Two unrelated but kinda related questions

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JFSurvivor

JFSurvivor

Senior Member
Jan 20, 2015
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"Consider it pure joy my brothers whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith develops perseverance. Perseverance must finish it's work so that you may be mature and complete and not lacking anything." -James 1:2-4

"When tempted, no one should say, 'God is tempting me.' For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone; but each one is tempted by his own evil desires, he is dragged away and enticed." -James 1:13-14
First question: I'm a little confused about this. So it says to consider it joy when we face trials....then it says that God doesn't tempt us. So should we consider satans works joy in our lives because it develops perseverance because nothing bad comes from God and nothing good comes from satan.

"The Lord said to Satan, 'where have you come from?'

Satan answered the Lord, 'From roaming the earth and going back and forth in it.'

Then the Lord said to Satan, 'Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and up-right, a man who fears God and shuns evil.'​
​
'Does Job fear God for nothing?' Satan replied. 'Have you not put a hedge around him and his household and everything he has? You have blessed the work of his hands, so that his flocks and herds are spread throughout the land. But stretch out your hand and strike everything he has, and he will surely curse your face.'

Then the Lord said to Satan, 'Very well, then, everything he has is in your hands, but on the man himself do not lay a finger.'

Then Satan went out from the presence of the Lord." Job 1:7-12

So I have a bunch of questions about this....(Sorry if the name of this thread is misleading).

1)Then the Lord said to Satan, 'Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and up-right, a man who fears God and shuns evil.'​Why does it look like God nudges Satan into tormenting Job?

2)'Does Job fear God for nothing?' Satan replied. 'Have you not put a hedge around him and his household and everything he has? You have blessed the work of his hands, so that his flocks and herds are spread throughout the land. But stretch out your hand and strike everything he has, and he will surely curse your face.' This almost looks like satan is trying to manipulate God. If that is the case why did God give satan the ok to mess up Job's life?

Also if God doesn't tempt then why was he like "yeah satan go ahead and tempt Job."?

Thanks for reading I know that was kinda long. :-)
 
The trying of your faith worketh patience, so thats a good thing

Jesus told Simon that Satan desired to have him as well, that he might sift him as wheat
 
Excellent question(s). Wish I had an answer for you. But I'm looking for one myself.
 
Wow great questions. If I might address the first question. Not all trials that we face in life are spiritual. There is a biological component to our experience in the genetics that make us up, our experiences growing up....wounding learning bad habits from parents etc. in a nutshell, many of the trials we face are consequences of our own decisions and will.
 
Hebrews 12:6-11 Whom the Lord loveth He chasteneth.

No chastening then no relationship with God. Chastening is an evidence of salvation through Christ.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
JFSurvivor said:
"Consider it pure joy my brothers whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith develops perseverance. Perseverance must finish it's work so that you may be mature and complete and not lacking anything." -James 1:2-4

"When tempted, no one should say, 'God is tempting me.' For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone; but each one is tempted by his own evil desires, he is dragged away and enticed." -James 1:13-14
First question: I'm a little confused about this. So it says to consider it joy when we face trials....then it says that God doesn't tempt us. So should we consider satans works joy in our lives because it develops perseverance because nothing bad comes from God and nothing good comes from satan.

"The Lord said to Satan, 'where have you come from?'

Satan answered the Lord, 'From roaming the earth and going back and forth in it.'

Then the Lord said to Satan, 'Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and up-right, a man who fears God and shuns evil.'​
​
'Does Job fear God for nothing?' Satan replied. 'Have you not put a hedge around him and his household and everything he has? You have blessed the work of his hands, so that his flocks and herds are spread throughout the land. But stretch out your hand and strike everything he has, and he will surely curse your face.'

Then the Lord said to Satan, 'Very well, then, everything he has is in your hands, but on the man himself do not lay a finger.'

Then Satan went out from the presence of the Lord." Job 1:7-12

So I have a bunch of questions about this....(Sorry if the name of this thread is misleading).

1)Then the Lord said to Satan, 'Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and up-right, a man who fears God and shuns evil.'​Why does it look like God nudges Satan into tormenting Job?

2)'Does Job fear God for nothing?' Satan replied. 'Have you not put a hedge around him and his household and everything he has? You have blessed the work of his hands, so that his flocks and herds are spread throughout the land. But stretch out your hand and strike everything he has, and he will surely curse your face.' This almost looks like satan is trying to manipulate God. If that is the case why did God give satan the ok to mess up Job's life?

Also if God doesn't tempt then why was he like "yeah satan go ahead and tempt Job."?

