Demons have rights

[blue_ladybug]

Scripture says that they still have access to heaven and I'll be happy to share some scriptures with you along those lines. Out of curiosity, when do you believe that Satan and his angels were cast out of heaven? Thanks.

They were cast out when Lucifer deemed himself to be higher than God, and he and some of his angels rebelled against God. He was cast down to earth along with his fallen angels. Lucifer became known as Satan, and his fallen angels became demons. The bible speaks of where Jesus says he saw Lucifer cast down to earth.

 

[JesusistheChrist]

They were cast out when Lucifer deemed himself to be higher than God, and he and some of his angels rebelled against God. He was cast down to earth along with his fallen angels. Lucifer became known as Satan, and his fallen angels became demons. The bible speaks of where Jesus says he saw Lucifer cast down to earth.

When did this allegedly happen? Before Noah and on his side of the flood or later and on this side of the flood?

 

[Atwood]

So I went to this conference and it was all about spiritual warfare. The guy was like "demons have rights." And I'm sitting there like "what?" Well think about it.

Well Survivor, it is well to consider spiritual warfare. But speculation just based on "thinking about it," is not what you need. You need to know what the Word of God says on it. It is noted that your post has not one quotation from the Bible to prove anything.

Now if you want to know if demons have rights, run a check on the words demon(s) and right(s). See what you come up with in the Bible. The only "right" I know of delineated in the Bible is that of becoming a child of God if you trust in the Savior. (John 1:12) Our concept of "rights" seems to me to be unbiblical, probably largely traceable to the Declaration of Independence where the claim is made that it is self-evident that men have rights (life, liberty, & the pursuit of happiness) -- but this is unbiblical and not self-evident at all.

Now if you have specific steps for getting a demon to leave, be sure you establish them all from God's word. I myself am unaware of any steps in the Bible for getting demons to "leave" your vicinity nor to prevent them from tempting you.

We are told that greater is He that is within us than He that is in the world (1 John).

But if you mean steps to getting a demon to come out of a demon-possessed person, the only step I know of is to ask the Lord to expel Him. "This kind comes out only by prayer."

If any man sin, we have an advocate [an attorney] with the Father, the Lord Jesus.

So let's limit the speculation and stick to what scripture says.

And for $64,000 show me one verse that says any Christian can "bind" any demon. Satan goes around as a roaring lion seeking whom he may devour.

In the courtroom of God, it's a COURTROOM. Let's say a demon comes up to God and is like "See that person? they're a christian but they're sinning like there's no tomorrow and they aren't repenting. Can I go torment them?" God's gonna be like "I don't see why not." Because he is JUST.

So, I suggest you lay aside all these ideas you have before you validate them with God's Word. Do you have a Bible study program like Accordance where you can check things with computer? If not, try BibleHub.com.

 

[blue_ladybug]

When did this allegedly happen? Before Noah and on his side of the flood or later and on this side of the flood?

I would say that they were cast down long before the events in Genesis took place.. The bible says that Jesus saw Satan cast down with the brilliance and quickness of lightning.

 

[JesusistheChrist]

I would say that they were cast down long before the events in Genesis took place.. The bible says that Jesus saw Satan cast down with the brilliance and quickness of lightning.

If they were cast down long before the events in Genesis took place, then how did Satan appear before the LORD in the book of Job:

Job chapter 1

[6] Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.
[7] And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.

Again:

Job chapter 2

[1] Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the LORD.
[2] And the LORD said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.

???

We know from internal evidence within the book of Job that Job lived some time on this side of Noah's flood (For example, we read of "the Sabeans" and they were the descendants of somebody who is mentioned in Genesis chapter 10 on this side of the flood) and Noah's flood happened more than 1,600 years after Adam was created/made/formed, so how did Satan have access to heaven at this juncture in time?

