Which laws are and are not valid?

[Elin]

Elin,

What I am trying to say is that IMO
the 'Jewish Roots Movement' has, for the most part , NO CONNECTION WITH JUDAISM either ethnically or doctrinally. They are Gentiles who are masquerading as Jews with no understanding; and putting themselves and all who they can seduce under Law.

I have never met a person of Jewish upbringing who, after coming to faith in Christ, puts himself/herself back under Law.

Though many, including myself, see value in continuing to observe elements of the law without being under compulsion of law.

So these law radicals who reject part or most of the NT, are not Jews at all, but Gentiles masquerading as Jews?

That is really good to know.

They're giving Jews a bad name.

 

[JesusIsAll]

Yes, we forget that Paul said it was a weak faith that did not allow certain foods, or regarded one day more sacred than another.

However, these folks view themselves as stronger in faith, not weaker as Paul says, for doing such things, and they regard the non-observers of such things as not having a full faith.

So much for man's view of faith and godliness. . .

God's truth is good at standing man's wisdom on its head. . .and some of us keep trying to return the favor.

It even only stands to reason that, if we need to supplement the work of Christ, there is something we're not completely trusting in Him and in the completeness of His work. There's often an almost, "Better do this stuff, too, just in case." This is not faith in and trust in the Lord, with the abandon of strong faith, or it seems to me faith that sees the obvious, that there's, for instance, no merit to what you put in your belly. There's no ritual mojo we can supplement Christ's finished work with, nor need we.

 

[MarcR]

Elin,

I know of several mainstream churches of conservative theology who have found value in observing the appointed times of Lev chapter 23 from a New Testament perspective. Doing so helps clarify the true significance of much of Jesus' earthly ministry.

 

[BS]

Does that include all the NT as the word of God?

yes The whole Bible!

 

[JesusIsAll]

So these law radicals who reject part or most of the NT, are not Jews at all, but Gentiles masquerading as Jews?

That is really good to know.

They're giving Jews a bad name.

They're just Gentile, freakazoid posers, do not represent Judaism. These sacred names guys got bitten by Buffalo Bill Hawkins on the cable access channel or something.

 

[Sirk]

They're just Gentile, freakazoid posers, do not represent Judaism. These sacred names guys got bitten by Buffalo Bill Hawkins on the cable access channel or something.

LOL! I think you are a much smarter version of me!

 

[BS]

because
.... and he that soweth discord among brethren.

 

[Biblelogic01]

As Yahweh?
So where are they coming from?

Is there a difference between the Jewish Christian and the Messianic Jew?
(Note which is the noun in each.)

I see you as a Jewish Christian.

Those who subject the NT to the OT, or reject part of the NT, I view as Messianic Jew.

Could you give me some clarity on what I am trying to describe?

There is a big difference between a Messianic Jew and a Jewish Christian.
I've been a part of both (I am what you would concider a Jewish Christian I guess).
When I was a part of the Messianic movement there was a lot of judging and condemning of others, plus a lot of the people did not practice what they preached.

I currently go a Jewish synagogue. We do call ourselves Jewish, but we believe and follow Yeshua as the Messiah in everything we do as far as Torah observance. We do not concider ourselves "under the law" because Yeshua has given us salvation. We follow Torah as a lifestyle, and in obedience. The focus of the synagogue is to live as the apostles lived. Which in fact they were Jewish, and did live a Jewish lifestyle.

We do not force what we follow on others, and we are also taught to not force what we follow on others.

If someone asks a question on why I follow what I follow I will give an answer, and I will use scripture to back it up.
Now that does not mean I'm forcing it on someone else, and if someone disagrees with me I'll defend my position on it, because I'm not going to let someone else tell me how to translate scripture just because they think their way is right and my way is wrong or vise versa.

I don't know if you've noticed, but I post less than I use to. And that's mainly because that chastizement on the "forcing" part that teaching my rabbi did was recent and I felt majorly convict by it, and my eyes were openned when he brought up the scriptures and what not. Because I do realize a lot of my older post did come out as a "forcing issue" so I try to stay away from that now.

 

[JesusIsAll]

LOL! I think you are a much smarter version of me!

Not really. I saw that guy on the access channel, with his eBay yarmulke, yad and shawl, and P.T. Barnum had nothing on him! What was difficult was figuring out his religious faith, amongst all the spaghetti exegesis, from his special Bible translation of sacred names. It was like watching some child play Jew, the scary part that he had followers.

 

[BS]

Because I do realize a lot of my older post did come out as a "forcing issue" so I try to stay away from that now.

Thank you! The way of what God teach us is really amazing !

