Trinity?

JimmieD · Jan 21, 2015

Gen 19:24 Then YAHWEH rained on Sodom and Gomorrah sulfur and fire from YAHWEH out of heaven;

Who is the second Yahweh?

Ex3:2 The angel of YAHWEH appeared[SUP] [/SUP]to him in[SUP] [/SUP] a flame of fire from within a bush.[SUP] [/SUP] He looked[SUP] [/SUP]– and[SUP] [/SUP]the bush was ablaze with fire, but it was not being consumed! 3:3 So Moses thought,[SUP] [/SUP] “I will turn aside to see[SUP] [/SUP]this amazing sight. Why does the bush not burn up?”[SUP] [/SUP] 3:4 When YAHWEH saw that he had turned aside to look, God called to him from within the bush and said, “Moses, Moses!”[SUP] [/SUP]And Moses[SUP] [/SUP]said, “Here I am.” 3:5 God[SUP] [/SUP]said, “Do not approach any closer![SUP] [/SUP] Take your sandals off your feet, for the place where you are standing is holy[SUP] [/SUP]ground.”[SUP] [/SUP]3:6 He added, “I am the God of your father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” Then Moses hid his face, because he was afraid to look at God.

Who is in the bush? How many figures are there in the passage?

Zech3:1 Next I saw Joshua the high priest[SUP] [/SUP]standing before the angel of YAHWEH, with Satan[SUP] [/SUP]standing at his right hand to accuse him. 3:2 YAWHEH said to Satan, “May YAWHWEH rebuke you, Satan! May YAWHWEH, who has chosen Jerusalem,[SUP] [/SUP]rebuke you! Isn’t this man like a burning stick snatched from the fire?”

How many Yahwehs are in the passage? Who is calling on Yahweh to rebuke Satan? Who is standing next to the high priest - Yahweh or the angel of Yahweh?

Is63:7 I will tell of the faithful acts of YAHWEH,of YAHWEH’s praiseworthy deeds.
I will tell about all[SUP] [/SUP]YAHWEH did for us,
the many good things he did for the family of Israel,[SUP] [/SUP]
because of his compassion and great faithfulness.
63:8 He said, “Certainly they will be my people,
children who are not disloyal.”
He became their deliverer.
63:9 Through all that they suffered, he suffered too.[SUP] [/SUP]
The messenger sent from his very presence[SUP] [/SUP]delivered them.
In his love and mercy he protected[SUP] [/SUP]them;
he lifted them up and carried them throughout ancient times.
63:10 But they rebelled and offended[SUP] [/SUP]his holy Spirit,[SUP] [/SUP]
so he turned into an enemy
and fought against them.
63:11 His people remembered the ancient times.[SUP] [/SUP]
Where is the one who brought them up out of the sea,
along with the shepherd of his flock?
Where is the one who placed his holy Spirit among them,

Who led Israel through the desert? Who was their deliverer? Who did they offend and who fought against them?

Bowman · Jan 21, 2015

Re: Your eyes are sewn shut...

newbirth said:

According to you, The Holy Spirit is The Word....and John tells us that The Word IS God...

You just owned yourself...

newbirth · Jan 21, 2015

JimmieD said:

Gen 19:24 Then YAHWEH rained on Sodom and Gomorrah sulfur and fire from YAHWEH out of heaven;

Who is the second Yahweh?

Ex3:2 The angel of YAHWEH appearedto him in a flame of fire from within a bush. He looked– andthe bush was ablaze with fire, but it was not being consumed! 3:3 So Moses thought, “I will turn aside to seethis amazing sight. Why does the bush not burn up?” 3:4 When YAHWEH saw that he had turned aside to look, God called to him from within the bush and said, “Moses, Moses!”And Mosessaid, “Here I am.” 3:5 Godsaid, “Do not approach any closer! Take your sandals off your feet, for the place where you are standing is holyground.”3:6 He added, “I am the God of your father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” Then Moses hid his face, because he was afraid to look at God.

Who is in the bush? How many figures are there in the passage?

