A
Arvir
Guest
The difference between the works of the law and the works whereby faith is made perfect.
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A
Arvir
Guest
In Romans 3, it says that we cannot be justified by the deeds of the law. Yes indeed. But what is this law being referred to?
We can be justified by works, as it is written in James 2:21.
"Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?"
Now such works are the works whereby faith is made perfect, and these are not the works or deeds of the law, (because when Abraham offered Isaac his son upon the altar, he did not do it for the sake of keeping the law, which was given through Moses at a latter time, but he did it because he believed God, and it was counted to him for righteousness). Therefore, if anyone may say that there is a contradiction concerning this, I do not agree, neither does the Bible. Now likewise, if we be circumcised for the sake of keeping the law, we cannot be justified, because the law itself says, That there is none righteous, no, not one: and whatever the law says, it says to them who are under the law, as it is written. But if we, having faith, keep the commandments of the Lord Jesus Christ, we, being under grace and not under the law, are justified. And faith, if it does not have works, is dead, as it is written.
We can be justified by works, as it is written in James 2:21.
"Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?"
Now such works are the works whereby faith is made perfect, and these are not the works or deeds of the law, (because when Abraham offered Isaac his son upon the altar, he did not do it for the sake of keeping the law, which was given through Moses at a latter time, but he did it because he believed God, and it was counted to him for righteousness). Therefore, if anyone may say that there is a contradiction concerning this, I do not agree, neither does the Bible. Now likewise, if we be circumcised for the sake of keeping the law, we cannot be justified, because the law itself says, That there is none righteous, no, not one: and whatever the law says, it says to them who are under the law, as it is written. But if we, having faith, keep the commandments of the Lord Jesus Christ, we, being under grace and not under the law, are justified. And faith, if it does not have works, is dead, as it is written.
When Paul said one is not justified by works and James said one is justified by works, they are not contradicting but are speaking about different types of works.
--The works Paul speaks about is when one tired to merit ones salvation by trying to keep the OT law perfectly.
--The works James speaks about are obedient works in doing the will of God. Obeying God's will is what perfects faith. Failing to obey the will of God leaves one's faith imperfect, dead. Abraham obeyed the will of God in offering Isaac thereby perfecting his faith. If Abraham had lack of obedient works in not offering Isaac, that would have left his faith imperfect, dead leaving Abraham unjustified before God.
You are in error about this. Did you ever read this?
Works here means works all categories. No works at all, whether they be works of the law or works of faith, has any place in justification, since it is all about being spiritually raised from the dead to life with God. This is God's work alone, without our help. We are but mere passive recipients of an undeserved pardon. As a fruit of having been justified, having been regenerated, works of faith follows. And these works are motivated but nothing else than love of God for having justified us, having saved us.
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How can "not of works" in Eph 2:9 mean no works all categories all when the very next verse shows one cannot be a Christian remaining saved without doing good works? If one is to be a Christian and saved then he MUST do good works and has no choice in this matter. One that has become Christian yet does not do good works will be lost, Mt 25.
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You might want to read the 11th Chapter of Hebrews to see this clearly.............he was JUSTIFIED because of his FAITH.
Justified is used in two ways.
1. Primarily in a legal sense. Paul often uses it this way, where God declares someone righteous.
2. Secondarily it is sometimes used 'to show' someone righteous. James uses this meaning often. It carries the idea of vindicate. Ex. ..
Matthew 11:19 (KJV) The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children.
Applying the same meaning to both words brings confusion and endless debates.
1. Primarily in a legal sense. Paul often uses it this way, where God declares someone righteous.
2. Secondarily it is sometimes used 'to show' someone righteous. James uses this meaning often. It carries the idea of vindicate. Ex. ..
Matthew 11:19 (KJV) The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children.
Applying the same meaning to both words brings confusion and endless debates.
According to the Scripture I read it is God who justifies us through Jesus Christ. So, not sure works will do the trick.
Romans 3:23) For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
24 .) Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
25 .) Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
26 .) To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
27 .) Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
Romans 3:23) For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
24 .) Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
25 .) Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
26 .) To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
27 .) Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
S
Sirk
Guest
I think works are for us. God teaches us generosity because it is good for us. He doesn't want His money back...he wants us to worship him with our generosity because He loves us and it is good for us.
A
Arvir
Guest
First, the works referred to in Ephesians 2 are the works of righteousness which a person, who does not have faith, have done. And we are indeed not saved by these works, lest any man should boast.
(It is written:
"We are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh. Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:
Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ. Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith" Philippians 3:3-9)
We are rather saved by grace through faith.
James said:
"Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God. Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only. Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way? For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also." James 2:19-26
K
Kaycie
Guest
Our works do not justify us, but God will only justify those who do the works He has prepared in advance for us to do. The obedient will inherit eternal life, but those who disobey, yet believe, will not. Demons believe. Believing, by itself, will not get you to heaven. Faith without works is dead, meaningless, pointless, in vain, unsuccessful.
You add "remaining saved". The text does not say that. As for justification, no works at all any category are expected from the recipient of same. How can a spiritually dead person work anything that pleases God? They can not. So Eph.2:10 is talking about the works that follows justification, the fruit of justification, the works of the already justified, done in gratitude and out of love for the Savior. A christian is not void of such.
A
Arvir
Guest
The answer is in the same post.
"We are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh. Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:
Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews;
as touching the law, a Pharisee;
Concerning zeal, persecuting the church;
touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ. Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith" Philippians 3:3-9
A
Arvir
Guest
There is righteousness, which is of the law, and there is righteousness, which is through the faith of Christ.
That's twisted theology.
Christians are NEW creatures in Christ. They now seek to please God. What works they do have become works generated by their new hearts. It's a new normal, the natural byproduct of salvation and the renewed mind.
Eph 2:10 is talking about works one does after he has been justified. Yet he cannot remain justified if he does not do those good works God has "before ordained" of EPh 2:10. Therefore Eph 2:9 cannot eliminate ALL works of all categories for "not of works" of verse 9 cannot eliminate the good works those that have been justified are required to do.