 

[MarcR]

There is a big difference between a Messianic Jew and a Jewish Christian.
I've been a part of both (I am what you would concider a Jewish Christian I guess).
When I was a part of the Messianic movement there was a lot of judging and condemning of others, plus a lot of the people did not practice what they preached.

I currently go a Jewish synagogue. We do call ourselves Jewish, but we believe and follow Yeshua as the Messiah in everything we do as far as Torah observance. We do not concider ourselves "under the law" because Yeshua has given us salvation. We follow Torah as a lifestyle, and in obedience. The focus of the synagogue is to live as the apostles lived. Which in fact they were Jewish, and did live a Jewish lifestyle.

We do not force what we follow on others, and we are also taught to not force what we follow on others.

If someone asks a question on why I follow what I follow I will give an answer, and I will use scripture to back it up.
Now that does not mean I'm forcing it on someone else, and if someone disagrees with me I'll defend my position on it, because I'm not going to let someone else tell me how to translate scripture just because they think their way is right and my way is wrong or vise versa.

I don't know if you've noticed, but I post less than I use to. And that's mainly because that chastizement on the "forcing" part that teaching my rabbi did was recent and I felt majorly convict by it, and my eyes were openned when he brought up the scriptures and what not. Because I do realize a lot of my older post did come out as a "forcing issue" so I try to stay away from that now.

Once again, I want to clarify:

There are two types of assemblies which call themselves Messianic:

1) Jewish believers who band together to preserve their ethnic heritage. While these tend to observe the appointed times of Leviticus 23; most attend mainstream churches; and have no interest in putting anyone under the Law.

2) Gentiles masquerading as Jews without understanding. These try to put themselves and all around them under the Law; and are fixated on mispronouncing the Father's name.


You may find exceptions; but, as a rule, Jewish believers do NOT put themselves or others under Law.

 

[BS]

So these law radicals who reject part or most of the NT, are not Jews at all, but Gentiles masquerading as Jews?
.

Mathew, here you will see the people who won`t talk on the topic. They will talk about the opinion of the other people. It happens ... That was the reason I have told you to read the Bible and to have God for you teacher! Do not hurry and read and think and read - slow. The LORD bless thee, and keep thee!

 

[BS]

May I remind you -ALL OF YOU what the topic is? It was written by a kid!!!! And I am wondering why you people have decided to change it exactly here? It is seems like war about his soul ... Are here people who are enemies ? Shell we crucify someone who respect the Law of God? Shell we be proud of our own understanding of the words ?
What a "perfect" example of "Christian love" on the topic of the kid!

 

[JesusIsAll]

May I remind you -ALL OF YOU what the topic is? It was written by a kid!!!! And I am wondering why you people have decided to change it exactly here? It is seems like war about his soul ... Are here people who are enemies ? Shell we crucify someone who respect the Law of God? Shell we be proud of our own understanding of the words ?
What a "perfect" example of "Christian love" on the topic of the kid!

"The lady doth protest too much, methinks."​

 

[BS]

"The lady doth protest too much, methinks."​

I am so glad you have known Shakespeare
I am glad I have known you - the parts of the body must known each other ... unless it is no flu... is it?
The Jewish have a wonderful word. Have you heard it? Shalom brother!

 

[ember]

May I remind you -ALL OF YOU what the topic is? It was written by a kid!!!! And I am wondering why you people have decided to change it exactly here? It is seems like war about his soul ... Are here people who are enemies ? Shell we crucify someone who respect the Law of God? Shell we be proud of our own understanding of the words ?
What a "perfect" example of "Christian love" on the topic of the kid!

You need to calm down...you are yelling at everyone in front of the kid

that's not a good example....some warm milk perhaps?

 

[ember]

OK...just checked...Matthew is not a kid nor a child ...not even a teenager

Matthew is a young man who by now may be wondering why someone has taken it upon themself to try and rescue him from other believers

he's been here since 2011...so I guess he likes it

 

[MarcR]

Ember,

While I do not do so myself, many people who have adult children think of young adults, in their early 20s as kids.

 

[p_rehbein]

I wonder how many commenting here have actually read through all of the 613 Laws? It might be an eye opener or game changer for some, for many here who profess that it isn't necessary to obey those Laws will be shocked to find out they have been living in obedience to them all their lives. Wow..........

Seriously, might want to read through all of the 613 Laws before commenting too much.

 

[ember]

Ember,

While I do not do so myself, many people who have adult children think of young adults, in their early 20s as kids.

Yeah...I can agree on that...most 20 yr olds don't think of themself that way LOL!