uhhh... i beg to differ here.. ALL SIN is dirty..all sin is evil.. no such thing as "clean sin". just sayin'.. :/
Tired of the Big LIE
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and a few others as well.......I am glad Jesus came to save sinners of whom I am chief<---Paul said that and he was INSPIRED of GOD.......seems obvious who is of God and who is not of God....
I thank God I am not like this scum bag sinner<-----NOT OF GOD
Be merciful unto me a sinner<----OF GOD
pretty simple test at the end of the day.......!
I think what he was saying by that statement is the fact that there are some who claim they do not sin or are above sin....NB being one of the (some who claim)!
S
Sirk
Guest
so then Paul fought for righteousness....which you claim is a reward....[SUP]8 [/SUP]Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness,......you are saying Paul worked for righteousness....
And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others:
Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted. [Luke 18]
Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted. [Luke 18]
All sin is dirty; I'm with you on that. All sin is evil; not so sure about that.
All sin is unholy and separates us from God, but evil?
LadyBug, you've definitely given me something to ponder.
your problem is you do not believe God can cleanse us from all sins when we confess and repent...you have no faith in the blood of Christ...you think sin and righteousness...light and darkness.... can have fellowship....ask yourself this question....are you in sin????can you be in sin and be in Christ at the same time???? 1 John 1:5
This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.
1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
1 John 1:9
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1 John 2:1
My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
Paul said that if any man should boast let him boast in Christ Jesus. Meaning that even the good works that we do are not of yourself but by Christ working through us by the Holy Spirit. The very works that we do are not our own, but The Spirit working through us as we yield by faith to His guidance. Therefore no man can boast in works and can only boast in the work of the cross.
God gave you power over the flesh and you are still contending with it...He said sin not...you are preaching sin defeating you...to the point where you sin and don't even know it...that sounds like a conscience that is seared...
[h=1]1 Timothy 4:1-3King James Version (KJV)[/h] 4 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
[SUP]2 [/SUP]Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
if you do not believe all things are possible ...then ask God to help your unbelief....
[h=1]Mark 9:22-24King James Version (KJV)[/h] [SUP]22 [/SUP]And ofttimes it hath cast him into the fire, and into the waters, to destroy him: but if thou canst do any thing, have compassion on us, and help us.
[SUP]23 [/SUP]Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said with tears, Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief.
S
Sirk
Guest
a works based salvation leaves no room for mercy. I had a verbally abusive father and some pretty tough moments in my childhood that marked me and that I've had to overcome....in light of that, I consider myself pretty lucky....with all my parents faults and scars I got as a kid and that I am reasonably intelligent and have good core values, I wasnt, like a lot of people, beaten, abandoned, sexually abused, raped etc etc etc.
If your Jesus is the kind of God that expects a person that has suffered those kinds of horrors to be immediately and completely sanctified and to put all of that pain behind them the moment they turn their hearts to Jesus....what a horrible burden to place on those who have have suffered so much already.
Am I saying the kind of miracle where someone is instantly transformed can't happen....I am not....but the normal route is a long one into health.....a lifetime really. Typically, a person will have about five to seven years to bear the fruit of the transformation that happened in their heart...if they chase after it hard. ..however, most will struggle their whole lives due to lack of resources, bad home life etc and never really being able to learn healthy coping skills because they just don't have the ability coupled with deep deep wounds. I really do think a works based doctrine goes against the very nature of Jesus and that he is grieved tremendously by it.
Ya'll just keep right on doin.... steppin on the heads of hurting people if that's the way you wanna roll.
If your Jesus is the kind of God that expects a person that has suffered those kinds of horrors to be immediately and completely sanctified and to put all of that pain behind them the moment they turn their hearts to Jesus....what a horrible burden to place on those who have have suffered so much already.