In regard to what Jesus said about Satan, we read:

Luke chapter 10

[1] After these things the Lord appointed other seventy also, and sent them two and two before his face into every city and place, whither he himself would come.
[2] Therefore said he unto them, The harvest truly is great, but the labourers are few: pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he would send forth labourers into his harvest.
[3] Go your ways: behold, I send you forth as lambs among wolves.
[4] Carry neither purse, nor scrip, nor shoes: and salute no man by the way.
[5] And into whatsoever house ye enter, first say, Peace be to this house.
[6] And if the son of peace be there, your peace shall rest upon it: if not, it shall turn to you again.
[7] And in the same house remain, eating and drinking such things as they give: for the labourer is worthy of his hire. Go not from house to house.
[8] And into whatsoever city ye enter, and they receive you, eat such things as are set before you:
[9] And heal the sick that are therein, and say unto them, The kingdom of God is come nigh unto you.
[10] But into whatsoever city ye enter, and they receive you not, go your ways out into the streets of the same, and say,
[11] Even the very dust of your city, which cleaveth on us, we do wipe off against you: notwithstanding be ye sure of this, that the kingdom of God is come nigh unto you.
[12] But I say unto you, that it shall be more tolerable in that day for Sodom, than for that city.
[13] Woe unto thee, Chorazin! woe unto thee, Bethsaida! for if the mighty works had been done in Tyre and Sidon, which have been done in you, they had a great while ago repented, sitting in sackcloth and ashes.
[14] But it shall be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon at the judgment, than for you.
[15] And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted to heaven, shalt be thrust down to hell.
[16] He that heareth you heareth me; and he that despiseth you despiseth me; and he that despiseth me despiseth him that sent me.
[17] And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name.
[18] And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.
[19] Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.
[20] Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you; but rather rejoice, because your names are written in heaven.

Jesus' comment regarding Satan falling as lightning from heaven is understood by some to mean that as the 70 were casting out demons in Jesus' name, Jesus was beholding Satan's kingdom suffering damage. Others understand this to mean that Jesus was actually warning the 70 about PRIDE in that they were rejoicing that demons were subject unto them and Jesus was reminding them how PRIDE precedes a fall. In any case, I'll be happy to show you other scriptural examples where Satan and his angels have access to the heavenlies if need be.

 

[Atwood]

When did this allegedly happen? Before Noah and on his side of the flood or later and on this side of the flood?

As I recall the I saw satan cast down thing, was uttered by the Lord Jesus after the return of His disciples from a preaching mission He had sent them on during His earthly ministry.

 

[blue_ladybug]

As I recall the I saw satan cast down thing, was uttered by the Lord Jesus after the return of His disciples from a preaching mission He had sent them on during His earthly ministry.

yes but Jesus could have been referring to a past event that he saw long before his earthly life even started..

 

[JesusistheChrist]

As I recall the I saw satan cast down thing, was uttered by the Lord Jesus after the return of His disciples from a preaching mission He had sent them on during His earthly ministry.

You recall correctly and I briefly mentioned that in my last response (we were apparently typing at the same time).

 

[blue_ladybug]

If they were cast down long before the events in Genesis took place, then how did Satan appear before the LORD in the book of Job:

Job chapter 1

[6] Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.
[7] And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.

Again:

Job chapter 2

[1] Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the LORD.
[2] And the LORD said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.

???

We know from internal evidence within the book of Job that Job lived some time on this side of Noah's flood (For example, we read of "the Sabeans" and they were the descendants of somebody who is mentioned in Genesis chapter 10 on this side of the flood) and Noah's flood happened more than 1,600 years after Adam was created/made/formed, so how did Satan have access to heaven at this juncture in time?

In regard to what Jesus said about Satan, we read:

Luke chapter 10

[1] After these things the Lord appointed other seventy also, and sent them two and two before his face into every city and place, whither he himself would come.
[2] Therefore said he unto them, The harvest truly is great, but the labourers are few: pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he would send forth labourers into his harvest.
[3] Go your ways: behold, I send you forth as lambs among wolves.
[4] Carry neither purse, nor scrip, nor shoes: and salute no man by the way.
[5] And into whatsoever house ye enter, first say, Peace be to this house.
[6] And if the son of peace be there, your peace shall rest upon it: if not, it shall turn to you again.
[7] And in the same house remain, eating and drinking such things as they give: for the labourer is worthy of his hire. Go not from house to house.
[8] And into whatsoever city ye enter, and they receive you, eat such things as are set before you:
[9] And heal the sick that are therein, and say unto them, The kingdom of God is come nigh unto you.
[10] But into whatsoever city ye enter, and they receive you not, go your ways out into the streets of the same, and say,
[11] Even the very dust of your city, which cleaveth on us, we do wipe off against you: notwithstanding be ye sure of this, that the kingdom of God is come nigh unto you.
[12] But I say unto you, that it shall be more tolerable in that day for Sodom, than for that city.
[13] Woe unto thee, Chorazin! woe unto thee, Bethsaida! for if the mighty works had been done in Tyre and Sidon, which have been done in you, they had a great while ago repented, sitting in sackcloth and ashes.
[14] But it shall be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon at the judgment, than for you.
[15] And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted to heaven, shalt be thrust down to hell.
[16] He that heareth you heareth me; and he that despiseth you despiseth me; and he that despiseth me despiseth him that sent me.
[17] And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name.
[18] And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.
[19] Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.
[20] Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you; but rather rejoice, because your names are written in heaven.

