that verse simply means if you die in sin without Christ, there is no forgiveness. the Bible is not really that complicated scott. you and others make it so by your man-made theology and theory. I did respect you for a long time, but when you said earlier that carnal does not mean carnal, I lost. you and know one else should re-define the Bible. garbage.
Ok I have one scripture for the sinless
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Skinski
Yes I agree that Wesley was wrong on original sin. I do not hold to it. I agree with Pelagius there.
I think that the dispute is over which point a man becomes saved. I agree that there is no such thing as a sinning Christian. When I say a carnal believer I am not calling him a Christian. A carnal believer is a man who walks in the flesh and not the Spirit so therefore he has not been saved from sin. He has come to Christ for salvation and has been given the power to become a son of God but is not there yet. Most believers are in that state and the evidence is that they still sin. You claim that you do not sin I assume. Does that include the thoughts of your heart or are you just meaning deliberate sin? Sin is sin and brings spiritual death. We need to be delivered from sins of ignorance too. If the old man is dead then he cannot sin at all.
I may quote Wesley but I am not a Wesleyan and disagree with him on many points but most understand what the second blessing in regards to his teaching means.
Yes of course there is only one interpretation of Romans 7 that is correct but the church has taught three, two since the beginning. You are following the primitive view which Pelagius showed is not consistent with the view that there is no good in man at all which a Calvinist will teach. If that was the case, Augustine had to expain why there was a fight within of two natures. The Spirit is not given until after salvation.
Agreed.
Yes I agree that Wesley was wrong on original sin. I do not hold to it. I agree with Pelagius there.
I think that the dispute is over which point a man becomes saved. I agree that there is no such thing as a sinning Christian. When I say a carnal believer I am not calling him a Christian. A carnal believer is a man who walks in the flesh and not the Spirit so therefore he has not been saved from sin. He has come to Christ for salvation and has been given the power to become a son of God but is not there yet. Most believers are in that state and the evidence is that they still sin. You claim that you do not sin I assume. Does that include the thoughts of your heart or are you just meaning deliberate sin? Sin is sin and brings spiritual death. We need to be delivered from sins of ignorance too. If the old man is dead then he cannot sin at all.
I may quote Wesley but I am not a Wesleyan and disagree with him on many points but most understand what the second blessing in regards to his teaching means.
Yes of course there is only one interpretation of Romans 7 that is correct but the church has taught three, two since the beginning. You are following the primitive view which Pelagius showed is not consistent with the view that there is no good in man at all which a Calvinist will teach. If that was the case, Augustine had to expain why there was a fight within of two natures. The Spirit is not given until after salvation.
Agreed.
K
The problem with going by this passage in 1 John 5 though is that people use it to say some sins are worse then others, and turn some sins as acceptable to do. However they do with this passage as they do with others in misusing them and do not take the rest of the chapter or other scriptures that go along with it to understand the full meaning.
Apostle John shows previously in verses 14-15 that those sins that do not lead to death are those that have been asked/petitioned for forgiveness of.
We may see a brother or sister still struggling in turning from a sin they have asked forgiveness of, and therefore we know and have confidence they will be forgiven of it as they have asked and are trying to turn from it. We in turn are to pray for them for God to help them continue to turn away from that sinful way. John goes on to verse 18 showing that a person who is of God will not continue to live a deliberate sinful lifestyle, but this does not mean we will not slip up or mess up from time to time and sin again. It just means a person who is a born again believer will follow the words of God and will confess that sin and turn from it, and not continue in it to where they let it control their life again.
you can safely and probably necessarily not try to think or trust in pelgius or agustine or any such figures
that
cannot
be tested by yahweh's WORD, and they are not needed for any good thing, life, or pursuit in yahshua,
especially since the father himself directly in yahshua can let you know the truth about what the father means in HIS OWN WORD (TORAH AND SCRIPTURE).
it is a miracle that those people who abide in yahshua in union with yahweh understand what yahweh says and what he means,
as he permits,
and they work together with yahweh in yahshua , by grace, instead of fighting all manner of demonic doctrines men hold to for 2000 years and so on.
anything the rcc uses to try to deceive people should not be trusted, simply because by association with the condemned heresy everything and everyone is untrustworthy until proven separately by GOD'S WORD and SPIRIT.....
that
cannot
be tested by yahweh's WORD, and they are not needed for any good thing, life, or pursuit in yahshua,
especially since the father himself directly in yahshua can let you know the truth about what the father means in HIS OWN WORD (TORAH AND SCRIPTURE).
it is a miracle that those people who abide in yahshua in union with yahweh understand what yahweh says and what he means,
as he permits,
and they work together with yahweh in yahshua , by grace, instead of fighting all manner of demonic doctrines men hold to for 2000 years and so on.
anything the rcc uses to try to deceive people should not be trusted, simply because by association with the condemned heresy everything and everyone is untrustworthy until proven separately by GOD'S WORD and SPIRIT.....