Am I saying the kind of miracle where someone is instantly transformed can't happen....I am not....but the normal route is a long one into health.....a lifetime really. Typically, a person will have about five to seven years to bear the fruit of the transformation that happened in their heart...if they chase after it hard. ..however, most will struggle their whole lives due to lack of resources, bad home life etc and never really being able to learn healthy coping skills because they just don't have the ability coupled with deep deep wounds. I really do think a works based doctrine goes against the very nature of Jesus and that he is grieved tremendously by it.
Ya'll just keep right on doin.... steppin on the heads of hurting people if that's the way you wanna roll.
you are doing the same thing again and avoiding the real issue...I have posted scripture showing we confess our sins and God is faithful and just to forgive us...and cleanse us from all unrighteousness... you say I deny I have sins...God forgives me of my sins...you cannot understand that concept.....I called no one evil....you I call a speaker with forked tongue...are you denying God forgive our sins when we confess??? you having been saved so many years ago and never confessed after that
M
MyLighthouse
Guest
I don't want to debate on this belief because everyone has free will. Yet, the justification for this doctrine is very much questionable in that many scriptures do not support Once Saved Always Saved Doctrine and goes against the character of God.
There are many places that show one can lose their salvation or become disqualified:
1. Many of Jesus parable gives great examples of this(the branches, the sower of the seed, the talents, the five virgins)
2. The churches in Revelation (lukewarm, turned away from first love) The book of Revelation really
3. The disciples (Peter denied Jesus, Matt 10:33)
4. To the end (Matt 10:22;Acts 14:22,16;Rom 11:22,Rev 2:5,1Tim 4:1,2 Pet 2:20-22,Heb 12:15)
5. Paul (1 Cor 9:27,Phil 3:11-13)
Anyone who has ever heed the call of the Holy Spirit, Confessed, Believed, was baptized, and received the Holy Spirit inside them is or was saved according to scripture. They're name has been written in the book of life, but only those who are victorious until the END will not be blotted out(enter heaven). People can turn their backs on God, just as Satan and the angels did. The Spirit that living in the Saints is perfect, but the flesh is not. We can grieve and quench the Holy Spirit. Sin can not enter heaven there are no exceptions to this, because God doesn't dwell with iniquity or even listens to a person who has iniquity inside them. So if you have sin at the end and did not run your race, as always sin=death. No such thing as reborn or resaved, just repenting (turning from your sins back to God). That's why backsliders aren't rebaptized(or shouldn't be) because they have repented and turned back to God. They just start their race again.
I'm glad you believe in repentance because many OSAS don't. I was told I could murder and because of OSAS I could still go to heaven despite scripture saving I most certainly would not. I attended a Baptist church for years as a child. Not hounding, just showing opposing scripture to the OSAS doctrine.
There are many places that show one can lose their salvation or become disqualified:
1. Many of Jesus parable gives great examples of this(the branches, the sower of the seed, the talents, the five virgins)
2. The churches in Revelation (lukewarm, turned away from first love) The book of Revelation really
3. The disciples (Peter denied Jesus, Matt 10:33)
4. To the end (Matt 10:22;Acts 14:22,16;Rom 11:22,Rev 2:5,1Tim 4:1,2 Pet 2:20-22,Heb 12:15)
5. Paul (1 Cor 9:27,Phil 3:11-13)
Anyone who has ever heed the call of the Holy Spirit, Confessed, Believed, was baptized, and received the Holy Spirit inside them is or was saved according to scripture. They're name has been written in the book of life, but only those who are victorious until the END will not be blotted out(enter heaven). People can turn their backs on God, just as Satan and the angels did. The Spirit that living in the Saints is perfect, but the flesh is not. We can grieve and quench the Holy Spirit. Sin can not enter heaven there are no exceptions to this, because God doesn't dwell with iniquity or even listens to a person who has iniquity inside them. So if you have sin at the end and did not run your race, as always sin=death. No such thing as reborn or resaved, just repenting (turning from your sins back to God). That's why backsliders aren't rebaptized(or shouldn't be) because they have repented and turned back to God. They just start their race again.
