Can you be out of Fellowship with God and still be Saved?
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Because to blaspheme the Holy Spirit is the work of evil and Jesus shed His blood for sin and not for the work of evil. To blaspheme the Spirit is literally to call the work and ministration of the Spirit of life an evil thing and for that their is only deliverance and not forgiveness. Father deliver us from evil, that means the prospect of evil and when we are overcome of evil. See if that fits for you and examine it so that you can decide for yourself whether or not I am lying to you.
Did I say I was "good"?
Are you pointing out the fact that we should keep the commandments? I believe I said - Who said anything about NO obedience? BUT obedience does not bring one salvation - faith in Jesus Christ brings salvation - salvation brings about obedience. NO ONE can walk the walk WITHOUT the holy Spirit so one must be born again before they can walk the walk.
And this is his commandment, that we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another as he gave us commandment. And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us by the Spirit which he hath given us. 1 John 3:23,24 . . . . If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son. He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself [by the Spirit which he hath given us]: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. He that hath the Son hath [eternal] life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life [is condemned already John 3:18]. These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. 1 John 5:9-13
Are you pointing out the fact that we should keep the commandments? I believe I said - Who said anything about NO obedience? BUT obedience does not bring one salvation - faith in Jesus Christ brings salvation - salvation brings about obedience. NO ONE can walk the walk WITHOUT the holy Spirit so one must be born again before they can walk the walk.
And this is his commandment, that we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another as he gave us commandment. And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us by the Spirit which he hath given us. 1 John 3:23,24 . . . . If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son. He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself [by the Spirit which he hath given us]: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. He that hath the Son hath [eternal] life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life [is condemned already John 3:18]. These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. 1 John 5:9-13
Which commandments? The ones given to Moses can only produce a knowledge of sin. The ones Jesus gave create a dependence upon Him. How shall one keep the commandments? Love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, soul and strength.
Commandments can only show the need for grace. They show that we must depend on God for our salvation.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Commandments can only show the need for grace. They show that we must depend on God for our salvation.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
1 John 1:6
If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
broken fellowship is walking in darkness....I am not sure why you think one can be in darkness and feel they are saved...so if you are saved while you are walking in darkness and you are saved while you are not in darkness then what is the difference between the two???
1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
this talk about disown makes no sense...the scripture says....
Romans 6:16
Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
this is not rocket science...if you are walking in darkness the devil is become your father....there is no middle ground...
where did God tell you that you don't have to have all your sins confessed to go to heaven?...so how much sins are you allowed to go to heaven with???
well don't do good works and don't confess your sins...and tell me how you received Christ, and is in him and eternally saved....
If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
broken fellowship is walking in darkness....I am not sure why you think one can be in darkness and feel they are saved...so if you are saved while you are walking in darkness and you are saved while you are not in darkness then what is the difference between the two???
1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
this talk about disown makes no sense...the scripture says....
Romans 6:16
Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
this is not rocket science...if you are walking in darkness the devil is become your father....there is no middle ground...
where did God tell you that you don't have to have all your sins confessed to go to heaven?...so how much sins are you allowed to go to heaven with???
well don't do good works and don't confess your sins...and tell me how you received Christ, and is in him and eternally saved....
Where does it say that in the Bible?
Actually, there are several passages that tell us that you cannot be out of fellowship with God and be saved.
#1. 1 John 5:12 says He that has the Son has life and He that does not have the Son does not have life. Life is associated with eternal life or salvation.
#2. John 17:3 says eternal life is in knowing the one true God, Jesus Christ. Knowing implies a fellowship. So if you don't know Jesus, then you don't have life (Salvation).
#3. Romans 8:9 says if he a man does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to him.
#4. Psalm 73:27 says God will destroy all those who abandon Him (or go a whoring from Him).
#5. John 15:6 says if a man does not abide in Him, he is cast forth and burned.
#6. 1 John 1:7 says if we walk in the Light as He is in the Light, the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin.
............
And here is one more that I just discovered.
#7. Romans 11:21-22 says if you do not continue in his goodness you will be cut off. For if God spared not the natural branches (i.e. the Jews), take heed that he can do the same to you (i.e. Gentile believers). The analogy here is that you are branch and Christ is the tree. We need to continue in Christ's righteousness or goodness, not our own righteousness or goodness, or we will be cut off because of unbelief.
Actually, there are several passages that tell us that you cannot be out of fellowship with God and be saved.
#1. 1 John 5:12 says He that has the Son has life and He that does not have the Son does not have life. Life is associated with eternal life or salvation.
#2. John 17:3 says eternal life is in knowing the one true God, Jesus Christ. Knowing implies a fellowship. So if you don't know Jesus, then you don't have life (Salvation).
#3. Romans 8:9 says if he a man does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to him.