Skinski
I don't know how you understand this state as that of an unbeliever. I have never been in that state. As an unbeliever, I knew that I had to obey the law of the land (not the Bible specifically). I certainly did not delight in the law. I was pleased it was there as far as containing wicked men. I was pleased that they would be convicted if they killed or stole. But that is not delight. That is just relief that there was law which gave me some protection, but many a time I did not like the law and thought it an ass like the speed limit on freeways (motorways) I would break it unless I saw the police. I would break the law whenever I could get away with it. If you talk about Paul as a Jew then this text is not applicable to the ordinary man. Maybe in the US men love the law but in my country they try to get away with as much as they can. It is not consistent with reality what you are saying.
I don't know how you understand this state as that of an unbeliever. I have never been in that state. As an unbeliever, I knew that I had to obey the law of the land (not the Bible specifically). I certainly did not delight in the law. I was pleased it was there as far as containing wicked men. I was pleased that they would be convicted if they killed or stole. But that is not delight. That is just relief that there was law which gave me some protection, but many a time I did not like the law and thought it an ass like the speed limit on freeways (motorways) I would break it unless I saw the police. I would break the law whenever I could get away with it. If you talk about Paul as a Jew then this text is not applicable to the ordinary man. Maybe in the US men love the law but in my country they try to get away with as much as they can. It is not consistent with reality what you are saying.
Skinski
You are saying that he inner man is the mind. I don't agree:
Daily Devotions: The Inner Man | Ephesians 3:14-21 | RayStedman.org
You are saying that he inner man is the mind. I don't agree:
Daily Devotions: The Inner Man | Ephesians 3:14-21 | RayStedman.org
I agrre with you on this post. The only thing that should be added is, it is the Holy Spirit w3ho leads us into the truth of scripture, and He we must totally rely on to learn truth.
Many look to scholars and thelogians because they have great academic ability, and not sadly because they are mightily led of the Holy Spirit
Many look to scholars and thelogians because they have great academic ability, and not sadly because they are mightily led of the Holy Spirit
Scholars and theologians are useful as they are able to pinpoint inconsistencies in anyones theology because of their knowledge of the ancient languages and extensive study of scripture. I know that many or most of them were or are not led by the Spirit but even so, we can learn from them. It's all very well saying God showed me this or that, but if it does not fit in with a theological system and by that I mean Paul's and is inconsistent with the rest of scripture, then we need to do a rethink.
The "inward man " of...
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
...is a reference to the mind.
Eph 3:14-21 speaks of the "inner man" in the context of the Spirit strengthening our heart.
Romans 7:14-28 is an illustration of a problem. We cannot strip things of their context.
Romans 7 is addressed to those whom know the law...
Rom 7:1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
...where Paul gives a defence of the law. Sin unto death is only possible via knowledge because one cannot rebel without the knowledge of something to rebel against, hence the distinction between a sin unto death and a sin not unto death.
Rom 7:9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
Rom 7:10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
Rom 7:11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
Spiritual death is wrought via either a violation of conscience or a violation of a commandment (Rom 5:13-14). Paul explains how even though the law is a good thing (for it gives man direction) it wrought death through sin taking occasion of the knowledge it brought.
Once this death is reaped the law cannot bring redemption. The Romans wretch recognises the value in the law yet despite this recognition he still finds himself in bondage to sin.
Sin is addictive. Repeated acts of sin actually pattern a physical effect on our brains. This is why there can be no victory over sin in the flesh because the flesh because patterned or adapted to sinning. The root of sinning which is iniquity in the heart has to be first destroyed through repentance and it is only then that one can submit wholeheartedly to God and be quickened unto life.
The Romans wretch is a believer only in the sense that he believes in God and mentally assents to the good of the law. He is not a Christian. Paul is giving this example to those whom "know the law" so that they know why the old man must die and be reborn of the Spirit.
Context is everything. The context of Romans 7 is the rest of Romans 7 as well as 6 and 8, not to mention the entire book. The context is not Ephesians chapter 3. False teachers rip things from their context.
