SAVED BY WORKS

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dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#101
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
#101
Mitspa said:
Why are you worried about me? That's the point! I see no evidence that you or these other guys who talk about obedience and repentance have a level of godliness above any of the other believers on this forum? The only difference is that you guys talk about obedience ... It don't mean nothing that you feel guilty about your sin...you need to overcome it and then you can help others.
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If you notice the ones who believe you can lose salvation always portray themselves as those who sin way less and or not at all over the ones who believe eternal security.......and they automatically and erronously believe that we believe and teach that we can live anyway we want........self righteous hypocrites and like the Pharisee of old.........They come across like...I thank God I am not like this scum bag sinner over there! Makes me want to puke!
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#102
#102
dcontroversal said:
If you notice the ones who believe you can lose salvation always portray themselves as those who sin way less and or not at all over the ones who believe eternal security.......and they automatically and erronously believe that we believe and teach that we can live anyway we want........self righteous hypocrites and like the Pharisee of old.........They come across like...I thank God I am not like this scum bag sinner over there! Makes me want to puke!
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This is what I know about these types that are on the self-righteous side of religion...they always have hidden sins and many of them are in real bondage to all sorts of dark passions and lust. So they want others to feel as guilty as they do...but they never really live truly godly lives.
 
S

Skinski7

Banned
#103
Nov 26, 2011
3,818
62
0
#103
Rom 2:3 And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?
Rom 2:4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
Rom 2:5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
Rom 2:6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:
Rom 2:7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
Rom 2:8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
Rom 2:9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
Rom 2:10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
Rom 2:11 For there is no respect of persons with God.
 
W

WheresEnoch

Guest
#104
#104
Mitspa said:
I have not sinned by choice? what sort of godliness is that? you cant control yourself? And you think your continued lack of self-control and guilt puts you in a position to lecture others who very well are living more godly lives than you are?
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I know nothing about you Mitspa, I was merely posting on the topic of saved by works. I am not accusing you of sin lol.
I am only speaking of my own experience and understanding of God's Word.

I am telling you, I have not chosen to do anything sinful for a long time now. I am not saying that I am acting uncontrollably and stealing things or uncontrollably disrespecting my parents. I am saying that the only sins I am aware of that I have committed are the fleeting thoughts of the flesh which I submit upon their arrival into my conscienceness.

I am not trying to sound like a perfect person, I am trying to tell people that we can walk by the Spirit and we should walk by the Spirit. It becomes easy when we rely on the Spirit and change our view of sin from something fun, to death and destruction. Something to be avoided at all cost if we love God and love the people He puts in our lives.

Matthew 5
If your right eye causes you to sin, tear it out and throw it away. For it is better that you lose one of your members than that your whole body be thrown into hell. 30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. For it is better that you lose one of your members than that your whole body go into hell.
 
S

Skinski7

Banned
#105
Nov 26, 2011
3,818
62
0
#105
2Pe 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
2Pe 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
2Pe 3:14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
2Pe 3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
2Pe 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
2Pe 3:17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
 
S

Skinski7

Banned
#106
Nov 26, 2011
3,818
62
0
#106
[video=youtube;bRfkIoZ65YI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRfkIoZ65YI[/video]
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#107
#107
WheresEnoch said:
I know nothing about you Mitspa, I was merely posting on the topic of saved by works. I am not accusing you of sin lol.
I am only speaking of my own experience and understanding of God's Word.

I am telling you, I have not chosen to do anything sinful for a long time now. I am not saying that I am acting uncontrollably and stealing things or uncontrollably disrespecting my parents. I am saying that the only sins I am aware of that I have committed are the fleeting thoughts of the flesh which I submit upon their arrival into my conscienceness.

I am not trying to sound like a perfect person, I am trying to tell people that we can walk by the Spirit and we should walk by the Spirit. It becomes easy when we rely on the Spirit and change our view of sin from something fun, to death and destruction. Something to be avoided at all cost if we love God and love the people He puts in our lives.

Matthew 5
If your right eye causes you to sin, tear it out and throw it away. For it is better that you lose one of your members than that your whole body be thrown into hell. 30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. For it is better that you lose one of your members than that your whole body go into hell.
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So have you torn out your right eye? And you seem to be presenting a more holy life than your prior post?
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#108
#108
Skinski7 said:
2Pe 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
2Pe 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
2Pe 3:14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
2Pe 3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
2Pe 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
2Pe 3:17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
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Again ...finding scripture to demand others obey God has nothing to do with obedience..
 
W

WheresEnoch

Guest
#109
#109
And if we change our view of God's standards for us from impossible and burdensome, to wonderful and easy.

He does not give us commandments without purpose. They are for our benefit, they are good.
Love is what we are to become. Love what is good, hate that which is evil.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#110
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
#110
Skinski7 said:
[video=youtube;bRfkIoZ65YI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRfkIoZ65YI[/video]
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He preached believe, acknowledge and confess your belief=salvation........

If you confess with your MOUTH and BELIEVE in your HEART that God has raised him from the dead thou shalt be SAVED

He that BELIEVES on the SON hath (present tense) eternal/everlasting LIFE!

It pleased God by the FOOLISHNESS of PREACHING to SAVE them that BELIEVE....I guess it is FOOLISHNESS to you that one can BELIEVE and be saved......?
 
W

WheresEnoch

Guest
#111
#111
Why do you seem to be getting upset about this Mitspa?
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#112
#112
WheresEnoch said:
And if we change our view of God's standards for us from impossible and burdensome, to wonderful and easy.