#4. Psalm 73:27 says God will destroy all those who abandon Him (or go a whoring from Him).
#5. John 15:6 says if a man does not abide in Him, he is cast forth and burned.
#6. 1 John 1:7 says if we walk in the Light as He is in the Light, the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin.
............
And here is one more that I just discovered.
#7. Romans 11:21-22 says if you do not continue in his goodness you will be cut off. For if God spared not the natural branches (i.e. the Jews), take heed that he can do the same to you (i.e. Gentile believers). The analogy here is that you are branch and Christ is the tree. We need to continue in Christ's righteousness or goodness, not our own righteousness or goodness, or we will be cut off because of unbelief.
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When i was a kid, i feared my mom a great deal, if i done wrong, she would punish me for the wrong which i did. if i did not get home at 9pm, i was punished for disobeying her rule of being home by 9pm. i feared her, because i feared the consequences of not obeying her. Now i LOVED my mom dearly. and she LOVED us dearly as well. Even though i loved her and she loved me, i still feared her when i did wrong or disobeyed. It is that very fear of her, that kept me on the straight and narrow path. i did not smoke turned it down flat, because i knew if mom ever found out, she would beat me with a switch and ground me for a month. not worth taking the chance, so i did not smoke. Peer pressure was not worse than the consequences of disobeying mom. So it is because of the fear of mom, that i obeyed her rules, and walked in a straight line. But this generation falsely thinks that if you fear someone then you can't possibly love that someone OR, if you fear that someone, that someone can't possibly LOVE them, they do error and do not know the Truth, probably because they never experienced that kind of LOVE.
Is it written in the Word of God that if you sow to the flesh of the flesh you SHALL reap corruption? Yes it is
Is it written in the Word of God that if you do wrong, you SHALL repay for the wrong that you did? Yes it is.
Is it written in the Word of God that you will reap what you sow? Yes it is.
How can this generation escape these Truths? How does this generation think they are excluded from such verses? They shall not escape, they are NOT excluded. These things are why you should FEAR GOD. Because HE is going to punish those who sow to their flesh, He is going to pay back those who do wrong and there is no respect of persons with God, (ie SAVED/not SAVED). He is going to reap to those who have sown. ELSE the Word of God lies? God forbid. The Word is True and can't be broken. So when someone sows to the flesh and they commit fornication, adultery, immoral sexual acts, they WILL suffer corruption in their flesh, because God does not lie. And its not like He wants them to suffer corruption in the flesh, but they have to suffer in the Flesh because His Word is Truth. If you sow to the flesh you shall of the flesh reap corruption, being SAVED does NOT exclude you from the Truth of God. So the beginning of knowledge is to fear God,
This generation (because there is not fear of God in them) teach that fear of God is to reverence Him, as in respect Him. They do error and do not the Truth. Yes we are to reverence Him, and Respect Him, but that is NOT what fear of God means. Again this generation doing everything in its power to excuse their sinning. i do not knowingly and willingly steal even something as small as a pencil because i KNOW that God is True to His Word, and He will have to punish me for that theft. i KNOW that He loved me dearly, and i LOVE Him dearly. i know that His LOVE for me is an Agape Love for me, BUT i also KNOW that He can't lie, and if He says you reap what you sow, and He says that will repay for the wrong that we do, i KNOW that He will, not because He desires to, but because He has too, because God does not lie. Woe to this generation who does not fear God, there is no fear of God before the eyes of this generation, it is no wander to me, these are the last days.
The Fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge. Who in this last days generation fears the Lord? Therefore no knowledge with this generation, for they do not fear the Lord, and because they don't fear Him, they change the word FEAR to mean Respect or Reverence, altogether changing the meaning of the word FEAR to something that they will believe and agree with. Woe to this generation indeed.
^i^
Is it written in the Word of God that if you sow to the flesh of the flesh you SHALL reap corruption? Yes it is
Is it written in the Word of God that if you do wrong, you SHALL repay for the wrong that you did? Yes it is.
Is it written in the Word of God that you will reap what you sow? Yes it is.