Thanks for reading I know that was kinda long. :-)
Click to expand...

Well, God didn't tempted Job, but satan had done it. The devil wants to prove that we will abandon God when troubles comes upon us. If someone loves another, they will not abandon them for nothing at all. After what satan had done to Job, Job kept on blessing God even during the time of testing.

Luke 8:13 Those on the rocky ground are the ones who receive the word with joy when they hear it, but they have no root. They believe for a while, but in the time of testing they fall away.
 
For example look at these, you can see a pattern, theres a pattern in all of these things

Tribulation worketh pateince, in our patience we possess our souls.

James 4:1 But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.

James 1:3 Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience.

Zach 13:9 I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried:

Job 10:23 But he knoweth the way that I take: when he hath tried me, I shall come forth as gold.

1Peter 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

Psalm 105:18 Until the time that his word came: the word of the LORD tried him.

Jerm 23:29 Isnot my word like as a fire?

1Peter 4:12 Beloved, think it not strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened unto you:

James 1:2 Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.

1Peter 1:6 Wherein ye greatly rejoice, though now for a season, if need be, ye are in heaviness through manifold temptations:

A little season...

Jesus was also led of the Spirit into the wildernessto be tempted of Satan,

And resisted, as it says resist the devil and he shall flee from you

Luke 4:13 when the devil had ended all the temptation, he departed from him for a season.


Mark 1:13 he was there in the wilderness forty days, tempted of Satan; and was with the wild beasts; and the angels ministered unto him.

And actually come out of that full of the power of the Spirit as well


 
I had a cousin who whenever he got in trouble at grandmas house would tell her that the the devil made him do it and she would buy it every time. I remember thinking....what a crock, you did it all by yourself.
 
There is a difference in testing one's face and temptation.
Testing one's face is about allowing a person to go through trials and tribulations and still stay strong in their faith of the Lord, without wavering. God will allow this tempting, but He says Himself that He will not let you go through things that He knows you will not be able to handle.

1 Corinthians 10:13
There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.


Now for the temptation that comes from others, or yourselves own lusts (James 1:14), and never from God. God will allow it to take place, but never does it Himself and always gives you away to escape as the above scripture says. Keep your full trust in the Lord and He will bring you through all things !!!
 
About the first part of your question, consider this: I think you have trials and temptations mixed up.
A trial is a difficult situation that we are going through, bad things that happen to us that God uses to produce good things (Romans 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.)
Temptation is thoughts from the devil (kinda like satan tempted Jesus in the desert).
So yeah rejoice in trials, as God sends trials (difficult circumstances or situations in life) to refine us and cause us to call on Him and deepen the relationship with Him, but God doesnt tempt. The two terms might seem synonymous at times but they are really not. Like in the example of Job, it is when God brings up trials (bad things that happened to Job) that satan often brings on more temptation as well - to cause us to "curse God and die" like he tempted Job to sin through the words of his wife.
 
kennethcadwell said:
There is a difference in testing one's face and temptation.
Testing one's face is about allowing a person to go through trials and tribulations and still stay strong in their faith of the Lord, without wavering. God will allow this tempting, but He says Himself that He will not let you go through things that He knows you will not be able to handle.

1 Corinthians 10:13
There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.


Now for the temptation that comes from others, or yourselves own lusts (James 1:14), and never from God. God will allow it to take place, but never does it Himself and always gives you away to escape as the above scripture says. Keep your full trust in the Lord and He will bring you through all things !!!
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Should say testing one's faith, as this thing keeps changing what I type after posting it. This has been happening for a couple of weeks now.......
 
All the wording is directly related throughout scripture, you can change the order of it up and they confirm one another in the same trials and temptations, just like God not allowing you to be tempted (not above) what you are able, He told Satan (in regards to Job) he could go this far (and no further) so to speak. So you can really mesh all thats said in the realm of this into one pictures shown many times over.

Thats all I do is redo those pictures again and again, its one of my favorites actually.
 
kennethcadwell said:
Should say testing one's faith, as this thing keeps changing what I type after posting it. This has been happening for a couple of weeks now.......
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I was wondering about that ... don'tcha just love the auto-spell thing!
 
RickyZ said:
I was wondering about that ... don'tcha just love the auto-spell thing!
Click to expand...


