing one direction, toward the one man Barnum and Bailey act up front. The exalted gifted one called Pastor or Reverend operating in his many talents while the rest of the body of Christ sits dormant, for the most part, for the rest of their earthly lives, with the life drained out of them.

The number one hindrance to the ekklesia is indeed, the church building, and the Babylonion/Grecian/Roman format, MO it follows.

 

[Word_Swordsman]

I know that I go for good "meat on the bone" teaching mostly. And the corporate worship where God's presence seems somehow magnified in our midst.

If no one spoke to me, and the things I just spoke of were there, I would not leave that church. But I would find other Christians (who might even go to other churches) to spend time with in meaningful discussions, prayer, and just plain fun.

If a poll was taken, you find so many reasons why we seek out certain churches. And why we leave. But, in the long run, aren't we all in actually one church? One body, just broken up into little sections here and there.

At last it is said! Believers are one body in Christ, the Church. It isn't necessary for us to be in a building to manifest that. Where is the commend to build and maintain a separate house of worship for Christians? There is none. All it takes for believers to experience the power and presence of God is for two or three to assemble together without having to go somewhere assigned, like a church building. Matthew 18:19-20 (KJV)
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

We can worship, pray, fellowship with the Lord anywhere becasue He is omnipresent. When you by yourself praise, give thanks, and pray, He will hear it.

As for the modern requirement of a building to find the presence of God, I think that makes it too easy for people to judge the presence of God by the location in town, the parking lot, rich v. poor vehicles on it, the decor, the pews, any odors, the temperature, or any of a combination of hundreds of distractions.

All through my Christian years I've usually at least served as an usher. Ushers know about visitors slipping in to the farthest back row, leaving before the congregation stands to dismiss. They know about members gradually seating farther back as they become disgruntled, and finally move al lthe way out of the building.

It has been very apparent that most people attending never add their name to the boards in the foyer asking every member to sign up for one or more of about 40 local ministry teams. Some teams are very large so folks can get a rest from tasks life directing traffic outside. They miss out on the ministry inside. The smallest teams are the ones going out street ministering. Few dare sign that one.

Why do Christians attend a church building expecting to be served? We have a whole world that needs our ministry. Let's not become a statistic from becoming bored warming a pew, going out to eat, then calling that a good Lord's day. Get busy giving instead of taking.

If Christians would at least pay a few visits to a local Rotary Club meeting, lessons can be learned about why a person joins any community-minded group. The group expects participation, service. Apply such a concept to a church congregation. That does in fact help people stay even though they have some gripes.

 

[BradC]

Some of you are ignoring the practical aspects of having a location to gather yourselves together. There are so many benefits that are available to the believers. When any of us are called to a local assembly of believers we are called to put off the works of darkness and to put on the armour of light, Christ the one new man. In the unity if the Spirit we are joint participants of the work of that ministry that God has called each one to be a part, a member in particular, being given gifts and a supply of the Spirit. Some of you have had bad experiences, perhaps of your own accord, but that is no reason to transfer any of that negativity to others who are mature and are content with the local church God has called them to serve. Perhaps some of you need to grow up in Christ and in the grace and knowledge of His person. Any building or structure that God gives a local body is meant to be a blessing and to be used to the glory of God. I have known nothing else for over 40 years and would encourage others to pursue the leading of the Spirit no matter how it may rub others.