Pride goes before destruction

[kennethcadwell]

Kenneth states that he caught you on something.

You say we can stumble and sin on occasion? That you do.
Yet, you expect others to be perfect, if not, we have tickets to hell? What do you believe?


Shall l go on?

Yes he stated that a person who defiles the temple(body) will not be saved, so I returned to him an example of defiling the temple from the bible and asked are they also not saved. He then said on this group that no they are saved, so I caught him in a contradiction because you can not have one defilement saved and not the other.

The more I talk to him it seems that he wants to make disabled people condemned as well because he says there is no excuse for sin. Well if there is no excuse then a person who has a mental disorder/disability and can not discern right from wrong is condemned as well by his standards. There seems to be no or very little love, mercy, and forgiveness in what he teaches, which is contradictory to the ways of God....

 

[Jason0047]

Did paul win the prison guards over to Christ by telling them how bad they were? Or by praying and giving praise to God throughout the night?

There are different ways folks lead people to Christ. Jesus talked about how it is better to pluck out our eye than to have two of them cast into hell fire. Jesus said "Repent, or you will all likewise perish."

 

[psychomom]

Well, God's burden is easy and it is light. God knows that fellowship is not always possible every day or even every week. A believer can be stranded in a jungle for along time with no other Christians around. Is he condemned because he cannot have fellowship?

i'll bow out now because it must be hard to have so many people addressing you at once.
and take your time, or never respond, either's good. maybe think about it, at least.

are you stranded in a jungle with no other Christians around?
do you see yourself making excuses for yourself regarding what the Bible says we are to do
while your standard for others seems a great deal higher?

 

[Sirk]

There are different ways folks lead people to Christ. Jesus talked about how it is better to pluck out our eye than to have two of them cast into hell fire. Jesus said "Repent, or you will all likewise perish."

I thought we were talking about Paul. Go ahead...keep moving the goal posts. It's what you do best.

 

[Jason0047]

Yes he stated that a person who defiles the temple(body) will not be saved, so I returned to him an example of defiling the temple from the bible and asked are they also not saved. He then said on this group that no they are saved, so I caught him in a contradiction because you can not have one defilement saved and not the other.

I am saying the tattoo person is not condemned because they have time or space to repent of such a sin. That is not the case with a person commits suicide and stays dead. You cannot repent after you are dead. It is too late.

The more I talk to him it seems that he wants to make disabled people condemned as well because he says there is no excuse for sin. Well if there is no excuse then a person who has a mental disorder/disability and can not discern right from wrong is condemned as well by his standards. There seems to be no or very little love, mercy, and forgiveness in what he teaches, which is contradictory to the ways of God....

I believe people who have a mental disease (or who if they are mentally handicapped) and who honestly cannot tell right from wrong are exempt in being condemned. For sin is not imputed where there is no law. Meaning, if they have no knowledge of the Law, then sin cannot be imputed to them. This would apply to babies, as well.

But a person who commits suicide knows that what they are doing is wrong. Unless it was done with absolutely no knowledge that it was wrong in any way shape or form.

 

[DesiredHaven]

Also, I want to add: Did Paul have fellowship when he was trapped in prison?

Here is what appears to be a dead congregation

Rev 3:1 And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write;
These things saith he that hath the seven Spirits of God, and the seven stars;
I know thy works, that thou hast a name that thou livest, and art dead.

As it also says of the one who wanders out of the way of understanding will remain here

Prov 21:6 The man that wandereth out of the way of understanding shall remain in the congregation of the dead.

Prov 9:6 Forsake the foolish, and live; and go in the way of understanding.

As Christ is comes to give us an understanding,

Even of that dead assembly, there was a few names that would walk with Jesus Christ

Rev 3:4 Thou hast a few names even in Sardis
which have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy.

These are what you are looking for

2 Ti 2:22 Flee also youthful lusts:but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

 

[Sirk]

I am saying the tattoo person is not condemned because they have time or space to repent of such a sin. That is not the case with a person commits suicide and stays dead. You cannot repent after you are dead. It is too late.



I believe people who have a mental disease (or who if they are mentally handicapped) and who honestly cannot tell right from wrong are exempt being condemned. For sin is not imputed where there is no law. Meaning, if they have no knowledge of the Law, then sin cannot be imputed to them. This would apply to babies, as well.

Whoa....wait a minute there guy. Are you under law?

 

[kennethcadwell]

Now, you are falsely accusing? Where did I not show love, mercy, and forgiveness to people? Where did I seem hateful to a person? Please provide Post #'s. Where did I not show mercy or forgiveness towards people? Did I say I did not forgive someone here? If you believe otherwise, please provide Post #'s.

Because your doctrine that you are teaching takes and makes people condemned, when they can be forgiven and shown mercy by the Lord. You do not even realize how unloving what you have been saying is to others listening who are right now in these situations you are claiming are unforgivable.

It does not matter if you are speaking in a soft approach and not using harsh words, if you still place people that can be forgiven as unforgiven then that is still being unloving. Even the bible shows that when the man of sin comes he will fool people with soothing words at first, meaning he is not going to be just up and harsh with people.

Soothing words by how they are worded can be just as condemning as the harshes words used, which is why I said step back and realize how you are speaking to others in the wordage you use. Because maybe you don't mean to offend and condemn others by what you say, but you still do, which is why I said you take the mercy and forgiveness out of the Lord's hands and make decisions on others salvation yourself....