How can this generation escape these Truths? How does this generation think they are excluded from such verses? They shall not escape, they are NOT excluded. These things are why you should FEAR GOD. Because HE is going to punish those who sow to their flesh, He is going to pay back those who do wrong and there is no respect of persons with God, (ie SAVED/not SAVED). He is going to reap to those who have sown. ELSE the Word of God lies? God forbid. The Word is True and can't be broken. So when someone sows to the flesh and they commit fornication, adultery, immoral sexual acts, they WILL suffer corruption in their flesh, because God does not lie. And its not like He wants them to suffer corruption in the flesh, but they have to suffer in the Flesh because His Word is Truth. If you sow to the flesh you shall of the flesh reap corruption, being SAVED does NOT exclude you from the Truth of God. So the beginning of knowledge is to fear God,
This generation (because there is not fear of God in them) teach that fear of God is to reverence Him, as in respect Him. They do error and do not the Truth. Yes we are to reverence Him, and Respect Him, but that is NOT what fear of God means. Again this generation doing everything in its power to excuse their sinning. i do not knowingly and willingly steal even something as small as a pencil because i KNOW that God is True to His Word, and He will have to punish me for that theft. i KNOW that He loved me dearly, and i LOVE Him dearly. i know that His LOVE for me is an Agape Love for me, BUT i also KNOW that He can't lie, and if He says you reap what you sow, and He says that will repay for the wrong that we do, i KNOW that He will, not because He desires to, but because He has too, because God does not lie. Woe to this generation who does not fear God, there is no fear of God before the eyes of this generation, it is no wander to me, these are the last days.
The Fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge. Who in this last days generation fears the Lord? Therefore no knowledge with this generation, for they do not fear the Lord, and because they don't fear Him, they change the word FEAR to mean Respect or Reverence, altogether changing the meaning of the word FEAR to something that they will believe and agree with. Woe to this generation indeed.
^i^
Are you suggesting my Mom did not perfectly love me? is it not written that God chastises (PUNISHES) those that He loves? We should NOT dispense with God telling us we are perfectly LOVED. Why would you even suggest something like that? i know God loves me perfectly, and that LOVE includes punishing me when i do wrong, as any GOOD PARENT would do if they Truly LOVED their own child.
i LOVED my Mom and she loved me, but i did fear her when i did wrong.
i LOVE God and God loves me, but i do fear God when i do wrong.
Woe to this generation who will learn what "You reap what you sow" during the hour of temptation, when billions upon billions of so called Christians will fall from the faith, because during that time they will reap from all the sinful sowing they have done in their flesh. Because God can't lie, and He said Everyone will reap what they sow, and He has no respect of persons. During that hour of temptation Many, and i say billions of so called followers of Jesus Christ, who professed to be Saved, will fall from the faith. Many of them will fall, because they failed to understand that God is a just God, a Loving God, and WILL punish those who disobey Him. Now there will be a very few who when the hour of temptation comes and they will reap corruption in their flesh, will realize, (and not blame God for it) that they are finally reaping what they have sown, and will accept the punishment from God, and NOT fall away from the Faith, These are they who do repent of their sins, and realize that they deserve His punishments for their disobedience. These are they that God will accept into His Kingdom as His Children. But those who turn away from God during the time they will reap what they themselves have sown, when they reap exactly as God said they would reap, Those will not be accepted by Him, because they freely choose to walk away from them when His punishments come upon them, EXACTLY as His Word says they will. But those who do not know the Truth, even though they think they do, did not believe His Word, which teaches YOU will reap what you sow. somehow those who do not know the Truth, they they are above the Word of God itself, they think they are excluded because Jesus is even now going to the cross to pay for their sins, they do error and know not the Truth.
Oh how easy is it for this generation to think "Oh DiscipleDave is the one that does not know the Truth" What i teach is NOT from DiscipleDave, nor did it come from my own thoughts and understanding. What i teach is what God told me to teach. But the world rejected the Truth from the prophets of old. The world rejected the Truth that Jesus and His Apostles taught 2000 years ago, and is it any surprise, that the World still rejects the Truth from those sons and daughters in the last days, which the Spirit of God has poured out upon them? i am nothing, a nobody, i am merely a messenger, i merely repeat those things He told me. If then you do not believe, it is not DiscipleDave that you do not believe, but you do not believe God who told DiscipleDave these things. Do the things i teach sound like things that come from devils? LOVE ONE ANOTHER, Stop obeying satan and living in sins. Fear God. All these things the Word of God teaches ALSO. This generation does not believe what i teach because the Truth is not in them. If Jesus was Truly in them, they would recognize the Words of God when they hear it. This generation will not hear me, because they Truth is not in them. Tell me, anything that i have said, that contradicts even one verse in Scriptures, you can't because i teach what the Scriptures teach, such things like "Awake to Righteousness and sin not, for some have not this knowledge, i speak this to your shame" And the Words of Jesus "Go and sin no more, lest a worse thing come upon thee" This generation teaches and LOVES Easy Christianity, they know not the Truth, nor are they like the Berean's of Jesus day. If they were, they would hear my words and go to the Word of God and see if what i was saying fits with the Word of God or not. If i teach something that is contrary to Scriptures then don't believe i word i say, i am a false teacher reserved for Hell fire for all eternity. But if what i teach does not contradict any Scriptures, but does contradict what you believe to be the Truth, it would be in your best interest (eternity at stake) to search out the Truth on this matter, and NOT search to men for the answer, but search to God, in prayer, and in His Word. Those who seek will find. But how many in this generation will seek the answer? They will dismiss what i teach, because they do not agree with it, and will NOT search out the answer, this is because they are NOT like the Bereans.