Look at what Paul writes in Romans 6...
Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Rom 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
The context of Rom 6:3-7 is that of "grace abounding when sin abounds." In other words when we were sinning God's grace was still manifest and available. Due to this should we then keep sinning that grace may abound even more?
Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
Paul answers with an emphatic NO and then gives emphasis one what Christianity actually is...
Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
A Christian is dead to sin and therefore cannot possibly live in it any more. Hence Romans 6:3-7.
He that is dead is free from sin. The old man is crucified and the body of sin is destroyed whereby the service of sin ceases. The Romans wretch has not experienced this. The Romans wretch has not died to sin and therefore has not been risen up to newness of life whereby he abides in the Spirit of life in Jesus Christ.
I suspect the issues you have with what I say is the result of reading too many commentaries. Throw that stuff in the garbage where it belongs. Elaborate on scripture with your own words, not with the words of someone else.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
...is a reference to the mind.
Eph 3:14-21 speaks of the "inner man" in the context of the Spirit strengthening our heart.
Romans 7:14-28 is an illustration of a problem. We cannot strip things of their context.
Romans 7 is addressed to those whom know the law...
Rom 7:1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
...where Paul gives a defence of the law. Sin unto death is only possible via knowledge because one cannot rebel without the knowledge of something to rebel against, hence the distinction between a sin unto death and a sin not unto death.
Rom 7:9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
Rom 7:10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
Rom 7:11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
Spiritual death is wrought via either a violation of conscience or a violation of a commandment (Rom 5:13-14). Paul explains how even though the law is a good thing (for it gives man direction) it wrought death through sin taking occasion of the knowledge it brought.
Once this death is reaped the law cannot bring redemption. The Romans wretch recognises the value in the law yet despite this recognition he still finds himself in bondage to sin.
Sin is addictive. Repeated acts of sin actually pattern a physical effect on our brains. This is why there can be no victory over sin in the flesh because the flesh because patterned or adapted to sinning. The root of sinning which is iniquity in the heart has to be first destroyed through repentance and it is only then that one can submit wholeheartedly to God and be quickened unto life.
The Romans wretch is a believer only in the sense that he believes in God and mentally assents to the good of the law. He is not a Christian. Paul is giving this example to those whom "know the law" so that they know why the old man must die and be reborn of the Spirit.
Context is everything. The context of Romans 7 is the rest of Romans 7 as well as 6 and 8, not to mention the entire book. The context is not Ephesians chapter 3. False teachers rip things from their context.
Look at what Paul writes in Romans 6...
Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Rom 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
The context of Rom 6:3-7 is that of "grace abounding when sin abounds." In other words when we were sinning God's grace was still manifest and available. Due to this should we then keep sinning that grace may abound even more?
Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
Paul answers with an emphatic NO and then gives emphasis one what Christianity actually is...
Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
A Christian is dead to sin and therefore cannot possibly live in it any more. Hence Romans 6:3-7.
He that is dead is free from sin. The old man is crucified and the body of sin is destroyed whereby the service of sin ceases. The Romans wretch has not experienced this. The Romans wretch has not died to sin and therefore has not been risen up to newness of life whereby he abides in the Spirit of life in Jesus Christ.
I suspect the issues you have with what I say is the result of reading too many commentaries. Throw that stuff in the garbage where it belongs. Elaborate on scripture with your own words, not with the words of someone else.
I think your over analyzing the simplicity of the similitude I presented. I don't know anything about the concept of penal substitution, or who Anselm is, but I know my sins have been forgiven, blotted out, or how ever one might want to say it. I was just trying to use money to show this similitude, but not everyone will get it, or agree with it, but it makes sense to me.
Yeah, using a similitude to represent something is a bad practice huh? I wonder where I learned that from? 
Paying off a debt is the very opposite of having a debt forgiven.
Well you might want to learn about Penal Substitution because it is a very popular doctrine which is giving millions of people a feeling of assurance that they can sin and not surely die. We do not live in bubbles and ought to deal with our surroundings.
Communication is very important. Understanding terms and meanings gives us insight in how to counter deception when we see it, lest we ignorantly promote a deception without realising it.
Remember language is but a means to communicate thoughts between people. It is important that we define our terms lest the person we are attempting to communicate to concludes our meaning to be something entirely different.
Jesus warned for us to be careful in what manner we hear things. This should also apply that we ought to take care in what manner we speak.
Communication is very important. Understanding terms and meanings gives us insight in how to counter deception when we see it, lest we ignorantly promote a deception without realising it.