He does not give us commandments without purpose. They are for our benefit, they are good.
Love is what we are to become. Love what is good, hate that which is evil.
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Well I hope someday you will obtain the level of obedience that those of us who trust in the grace of God have found?
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#113
#113
WheresEnoch said:
Why do you seem to be getting upset about this Mitspa?
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I am not upset, just making some points about the true reality of what is going on, on these forums...we have folks who talk about obedience but really only have words they quote from the bible.. That are most likely being motivated by their own shame and guilt, not because they are really obedient to the standards they are trying to preach to others.
 
W

WheresEnoch

Guest
#114
#114
dcontroversal said:
He preached believe, acknowledge and confess your belief=salvation........

If you confess with your MOUTH and BELIEVE in your HEART that God has raised him from the dead thou shalt be SAVED

He that BELIEVES on the SON hath (present tense) eternal/everlasting LIFE!

It pleased God by the FOOLISHNESS of PREACHING to SAVE them that BELIEVE....I guess it is FOOLISHNESS to you that one can BELIEVE and be saved......?
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The problem is your definition of believe and faith. We believe with our lives. Our faith is belief + action.

Jesus taught that if we love Him we will keep His commandments. He taught "go and sin no more" Jesus taught that we must abide in Him. Jesus taught that our righteousness must exceed that of the Pharisees. He taught that we must clean the inside of the cup. He taught us to be perfect as our Father in heaven is perfect. And on and on
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#115
#115
WheresEnoch said:
The problem is your definition of believe and faith. We believe with our lives. Our faith is belief + action.

Jesus taught that if we love Him we will keep His commandments. He taught "go and sin no more" Jesus taught that we must abide in Him. Jesus taught that our righteousness must exceed that of the Pharisees. He taught that we must clean the inside of the cup. He taught us to be perfect as our Father in heaven is perfect. And on and on
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But you have already admitted you do sin ..some more... so what standard are you keeping...we know what your trying to preach to us... You say you basically have faith and do your best to obey Gods will...right? So what problem do you have with what Dcon presented?
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

Banned
#116
Jul 22, 2014
10,350
51
0
#116
Mitspa said:
Why are you worried about me? That's the point! I see no evidence that you or these other guys who talk about obedience and repentance have a level of godliness above any of the other believers on this forum? The only difference is that you guys talk about obedience ... It don't mean nothing that you feel guilty about your sin...you need to overcome it and then you can help others.
Click to expand...
Why am I worried about you?

First, I am just trying to figure out what you believe.

Second, you are judging another believers who is trying to be righteous and yet you are not showing your hand in what you actually believe when it comes to soteriology and righteousness. But by what you said here in bold it implies that overcoming sin is not necessary for the believer. Is that what you believe? If that is the case, then Scripture says,

And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts (Galatians 5:24).

In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother. (1 John 3:10).

No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God (1 John 3:9 ESV).

Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect (Matthew 5:48).

So you must live as God's obedient children. Don't slip back into your old ways of living to satisfy your own desires. You didn't know any better then. But now you must be holy in everything you do, just as God who chose you is holy. For the Scriptures say, "You must be holy because I am holy." (1 Peter 1:14-16 NLT).

Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord (Hebrews 12:14).
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#117
#117
Look guys we know that many of you cherry pick certain scriptures to preach and talk about obedience ...that don't mean NOTHING! What biblical standard are you really keeping?
 
W

WheresEnoch

Guest
#118
#118
Mitspa said:
Look guys we know that many of you cherry pick certain scriptures to preach and talk about obedience ...that don't mean NOTHING! What biblical standard are you really keeping?
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Does it really matter what we say? It's about what Christ says
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#119
#119
Jason0047 said:
Why am I worried about you?

First, I am just trying to figure out what you believe.

Second, you are judging another believers who is trying to be righteous and yet you are not showing your hand in what you actually believe when it comes to soteriology and righteousness. But by what you said here in bold it implies that overcoming sin is not necessary for the believer. Is that what you believe? If that is the case, then Scripture says,

And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts (Galatians 5:24).

In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother. (1 John 3:10).

No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God (1 John 3:9 ESV).

Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect (Matthew 5:48).

So you must live as God's obedient children. Don't slip back into your old ways of living to satify your own desires. You didn't know any better then. But now you must be holy in everything you do, just as God who chose you is holy. For the Scriptures say, "You must be holy because I am holy." (1 Peter 1:14-16 NLT).

Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord (Hebrews 12:14).
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Again Jason...I don't care about what standard you cherry pick out of scripture to preach to me...I know I live godly, what I don't know is if you live godly and just because your find scripture about obedience, don't mean your really in obedience ....In fact what I have seen is that folks that do what your doing are often bound in sin.
 
Jason0047

Jason0047

Banned
#120
Jul 22, 2014
10,350
51
0
#120
Jesus said you cannot serve two masters. For you will hate the one and love the other. Jesus also said that a good tree cannot bring forth bad fruit (And vise versa). Jesus said we will know false prophets by their fruit. Peter even identifies the false prophets as having eyes full of adultery who cannot cease from sin (2 Peter 2:1, 14). Paul essentially says if any man teaches contrary to the words of Jesus Christ and the doctrine of Godliness is proud and knows nothing (1 Timothy 6:3-4). Jude 1:4 says there are those who have turned the grace of our God into a doctrine of immorality or lasciviousness.
 
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