^i^
i LOVED my Mom and she loved me, but i did fear her when i did wrong.
i LOVE God and God loves me, but i do fear God when i do wrong.
Woe to this generation who will learn what "You reap what you sow" during the hour of temptation, when billions upon billions of so called Christians will fall from the faith, because during that time they will reap from all the sinful sowing they have done in their flesh. Because God can't lie, and He said Everyone will reap what they sow, and He has no respect of persons. During that hour of temptation Many, and i say billions of so called followers of Jesus Christ, who professed to be Saved, will fall from the faith. Many of them will fall, because they failed to understand that God is a just God, a Loving God, and WILL punish those who disobey Him. Now there will be a very few who when the hour of temptation comes and they will reap corruption in their flesh, will realize, (and not blame God for it) that they are finally reaping what they have sown, and will accept the punishment from God, and NOT fall away from the Faith, These are they who do repent of their sins, and realize that they deserve His punishments for their disobedience. These are they that God will accept into His Kingdom as His Children. But those who turn away from God during the time they will reap what they themselves have sown, when they reap exactly as God said they would reap, Those will not be accepted by Him, because they freely choose to walk away from them when His punishments come upon them, EXACTLY as His Word says they will. But those who do not know the Truth, even though they think they do, did not believe His Word, which teaches YOU will reap what you sow. somehow those who do not know the Truth, they they are above the Word of God itself, they think they are excluded because Jesus is even now going to the cross to pay for their sins, they do error and know not the Truth.
Oh how easy is it for this generation to think "Oh DiscipleDave is the one that does not know the Truth" What i teach is NOT from DiscipleDave, nor did it come from my own thoughts and understanding. What i teach is what God told me to teach. But the world rejected the Truth from the prophets of old. The world rejected the Truth that Jesus and His Apostles taught 2000 years ago, and is it any surprise, that the World still rejects the Truth from those sons and daughters in the last days, which the Spirit of God has poured out upon them? i am nothing, a nobody, i am merely a messenger, i merely repeat those things He told me. If then you do not believe, it is not DiscipleDave that you do not believe, but you do not believe God who told DiscipleDave these things. Do the things i teach sound like things that come from devils? LOVE ONE ANOTHER, Stop obeying satan and living in sins. Fear God. All these things the Word of God teaches ALSO. This generation does not believe what i teach because the Truth is not in them. If Jesus was Truly in them, they would recognize the Words of God when they hear it. This generation will not hear me, because they Truth is not in them. Tell me, anything that i have said, that contradicts even one verse in Scriptures, you can't because i teach what the Scriptures teach, such things like "Awake to Righteousness and sin not, for some have not this knowledge, i speak this to your shame" And the Words of Jesus "Go and sin no more, lest a worse thing come upon thee" This generation teaches and LOVES Easy Christianity, they know not the Truth, nor are they like the Berean's of Jesus day. If they were, they would hear my words and go to the Word of God and see if what i was saying fits with the Word of God or not. If i teach something that is contrary to Scriptures then don't believe i word i say, i am a false teacher reserved for Hell fire for all eternity. But if what i teach does not contradict any Scriptures, but does contradict what you believe to be the Truth, it would be in your best interest (eternity at stake) to search out the Truth on this matter, and NOT search to men for the answer, but search to God, in prayer, and in His Word. Those who seek will find. But how many in this generation will seek the answer? They will dismiss what i teach, because they do not agree with it, and will NOT search out the answer, this is because they are NOT like the Bereans.
^i^
i know exactly what He would say if He could post here.
"LOVE ONE ANOTHER"
He would also say
"There is no sin that you do that you can't cease from, if you look to Me for Strength and Power to overcome it"
He would also say
"If what you believe contradicts even one verse in My Word, then what you believe is wrong"
Do you know how i KNOW these are some of the things He would say if He were to post, because these are some of the things JESUS told me to teach you.
^i^
"LOVE ONE ANOTHER"
He would also say
"There is no sin that you do that you can't cease from, if you look to Me for Strength and Power to overcome it"
He would also say
"If what you believe contradicts even one verse in My Word, then what you believe is wrong"
Do you know how i KNOW these are some of the things He would say if He were to post, because these are some of the things JESUS told me to teach you.
^i^
So it seems you think you are excluded from His Words that teach, you will reap what you have sown? And if you sow to the flesh of the flesh you shall reap corruption? Somehow you think you are excluded from these, yes? The Word of God does not teach anyone is excluded from these, so where does this exclusion come from? Not from God.
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