Zech3:1 Next I saw Joshua the high prieststanding before the angel of YAHWEH, with Satanstanding at his right hand to accuse him. 3:2 YAWHEH said to Satan, “May YAWHWEH rebuke you, Satan! May YAWHWEH, who has chosen Jerusalem,rebuke you! Isn’t this man like a burning stick snatched from the fire?”

How many Yahwehs are in the passage? Who is calling on Yahweh to rebuke Satan? Who is standing next to the high priest - Yahweh or the angel of Yahweh?

Is63:7 I will tell of the faithful acts of YAHWEH,of YAHWEH’s praiseworthy deeds.
I will tell about allYAHWEH did for us,
the many good things he did for the family of Israel,
because of his compassion and great faithfulness.
63:8 He said, “Certainly they will be my people,
children who are not disloyal.”
He became their deliverer.
63:9 Through all that they suffered, he suffered too.
The messenger sent from his very presencedelivered them.
In his love and mercy he protectedthem;
he lifted them up and carried them throughout ancient times.
63:10 But they rebelled and offendedhis holy Spirit,
so he turned into an enemy
and fought against them.
63:11 His people remembered the ancient times.
Where is the one who brought them up out of the sea,
along with the shepherd of his flock?
Where is the one who placed his holy Spirit among them,

Who led Israel through the desert? Who was their deliverer? Who did they offend and who fought against them?

I can post a scripture that says there is one God...can you post any scripture saying there are two Gods or three Gods...???

newbirth · Jan 21, 2015

Re: Your eyes are sewn shut...

Bowman said:

did I not tell you that also ...there is only one God...you want to make him three...

Bowman · Jan 21, 2015

strawman...

newbirth said:

The Trinity IS One God.

Bowman · Jan 21, 2015

Re: Your eyes are sewn shut...

Bowman said:

Still waiting for you to 'disprove' these scriptures...

VCO · Jan 21, 2015

newbirth said:

This is why I have grown weary of discussing things with you newbirth. You keep repeating the same manufactured falsehoods about what Trinitarian beliefs ACTUALLY ARE. Why don't you really listen, just once, so that you never misquote our beliefs again.

IT is a COMMON misunderstanding. Genuine Trinitarians absolutely believe GOD IS ONE, and within that ONE DEITY, He has three functions, while remaining ONLY ONE GOD. HE functions as the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, YET HE IS ONLY ONE GOD, known as YAHWEH. Where do we validate that belief? :

Matthew 28:19 (HCSB)
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Go, therefore, and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name
{the name singular, not plural} of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

You are free to choose to disagree, but PLEASE quote our beliefs that you disagree with accurately.

JimmieD · Jan 21, 2015

newbirth said:

So no answer to my post. Classic.

newbirth · Jan 21, 2015

Re: strawman...

Bowman said:

no God is oneGod...trinity is three...

newbirth · Jan 21, 2015

JimmieD said:

I post here scripture proving God is one....post yours to prove he is two or three...
Deuteronomy 6:4

Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord:

Malachi 2:10
Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us? why do we deal treacherously every man against his brother, by profaning the covenant of our fathers?
Mark 12:29
And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
1 Corinthians 8:6
But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

Galatians 3:20
Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.

Ephesians 4:6
One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

1 Timothy 2:5
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

Jon4TheCross · Jan 21, 2015

newbirth said:

So I would be lying to say that fire is different than water, and air is different from those, and earth is different from those? Jesus would have had no need to die on the cross for our sins if the Holy Spirit could have been given freely to us without Him dying for us. This indicates a different substance than The Father (unapproachable to flesh), The Son (approachable to flesh), and The Holy Spirit is recievable by a child of God born iagain in spirit.

Tintin · Jan 21, 2015

Re: strawman...

newbirth said:

Just stahp! You're confusing yourself and making no sense to anyone.