Remember language is but a means to communicate thoughts between people. It is important that we define our terms lest the person we are attempting to communicate to concludes our meaning to be something entirely different.
Jesus warned for us to be careful in what manner we hear things. This should also apply that we ought to take care in what manner we speak.
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I would agree with someone saying I don't have a desire to sin but I still sin and now that I am reborn and under Grace if I confess my sins he is just and faithful to forgive me of my sins and cleanse me from all unrighteousness but when someone says I don't have to sin and then they turn right around and sin I start wondering why did they sin if they didn't have to sin.
That is not what the Bible teaches.
The Bible teaches that mercy is conditioned on both confession and the forsaking of sin.
Pro 28:13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.
If one is still engaged in rebellion to God then they are still a rebel even though they might claim to be "struggling." Worldly sorrow leads to "struggle" because the root of the problem is not addressed. It is only godly sorrow which works a repentance unto salvation.
One cannot be "struggling" with child molestation or pornography/masturbation and have confidence they will be forgiven. The sin has to stop and it stops through the genuine repentance experience.
The issue today is that genuine repentance is seldom taught due to the notion of "inability" implied through the "born a sinner" doctrine. Thus people are compelled to approach God as victims who "cannot help it" and then WAIT on God to effect the change. This is one way Satan can keep people in the service of sin and have them thinking they will be forgiven.
God only effects change when we submit wholeheartedly to Him. The wild horse must be broken before it will submit to a rider. God wants to ride us but we have to cease throwing God off. Godly sorrow produces this...
2Co 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
2Co 7:11 For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter.
1. Carefulness.
2. Clearing of wrong doing.
3. Indignation over sin.
4. Fear of God.
5. Vehement desire to do right.
6. A zealousness for righteousness.
7. Revenge against sin.
In all things we prove ourselves CLEAR or PURE in regards to the sin. The sin has stopped. Repentance is the change of mind that takes place where we truly agree with God about sin, righteousness and judgement and the result is a total forsaking of rebellion and a wholehearted yielding. God then regenerates us by His Spirit and we are raised up and empowered whereby we can maintain a walk in victory over the lust of the flesh, lust of the eyes, and the pride of life.
To teach anyone that they merely have to "ask for forgiveness" whilst they keep sinning is a teaching of the devil. Don't fall for it. Such a teaching gives people an excuse to keep sinning whilst they wait on God to make them cease from their rebellion.
Sin unto death is this...
Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Sin Unto Death is the OPPOSITE of Obedience Unto Righteousness.
Therefore...
Sin Unto Death = Disobedience Unto Unrighteousness.
If we use the example of an individual who is "struggling" with pornography even though they desire to stop. That person has not truly repented yet. They have not crucified the flesh with its passions and desires (Gal 5:24), they have not crucified their old man whereby the body of sin is destroyed (Rom 6:6). They have therefore not ceased from sin. They are in bondage and need to be set free.
Rom 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
Rom 6:18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
We cannot serve both sin and righteousness. It is one or the other. Peter wrote...
1Pe 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;
1Pe 4:2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God.
If we are genuine Christians then we no longer live the rest of our time in the flesh to the lusts of men. Rather we live to the will of God, hence we have ceased from sin.
Very simple stuff that the Bible clearly teaches. The problem with many people is they don't want to stop sinning and thus don't want to hear a message which states that they have to.
The Bible teaches that mercy is conditioned on both confession and the forsaking of sin.
Pro 28:13 He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.
If one is still engaged in rebellion to God then they are still a rebel even though they might claim to be "struggling." Worldly sorrow leads to "struggle" because the root of the problem is not addressed. It is only godly sorrow which works a repentance unto salvation.
One cannot be "struggling" with child molestation or pornography/masturbation and have confidence they will be forgiven. The sin has to stop and it stops through the genuine repentance experience.
The issue today is that genuine repentance is seldom taught due to the notion of "inability" implied through the "born a sinner" doctrine. Thus people are compelled to approach God as victims who "cannot help it" and then WAIT on God to effect the change. This is one way Satan can keep people in the service of sin and have them thinking they will be forgiven.
God only effects change when we submit wholeheartedly to Him. The wild horse must be broken before it will submit to a rider. God wants to ride us but we have to cease throwing God off. Godly sorrow produces this...
2Co 7:10 For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
2Co 7:11 For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter.