Yes it kind of annoy's me, because I type something and then after posting it I look at it and one or more words will be changed. Making it look like I can not type or spell good, oh well life is life....lol
 
JFSurvivor said:
Why does it look like God nudges Satan into tormenting Job?
This almost looks like satan is trying to manipulate God. If that is the case why did God give satan the ok to mess up Job's life?
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Not really Sis. The thing is that God allows the wickedness to fulfill its measure so He would punish evil the more and reward His the more in the end. Look what God says to Abraham as He is giving him the promise of the land. He says that Abraham and his descendants would wander as strangers 400 more years! - because of the Amorites' iniquity which is not yet fulfilled. God's plan is wiser and He sees further than we see. And He is to the wicked, like, "yeah, keep going and thinking 'I've got this', I'll let you run your little rodeo but we shall see yet".

Genesis 15:13 And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety that thy seed shall be a stranger in a land that is not theirs, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years; 14 And also that nation, whom they shall serve, will I judge [alike judging the devil for troubling the righteous]: and afterward shall they come out with great substance [God's victory planned out!]. 15 And thou shalt go to thy fathers in peace; thou shalt be buried in a good old age. 16 But in the fourth generation they shall come hither again: for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full.

JFSurvivor said:
Also if God doesn't tempt then why was he like "yeah satan go ahead and tempt Job."?
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Because God foreknew what would happen and that all would get given back to Job and he would be comforted in the end of the story, and much more... Job was foreshadowing of how Jesus would get all restored so he was chosen for the sake of prophecy too. The name Job means "tried" and he was a picture of how Jesus would be tried and God would reward His faithfulness.

Job 42:12 So the LORD blessed the latter end of Job more than his beginning...
 
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kennethcadwell said:
Yes it kind of annoy's me, because I type something and then after posting it I look at it and one or more words will be changed. Making it look like I can not type or spell good, oh well life is life....lol
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Is that what is going on? I have never in all my life have the amount of constant typos I do here, I dont know what is going on with that.
 
God does not tempt us with evil, but allows our faith to be tested that we may grow and mature......The more you successfully endure (trials of your faith) the stronger you will be in your faith...then end of the testing of your faith is a mature servant of God than is complete and able to endure........!
 
Ok new question: what is a "trial"? Would something like rape be considered a trial? If so are we to find joy in it? Or are trials more minuscule like a friend stabbing you in the back?

Also why would God send those things in to a person's life if he is a good God? I think hurt and bad things come from free will and sin and satan, not God. But I still don't understand those verses because God isn't bad...ya know? And nothing bad can come from him...
 
JFSurvivor said:
Ok new question: what is a "trial"? Would something like rape be considered a trial? If so are we to find joy in it? Or are trials more minuscule like a friend stabbing you in the back?

Also why would God send those things in to a person's life if he is a good God? I think hurt and bad things come from free will and sin and satan, not God. But I still don't understand those verses because God isn't bad...ya know? And nothing bad can come from him...
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I honestly doubt that every case of being recipient of sin and hurt is necessarily planned out by God. Sometimes bad things in a sin world are just that... and He allows free will... but that's it. Job's trial was terrible but it had an important purpose.
Yes, bad things come from the devil... but God is able to use even bad things for good purposes at His will.
I had unloving parents and abusive peers. Was this evil on their part? Yeah. But it caused me to look for love in other places than people. It caused me to hunger for God's love to fill the gap that I had. Imagine if I was favored of people and full of confidence and thought I had it all made. Would I seek God then or would I be too absorbed with my success in the world? So which was better for me, what do you think? :)

P.S. It looks to me and very strongly so that the word TRIAL as used in the Bible refers only to believers. So He doesnt try and refine a man if he is not His, you know? You can refine only gold.
 
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SoulWeaver said:
I honestly doubt that every case of being recipient of sin and hurt is necessarily a trial planned out by God. Sometimes bad things in a sin world are just that... and He allows free will... but that's it. Job's trial was terrible but it had an important purpose.
Yes, bad things come from the devil... but God is able to use even bad things for good purposes at His will.
I had unloving parents and abusive peers. Was this evil on their part? Yeah. But it caused me to look for love in other places than people. It caused me to hunger for God's love to fill the gap that I had. Imagine if I was favored of people and full of confidence and thought I had it all made. Would I seek God then or would I be too absorbed with my success in the world? So which was better for me, what do you think? :)
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You're not going to like my answer.

I think that God can make good come from bad but he won't MAKE bad things happen to you.

As for my answer, I think it would have been better for you not to have been abused and to have come to Christ despite being loved and confident. You can seek him when you are loved and confident ya know....

I know what you were getting at but abuse is one of those things that is PURE EVIL.
 
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