I'm glad you believe in repentance because many OSAS don't. I was told I could murder and because of OSAS I could still go to heaven despite scripture saving I most certainly would not. I attended a Baptist church for years as a child. Not hounding, just showing opposing scripture to the OSAS doctrine.
T
The_highwayman
Guest
Are you led by your flesh or are you led by the Spirit and Walk in the Spirit?
I am led by the Spirit and walk in the Spirit, so I do not walk in the flesh
Gal 5.16-18 says-
[SUP]16 [/SUP]This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
[SUP]18 [/SUP]But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
So if I am being led by the Spirit and the Spirit tells me to wlak an old lady across the street, I do so not based on my own understanding, but because I am being led by the Spirit, so I also never question, what the Spirit leads me to do, I also do not apply flesh to the task or worry about motives, because the Spirit is leading me...If I am Spirit led the flesh has been crucified or mortified. If I am doing what the Spirit leads me to do, I am walking in the Spirit!
If I let the flesh win and I do not cross help the lady, then I am walking in the flesh and being disobedient for not doing what the Spirit told me to and therefore the motive and wanting a pat on the back never happens....
what do you mean..
it is because of God's mercy we are saved...and he tells us to go and be merciful to others...you want mercy from God but not to show mercy to others...
Matthew 5:7
Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
James 3:17
But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.
when a man comes to Christ he is expected to cast all his burdens upon Him....if you choose to hold on to yours you are disobeying Him...forgetting the things that are past...press on to the mark of a higher calling...
that is your opinion...Scripture says God gives us a new heart...do you suppose a heart transplant takes a lifetime...???With the master surgeon.....?????
People struggle because of a lack of knowledge...People want to hold on to their past(Egypt) and see giants in their promise land...scripture says a man who puts his hand to the plough and looks back is not worthy of the kingdom.....Jesus always describes the kingdom in a work oriented way...you want to take work out of the kingdom
no one is stepping on heads...truth naturally hurts....Jesud said take up your cross and follow me daily....do you suppose it is a Styrofoam cross?????
S
Sirk
Guest
I have the Holy Spirit in me to guide me. I have a personal relationship with Jesus. I believe that He died on the cross for me and all who would believe in Him as payment for our sins. I am made of three things....spirit soul and body. The spirit that lives in me is eternal, the flesh that I am is ever present and is at war with the spirit that lives in me. My life has peaks and valleys. Sometimes I get mad when I should die to self and sometimes I am selfish when I should love.
If you're on a peak....enjoy it, cuz a trial is coming.....a refining fire that will expose your weakness.
T
The_highwayman
Guest
Ok fair enough bro....
Matt 5.28
[SUP]8 [/SUP]But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
That is what the word says...you seem to want it to say this....
But I say to you that whoever looks at any woman without or without lust has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
Bro the operative sentence here is:
TO LUST
If I see a beautiful women and have not LUSTED after her in any way, and not even let her beauty affect me...have I still sinned? No because Jesus said: TO LUST...other paraphrases and translations, state it this way: If you look at a woman with lust already in your heart for her...
If I see a beautiful woman and imagine having sex with her or wishing to see her naked, then I have committed the SIN of adultery....
This is simple Bible 101 and has nothing to do with works based salvation and everything to do with walking and being led by the SPirit.
T
The_highwayman
Guest
I also live in peaks and valleys bro, we all do. I also do wrong and I am constantly making adjustments....I am also not a stranger to refinement fire....
This is not a slam towards you and just a suggestion...
Stop living Romans 7 and and start living Romans 8.....
When you get what I just said, you will know and you will understand.....
sirk, you post good stuff brother and you are an awesome son of God....dont be one of the thousands trapped in Romans 7 and mature on to Romans 8....it will be a life changer for you...
S
Sirk
Guest
Thanks for the kind words. I have a new mission. To dig deep into Romans 8. Thank you.
T