1. Carefulness.
2. Clearing of wrong doing.
3. Indignation over sin.
4. Fear of God.
5. Vehement desire to do right.
6. A zealousness for righteousness.
7. Revenge against sin.
In all things we prove ourselves CLEAR or PURE in regards to the sin. The sin has stopped. Repentance is the change of mind that takes place where we truly agree with God about sin, righteousness and judgement and the result is a total forsaking of rebellion and a wholehearted yielding. God then regenerates us by His Spirit and we are raised up and empowered whereby we can maintain a walk in victory over the lust of the flesh, lust of the eyes, and the pride of life.
To teach anyone that they merely have to "ask for forgiveness" whilst they keep sinning is a teaching of the devil. Don't fall for it. Such a teaching gives people an excuse to keep sinning whilst they wait on God to make them cease from their rebellion.
Sin unto death is this...
Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
Sin Unto Death is the OPPOSITE of Obedience Unto Righteousness.
Therefore...
Sin Unto Death = Disobedience Unto Unrighteousness.
If we use the example of an individual who is "struggling" with pornography even though they desire to stop. That person has not truly repented yet. They have not crucified the flesh with its passions and desires (Gal 5:24), they have not crucified their old man whereby the body of sin is destroyed (Rom 6:6). They have therefore not ceased from sin. They are in bondage and need to be set free.
Rom 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
Rom 6:18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.
We cannot serve both sin and righteousness. It is one or the other. Peter wrote...
1Pe 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;
1Pe 4:2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God.
If we are genuine Christians then we no longer live the rest of our time in the flesh to the lusts of men. Rather we live to the will of God, hence we have ceased from sin.
Very simple stuff that the Bible clearly teaches. The problem with many people is they don't want to stop sinning and thus don't want to hear a message which states that they have to.
Grace is not a license to keep sinning and confessing. Many false teachers subtly imply that it is such a license and we are warned of this in the Bible.
Jud 1:3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
Jud 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
The context of 1Joh 1:7-10 is of a once and for all cleansing of ALL sin and ALL unrighteousness whereby we "keep the commandments and walk as He walked (1Joh 2:3-6).
People will snip 1Joh 1:9 from its context and use to teach the sin/repent/sin/repent/sin/repent/sin/repent cycle that many believe.
Carefully read the passage...
1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
Now compare it to the cleansing mentioned here...
Heb 10:19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
Heb 10:20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;
Heb 10:21 And having an high priest over the house of God;
Heb 10:22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
Heb 10:23 Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised
Heb 10:24 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
Heb 10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.
Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
Heb 10:28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
Heb 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
To willfully sin after having been cleansed is to despise the Spirit of grace. We are warned against doing that. This is why we are not to pray for someone who sins unto death. Sinning unto death is an act of rebellion for it is the willful turning from the light. God will not work with someone who does that, that person needs to repent and yield to God. There is no forgiveness in rebellion. There is only no condemnation for those who are IN Christ Jesus whom walk after the Spirit (Rom 8:1).
Many people want to believe in a forgiveness IN sin. If one is abiding in Jesus then one cannot possibly be sinning because Jesus does not lead us to sin. We have to forsake Christ in turning away from Him in order to sin and that is what the condemnation is, ie. a rejection of light.
Jud 1:3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
Jud 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
The context of 1Joh 1:7-10 is of a once and for all cleansing of ALL sin and ALL unrighteousness whereby we "keep the commandments and walk as He walked (1Joh 2:3-6).
People will snip 1Joh 1:9 from its context and use to teach the sin/repent/sin/repent/sin/repent/sin/repent cycle that many believe.
Carefully read the passage...
1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
Now compare it to the cleansing mentioned here...
Heb 10:19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
Heb 10:20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;
Heb 10:21 And having an high priest over the house of God;
Heb 10:22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
Heb 10:23 Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised
Heb 10:24 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
Heb 10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.
Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
Heb 10:28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
Heb 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
To willfully sin after having been cleansed is to despise the Spirit of grace. We are warned against doing that. This is why we are not to pray for someone who sins unto death. Sinning unto death is an act of rebellion for it is the willful turning from the light. God will not work with someone who does that, that person needs to repent and yield to God. There is no forgiveness in rebellion. There is only no condemnation for those who are IN Christ Jesus whom walk after the Spirit (Rom 8:1).
Many people want to believe in a forgiveness IN sin. If one is abiding in Jesus then one cannot possibly be sinning because Jesus does not lead us to sin. We have to forsake Christ in turning away from Him in order to sin and that is what the condemnation is, ie. a rejection of light.