"It is finished." What is the "it?"
- Thread starter santuzza
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E
More lies?
Scripture says we love because God first loved us (God powers our love)
You claim a person can be saved, actually experience the true love of God. and come to a point they no longer love, even though God is still showering them with love, until the point their salvation is lost.
No lies. just truth,
If you believed it, then yuo would not teach our security is in self. and conditional. and not in God and eternal.
Scripture says we love because God first loved us (God powers our love)
You claim a person can be saved, actually experience the true love of God. and come to a point they no longer love, even though God is still showering them with love, until the point their salvation is lost.
No lies. just truth,
If you believed it, then yuo would not teach our security is in self. and conditional. and not in God and eternal.
Ken,
why are you so far from helping me is a continuation of "My God, My God, Why have thou forsaken me?". Jesus understood why the Father could NOT look upon the SIN Jesus was taking upon Himself. The question is rhetorical looking to explain the (then future) event of the crucifixion in terms that would be understood in retrospect.
The primary intent of Ps 22 and Is 53 is to show that the crucifixion, when it happened, would be part of God's plan of redemption. God not only anticipated the crucifixion; but he anticipated the misunderstanding which led to expectation of a conquering king.
If you want to view the verse as a sign of sympathy on how we ourselves deal in hard/bad situations; I see no harm in that as long as you recognize that that is NOT the Psalm's primary concern.
why are you so far from helping me is a continuation of "My God, My God, Why have thou forsaken me?". Jesus understood why the Father could NOT look upon the SIN Jesus was taking upon Himself. The question is rhetorical looking to explain the (then future) event of the crucifixion in terms that would be understood in retrospect.
The primary intent of Ps 22 and Is 53 is to show that the crucifixion, when it happened, would be part of God's plan of redemption. God not only anticipated the crucifixion; but he anticipated the misunderstanding which led to expectation of a conquering king.
If you want to view the verse as a sign of sympathy on how we ourselves deal in hard/bad situations; I see no harm in that as long as you recognize that that is NOT the Psalm's primary concern.
I guess your question causes me to stop and wonder what exactly Jesus was trying to accomplish while on earth.
Yes, Jesus paid the debt for us all. It was necessary for him, I believe, to live a sinless life and then be crucified, in order to accomplish that. This deed allowed him to save us from Satan, who otherwise could torment us forever because of our sin.
Jesus also taught us how to live our lives so that we could have eternal peace, security, and happiness.
Yes, Jesus paid the debt for us all. It was necessary for him, I believe, to live a sinless life and then be crucified, in order to accomplish that. This deed allowed him to save us from Satan, who otherwise could torment us forever because of our sin.
Jesus also taught us how to live our lives so that we could have eternal peace, security, and happiness.
E
Forgive me if I am not single minded.
Jesus did not have to sin like adam in order to be separated by God because of his own personal sin. All he had to do is take my sin on his body to suffer that separation.
The separation is proved by the fact. He screamed when God turned his back on him (and the HS left him) My God My God, why have you departed from me
It might not mean much to you. then again, you follow calvins fatilistic view of God and salvation. But to those of us who understand out sin and separation due to that sin, If gives us hope that what he did was real. and That God did punish him for our sin. This hope grows our faith, and continues to allow us to believe in his name.
E
Nah.
If the penalty of sin is spiritual death.
Then Jesus must suffer that penalty. or he did not pay the penalty of sin.
If the penalty of sin was physical death, we have issues, For every one who dies physically would then be saved, because they paid for their own sin.
You pray you did not make Jason right when he said OSAS preaches the penalty of sin was physical death. for that would be sad. Just saying.
If the penalty of sin is spiritual death.
Then Jesus must suffer that penalty. or he did not pay the penalty of sin.
If the penalty of sin was physical death, we have issues, For every one who dies physically would then be saved, because they paid for their own sin.
You pray you did not make Jason right when he said OSAS preaches the penalty of sin was physical death. for that would be sad. Just saying.
K
Around and around we go though as I never said it wasn't a picture of the crucifixion.
I said it was a picture of the crucifixion, or better yet a prophecy about it. Just because I mention the other aspect of it does not take away from the crucifixion, as I am giving the full message that is mentioned in it.
E
Which would make Jesus words "it is finished" have meaning.
Which makes the words, "It is finished" Have absolutely no meaning whatsoever. Jesus would have had to say, It is finished, I did my part. now you do your part. Which he did not. Unless he did in those extra bibical books and writings you like to follow?