Jon4TheCross · Jan 21, 2015

God did not create a testimony even in what we see when we look up, and around, and down for nothing. Faith is substance. God with no beginning or ending is made of more than one substance.

newbirth · Jan 21, 2015

VCO said:

scripture says there is one God the Father....God does not function as the Father...he is the Father...Jesus is the word /spirit/son of the Father...he was with the Father in the beginning...as one with him and came out from him...it is he who was made flesh...
John 16:27
For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.
John 17:8
For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

three functions does not make God a trinity...God went before the children of Israel as a pillar of cloud and a pillar of fire...does that make him five gods now???....the scripture is explicit...one God the Father and one Lord Jesus Christ...why did Paul Peter James John or Jude never bring salutations from a trinity?...only God the Father and our Lord Jesus Christ...can you explain that...John makes it clear ....in the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God...do you see a trinity there????All things are of God the Father and all things are by our Lord Jesus Christ....do you see a trinity there???
there is none ...but if you look hard enough you will see whatever you want to see....

but yet they only baptised in the name of Jesus....there is no record of a baptism done that way in scripture...go figure...

Acts 2:38

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 8:16
(For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)

Philippians 2:10
That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

newbirth · Jan 21, 2015

Jon4TheCross said:

what does that have to do with God the Father being the one God... God doing all those things does not make him a trinity...

newbirth · Jan 21, 2015

Re: strawman...

Tintin said:

thanks for your contribution.. be blessed...

Bowman · Jan 21, 2015

JimmieD said:

Gen 19:24 Then YAHWEH rained on Sodom and Gomorrah sulfur and fire from YAHWEH out of heaven;

Who is the second Yahweh?

Ex3:2 The angel of YAHWEH appearedto him in a flame of fire from within a bush. He looked– andthe bush was ablaze with fire, but it was not being consumed! 3:3 So Moses thought, “I will turn aside to seethis amazing sight. Why does the bush not burn up?” 3:4 When YAHWEH saw that he had turned aside to look, God called to him from within the bush and said, “Moses, Moses!”And Mosessaid, “Here I am.” 3:5 Godsaid, “Do not approach any closer! Take your sandals off your feet, for the place where you are standing is holyground.”3:6 He added, “I am the God of your father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” Then Moses hid his face, because he was afraid to look at God.

Who is in the bush? How many figures are there in the passage?

Zech3:1 Next I saw Joshua the high prieststanding before the angel of YAHWEH, with Satanstanding at his right hand to accuse him. 3:2 YAWHEH said to Satan, “May YAWHWEH rebuke you, Satan! May YAWHWEH, who has chosen Jerusalem,rebuke you! Isn’t this man like a burning stick snatched from the fire?”

How many Yahwehs are in the passage? Who is calling on Yahweh to rebuke Satan? Who is standing next to the high priest - Yahweh or the angel of Yahweh?

Is63:7 I will tell of the faithful acts of YAHWEH,of YAHWEH’s praiseworthy deeds.
I will tell about allYAHWEH did for us,
the many good things he did for the family of Israel,
because of his compassion and great faithfulness.
63:8 He said, “Certainly they will be my people,
children who are not disloyal.”
He became their deliverer.
63:9 Through all that they suffered, he suffered too.
The messenger sent from his very presencedelivered them.
In his love and mercy he protectedthem;
he lifted them up and carried them throughout ancient times.
63:10 But they rebelled and offendedhis holy Spirit,
so he turned into an enemy
and fought against them.
63:11 His people remembered the ancient times.
Where is the one who brought them up out of the sea,
along with the shepherd of his flock?
Where is the one who placed his holy Spirit among them,

Who led Israel through the desert? Who was their deliverer? Who did they offend and who fought against them?

Classic Trinitarian scripture...from the OT, no less....

Jon4TheCross · Jan 21, 2015

Perhaps all the confusion is from misunderstanding the different substances of God? Or maybe we forget that with God...both and all can be true at the same time.
We see in scripture that our God is a consuming fire.
We see in scripture that we need the washing of the water of The Word of God.
We see in scripture The Holy Spirit as a mighty rushing wind.

If I asked a child if those three are different, the child would most likely say yes if the child would be allowed to talk.

The awesomeness about it is that those three are one, and we see all three, in the earthen vessel of God...Jesus Christ of Nazareth.

Bowman · Jan 21, 2015

newbirth said:

The Trinity IS One God, to begin with.

Since your version of the trinity consists of three gods, then the onus is upon YOUR shoulders to show use where in scripture it mentions this...

Bowman · Jan 21, 2015

VCO said:

AB is kept around for the edification of others who want to see just how tardly Trinity-deniers really are...

Trinity?

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