Jesus' comment regarding Satan falling as lightning from heaven is understood by some to mean that as the 70 were casting out demons in Jesus' name, Jesus was beholding Satan's kingdom suffering damage. Others understand this to mean that Jesus was actually warning the 70 about PRIDE in that they were rejoicing that demons were subject unto them and Jesus was reminding them how PRIDE precedes a fall. In any case, I'll be happy to show you other scriptural examples where Satan and his angels have access to the heavenlies if need be.

they may have access to heaven,but I would think they'd be denied entrance.. they certainly don't reside there still..

 

[JesusistheChrist]

they may have access to heaven,but I would think they'd be denied entrance.. they certainly don't reside there still..

They do still have access to heaven and the Bible speaks of three different "heavens" with "the third heaven" apparently being the place of God's throne. Anyhow, if you recall in the book of Daniel how that Daniel had been praying and an angel was delayed in getting to him with the answer to his prayer because he encountered another "prince" who hindered him insomuch that Michael the archangel had to come and help him, then that is but one of many examples which shows that fallen angels still have access to the heavenly realms.

 

[Mitspa]

they may have access to heaven,but I would think they'd be denied entrance.. they certainly don't reside there still..

Satan once stood before God to accuse...but the Blood of Jesus cleansed that place he stood and accused, and now the Blood of the Lord Speaks in heaven...not satan the accuser!

 

[Jeff_56]

Here comes the "derail" that the OP requested wouldn't happen. Can you ask him this question elsewhere?

Where does the bible say we have to learn to walk in the spirit Mitspa?

I'm sorry if you misunderstood. I didn't mean the devil or demons take free will. I mean they can influence us, put thoughts in our head, scare us, inflict us with diseases and a whole bunch of nasty stuff but they cannot take away our free will.

so many answers posted just totally miss. no worries. seek yahweh while he may be found. no one else can help.

yes maam JFS --- in Scripture it is written and remains true that the prince of the power of the air controls most of the decisions of all men on earth. i.e. they don't have 'free will' yet.

likewise it is written that all of us who have been purchased by the blood of the lamb, forgiven of our sin, born again by the will of the father in heaven (not man's will, etc)....
also were under the power of the prince of the power of the air. (the devil). that's true, and never changed. that's still true of many visitors and many people we all know in person also.

 

[JesusistheChrist]

so many answers posted just totally miss. no worries. seek yahweh while he may be found. no one else can help.

yes maam JFS --- in Scripture it is written and remains true that the prince of the power of the air controls most of the decisions of all men on earth. i.e. they don't have 'free will' yet.

likewise it is written that all of us who have been purchased by the blood of the lamb, forgiven of our sin, born again by the will of the father in heaven (not man's will, etc)....
also were under the power of the prince of the power of the air. (the devil). that's true, and never changed. that's still true of many visitors and many people we all know in person also.

How did what you "quoted" me for "totally miss"?

I simply asked another member to not ask an off-topic question on this thread...

 

[Jeff_56]

try not to assume all posts totally missed.... including the posts i quoted.... this is

slowly being developed in the midst of a horrible hodgepodge of wrong thoughts and doctrines.

(like most all the threads)..... everything has to be tested and tested again.... very little that is

posted by 83.9% of the visitors/posters comes either from or for truth.

 

[Jeff_56]

Where does the bible say we have to learn to walk in the spirit Mitspa?

this is a good question, but the one you are asking doesn't know how(from reading his/her/its posts the last few weeks), and cannot figure it out.

it is a good question because no one who is walking carnally or in the flesh

or <simply> not walking in the spirit does not even recognize truth nor recognize demons <usually- unless Yahweh grants it for His Own Reason>

and like the seven sons of sceva does not have any authority over demons but will be ruled by sin and by demons.

