TMS wrote:
the last six chaps were written after the temple was complete to anticipate the coming messiah. Zechariah talks of the times of persecution to the time of the coming messiah (Jesus first coming) Zech 9:9. Zech 14:11 Israel have already inhabited Jerusalem safely.
To Daniel the world empires in relation to Israel were unveiled. Including prophecy before Christ, of Christ Himself--His crucifixion, and to Christ's 2nd Coming. Since that is part of what is "apportioned" to Israel. As confirmed by the rest of the entire Bible. Daniel himself was captured by the first empire, Babylon, and both overcame it, and tried to help Nebuchadnezzar, and became a high ranking part of it for the sake of God's purpose and people. Daniel continued on in the 2nd, succeeding, empire: Persia. At the same time, the very fact of human government apart from Christ constitutes part of Satan's rebellion to God. And so these empires in God's eyes are beasts. So maybe we can say Daniel was in it, but not of it.
Zechariah is soon after Daniel. Under a later Persian king. Yes Zechariah consoles Israel. And also discusses the 4 all-encompassing world empires that Daniel did. That discussion is throughout the entire book of Zechariah. Not limited to the last 8 chapters. Just as the discussion in Daniel and Zechariah are also not limited to time up to Christ's first Coming. In particular, in Daniel 9:24-27's 490 years, the church age, an age of mystery especially to Israel, is skipped over. The first 483 years run from Nehemiah 2:5-8, "the decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem" by that Artaxerxes, until "Messiah will be cut off." The start of the church age. When God gets His inward people, His mysterious born-again race (John 3:8-9; 1 Pet 1:3). The 490 years then resume with the last 7 years of this age........whenever that will be. In Revelation the age is prophesied to largely shift again. Back to God's outward supernatural works, as He both gains Israel---for the sake of the kingdom of the Son of Man on earth for 1000 years---and He ripens as much of His church "as He can"---and He judges the nations, "saving" some----and judges and destroys Satan and His rebellion. This is how awe-inspiring and wonderful and far-reaching Daniel and Zechariah, and indeed the entire Old Testament, is. Zechariah 11--14 in particular give detail about Christ's (Jehovah's) 2nd Coming, even His touching down on the Mount of Olives from which Jesus ascended; and His rescue and redemption and inward regeneration of Israel along with His destruction of Antichrist.
The word Rapture is not in my Bible anywhere??
It's synonym is. It depends on which word a translation selects. For instance the Latin Vulgate has it over and over.
"Raptio" in Revelation 12:5. Synonyms are elementary school. They shouldn't be a hard concept to grasp. For example, in my conversation you may never hear me use the word "soda." But I may say "pop" all the time. As in: Gimme some pop. It's really not a complex matter. If someone has a personal grudge, or odd vendetta against the word 'rapture,' or those particular letters in that order, then use the words "caught up." Or "ascend." Just because you (or I) might say "ascend" or "rapture" should not mean, to the fair or impartial listener, that we are subscribing to someone else's term-of-art theory or wholesale interpretation of something in the Bible. For example, I see plainly that there are at least 2 raptures in time, in the end-time.
They are even delineated in Revelation 14 separately. Just as in farming. Just as with my tomato plants I planted last month.
There will be the first ripened ones (Rev 14:1-5) and there will be the general harvest in September. Maybe wheat is a better example (Rev 14:14-16). The wheat doesn't disappear so much as it is..........taken. By the farmer. And maybe ends up in his stomach. Which is why I argue (nicely I hope) with both "Pre-Trib" and "End-Trib" Because I see both are true. (I prefer my term End-Trib because saints are taken up (naturally) so as to be able to return WITH Christ when He terminates Antichrist.)
I have looked high and low for evidence that people will just disappear but i can't find it??
Enoch walked with God, and he was not, for God took him, Gen 5:24.
By faith Enoch was translated so that he should not see death; and he was not found, because God had translated him. For before his translation he obtained the testimony that he had been well pleasing to God, Heb 11:5.
There you go. There's a synonym for "rapture." Use "translation" instead.
"You have asked a hard thing. If you see me when I am taken up from you, so it will be to you...And as they went on and talked, suddenly a chariot of fire and horses of fire appeared; and they separated the two of them. And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven. And Elisha saw it...And he did not see him anymore" 2 Kings 10-12.
There is another synonym for you if you prefer it: "went up."
"While they were looking on, He was lifted up, and a cloud took Him away from their sight" Acts 1:9.
There is a synonym for disappearing: "took Him away from their sight."
"And after the three and a half days, the breath of life out of God entered into them, and they stood on their feet; and great fear fell upon those beholding them. And they heard a loud voice out of heaven saying to them, Come up here. And they went up into heaven in the cloud..." Rev 11:11-12.
"One is taken, one is left [behind]..." Mt 24:40-42.
"Look at the fig tree [Israel] and all the trees...So also you, when you see these things happening...Be watchful at every time, beseeching that you would prevail to escape all these things which are about to happen and stand before the Son of Man," Lk 21:28-36.
"Because you [Philadelphia] have kept the word of My endurance, I also will keep you out of the hour of trial, which is about to come on the whole inhabited earth, to try those who dwell on the earth. I come quickly..." Rv 3:10-11.
"We who are living, who are LEFT REMAINING unto the coming of the Lord...We who are living, who are LEFT REMAINING, will be caught up [translated]...in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air..." 1 Thes 4:15-17.
I know Jesus will come but no one know the exact time not even the angels. Mat 24:36
Amen.
When He come His reward is with Him so judgement has already finished. No second chance after He comes. Rev 22:12.
Amen.
Additionally: the word "coming" and "parousia" can be used broadly, or narrowly. Just like the word "save." You can be saved from eternal lake of fire, saved from the storm on a sea, saved from the world, saved from punishment. The meaning or thought of words depends firstly on their context. The Lord does not have "two returns," like some here repeatedly, ridiculously charge (then attack, as if somebody other than themselves said it). Rather, broadly, His entire ONE (and only) 2nd Coming, when spoken of broadly, includes all the aspects and duration of it. From His throne with His Father in the 3rd heavens.........receiving His firstfruits and manchild there (Rev 12:5; 14:1-5)......to the war in heaven next.........to what other time He spends with them there.......to the clouds and the air where He harvests the majority of His saints....when and where His judgment seat of His family also transpires......to His the final leg of the trip from clouds and air to the earth and the Mount of Olives, rescuing Israel and destroying Antichrist. Whether we speak of His coming in a broad sense, or narrow sense, depends on the context of the particular passage of Scripture