 

[4enlightment]

So I went to this conference and it was all about spiritual warfare. The guy was like "demons have rights." And I'm sitting there like "what?" Well think about it. In the courtroom of God, it's a COURTROOM. Let's say a demon comes up to God and is like "See that person? they're a christian but they're sinning like there's no tomorrow and they aren't repenting. Can I go torment them?" God's gonna be like "I don't see why not." Because he is JUST.

However he gave us a way out and that is Jesus. If we repent of our sins, bind the demon and tell it to go away in the name of Jesus it will.

Remember the horrific experience at my school? I did a cleansing of my room and my bed last night and I had a GOOD DREAM ABOUT MY SCHOOL! The dream was where the moms of the school wrote apology letters to me.

There are specific steps to getting a demon to leave and I'll post them a little later but basically what we are doing is taking away a demons rights to torment us because we have rights too. We have authority over demons and we have the right to cast them out.

Now, you can't just be like, "Demon I command you to leave in the name of Jesus" if you have bitterness or greed or envy in your heart. That's why you repent beforehand.

What are your thoughts on this? oh and also...please can we act like Christians and be civil about this??? If you disagree with this let me know but please be polite! And please no hijacking. I know we all have emotions but please please please please set them aside for this one thread or start a new thread of your own and rant all you want about whatever you want. I'm sure people will understand. Thanks so much!

That will be all! ^_^

A demon inspires or entices us to do its father's will. Like for an example, let say that a demon has control over a certain person, and the demon enticed the person that he has control over to hit you; and then the demon entices you to hit the person back by telling you that it is justifiable in the scriptures under the clause that it says an eye for an eye and which that has been taken out of context; and so you return evil as if it is a good thing to do. And then the person has returned evil back to you, and it goes on and on that evil will never leave the house. But to prevent that, you must correct (rebuke) these thoughts that comes from the evil one, by replying back that it is also written to love your enemies and vengeance belongs to God, and that is how to conquer over demons by using the word or your tongue as a weapon; and which that is like repenting from your old ways, and going towards your new self.

 

[JFSurvivor]

Here are the steps. Sorry they're late.

Confess

Cancel permission of the demons
-also known as "loosing"

Command

Commit the reclaimed areas to Christ.

I hope this makes sense. This is from Deeper Walk Ministries.

 

[Angela53510]

Such a fascination with the dark side, by everyone in this post.

I remember reading CS Lewis' "Screwtape Letters" about a senior demon giving instructions to a junior demon on how to afflict his subject. One chapter was about how frustrating certain of "HIS" people were, because they were walking so close to "HIM" that you couldn't see them, let alone touch them.

That reminds me of this verse:

"fixing our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of faith, who for the joy set before Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and has sat down at the right hand of the throne of God." Hebrews 12:2

The word in Greek ἀρχηγὸν or archegon, for "author" has many connotations, including pioneer, leader, and shows Jesus is the leader of those who run life's race.

I prefer to fix my eyes on Jesus, and I know that will help me mature far more than any dealing with demons, or spiritual warfare. The point of spiritual warfare is to make sure you are under and obeying the leader of the war, which has already been won by Jesus Christ.

 

[MadParrotWoman]

Such a fascination with the dark side, by everyone in this post.

I remember reading CS Lewis' "Screwtape Letters" about a senior demon giving instructions to a junior demon on how to afflict his subject. One chapter was about how frustrating certain of "HIS" people were, because they were walking so close to "HIM" that you couldn't see them, let alone touch them.

That reminds me of this verse:

"fixing our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of faith, who for the joy set before Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and has sat down at the right hand of the throne of God." Hebrews 12:2

The word in Greek ἀρχηγὸν or archegon, for "author" has many connotations, including pioneer, leader, and shows Jesus is the leader of those who run life's race.

I prefer to fix my eyes on Jesus, and I know that will help me mature far more than any dealing with demons, or spiritual warfare. The point of spiritual warfare is to make sure you are under and obeying the leader of the war, which has already been won by Jesus Christ.

I think we are living in an age fascinated by all things dark. There are plenty of "spiritual" people around but I'm not talking spiritual in the way we see it as Christians. It would seem we are being blindly led further away from the light by ignorance.

 

[Utah]

I hate this thread title and seeing it every time I go to the Bible section.