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

okaaay...I guess...so, regarding the following quote also from your op:



are you comparing carnal and spiritual Christians and are you calling carnal Christians wicked?

still trying to really understand here

Carnal Christians are those who are yet still in the flesh, not yet born again from above of the Spirit, like Saul before conversion who persecuted the children of the Spirit. Anyone who is still in the flesh, be they called Christians or not, will do the lusts of the flesh and even persecute the true born again of the Spirit Christians.

 

[Jason0047]

Here is what appears to be a dead congregation

Rev 3:1 And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write;
These things saith he that hath the seven Spirits of God, and the seven stars;
I know thy works, that thou hast a name that thou livest, and art dead.

As it also says of the one who wanders out of the way of understanding will remain here

Prov 21:6 The man that wandereth out of the way of understanding shall remain in the congregation of the dead.

Prov 9:6 Forsake the foolish, and live; and go in the way of understanding.

As Christ is comes to give us an understanding,

Even of that dead assembly, there was a few names that would walk with Jesus Christ

Rev 3:4 Thou hast a few names even in Sardis
which have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy.

These are what you are looking for

2 Ti 2:22 Flee also youthful lusts:but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

Thank you Desired Haven. I pray so much for more believers to come into my life so as to have fellowship. I have been praying for a while now for more and more faithful believers to build me up in the goodness of Christ like you do. Thank you dear sister for your loving way.

May God bless your heart.

 

[Sirk]

Carnal Christians are those who are yet still in the flesh, not yet born again from above of the Spirit, like Saul before conversion who persecuted the children of the Spirit. Anyone who is still in the flesh, be they called Christians or not, will do the lusts of the flesh and even persecute the true born again of the Spirit Christians.

I guess one can deduce that you are one of the "true born again of the spirit Christians"?

 

[Jason0047]

Whoa....wait a minute there guy. Are you under law?

There is a Law of Christ and a Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus (Galatians 6:2) (Romans 8:2). This is different than the Law of Moses. Jesus said he came to fulfill and not to destroy. The Law of Moses is fulfilled by the Law of love (See Romans 13). For James calls this the royal law. The law of faith. For even Paul says that what he writes to us should be considered as the Lord's Commandments.

 

[Jason0047]

Oh, and InSpiritintruth, you have been a blessing to me, too. Thank you for your wonderful posts in digging deep in Scripture.

Peace, love, and many great blessings be unto you.

 

[Sirk]

There is a Law of Christ and a Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus (Galatians 6:2) (Romans 8:2). This is different than the Law of Moses. Jesus said he came to fulfill and not to destroy. The Law of Moses is fulfilled by the Law of love (See Romans 13). For James calls this the royal law. The law of faith. For even Paul says that what he writes to us should be considered as the Lord's Commandments.

You mean..love the lord God with all your heart mind and soul and your neighbor as yourself? Is your heart mind and soul the same as your neighbors? Do you set the bar as to how a person should love the lord thy God with all their heart mind and soul? Are you the standard Jason? You sure seem to talk like you are.

 

[Jason0047]

I thought we were talking about Paul. Go ahead...keep moving the goal posts. It's what you do best.

Scripture has to be taken as a whole. One truth in Scripture does not overshadow and blot out another truth in Scripture.

 

[Sirk]

Scripture has to be taken as a whole. One truth in Scripture does not overshadow and blot out another truth in Scripture.

You asked a question about Paul, I answered you with truth and you moved the subject to Jesus. Do you have ADD?

 

[kennethcadwell]

I am saying the tattoo person is not condemned because they have time or space to repent of such a sin. That is not the case with a person commits suicide and stays dead. You cannot repent after you are dead. It is too late.



I believe people who have a mental disease (or who if they are mentally handicapped) and who honestly cannot tell right from wrong are exempt in being condemned. For sin is not imputed where there is no law. Meaning, if they have no knowledge of the Law, then sin cannot be imputed to them. This would apply to babies, as well.

But a person who commits suicide knows that what they are doing is wrong. Unless it was done with absolutely no knowledge that it was wrong in any way shape or form.

You were starting to get there but then you fell right back to the same old same old;

Do you really think a person who commits suicide is really in their right mind ???

Depression is a mental disorder/disease and it is obviously you have not done any background studying on this, nor have you had anybody close to you suffer with this disorder. Depression takes and confuses the thought process of a person to where they can not think properly at times. I not only have looked into this, but have had people around me that suffer from it.

When you see a person just break down and cry right in front of you when there was absolutely nothing going on at that time to invoke that reaction then come back to me and we can talk. Depression is the leading mental disorder that leads to suicide my friend and I have seen personally how it effects a person, so don't sit there and tell me they will not be forgiven if they end up going that far. Nor keep saying others that have are not !!!

 

[Jason0047]

You mean..love the lord God with all your heart mind and soul and your neighbor as yourself? Is your heart mind and soul the same as your neighbors? Do you set the bar as to how a person should love the lord thy God with all their heart mind and soul? Are you the standard Jason? You sure seem to talk like you are.

Love your neighbor as you would love yourself and not as how your neighbor loves you. Loving your neighbor would include loving their soul and caring for them enought to tell them about Jesus. I pray for opportunities to do this thru out my day and God is so good to me on this. I also strive to love the Lord with all my heart, mind, and soul. I strive to do this by following His Word. For Jesus said, if you love me, keep my Commandments.

 

[Jason0047]

You were starting to get there but then you fell right back to the same old same old;

Do you really think a person who commits suicide is really in their right mind ???

Depression is a mental disorder/disease and it is obviously you have not done any background studying on this, nor have you had anybody close to you suffer with this disorder. Depression takes and confuses the thought process of a person to where they can not think properly at times. I not only have looked into this, but have had people around me that suffer from it.

When you see a person just break down and cry right in front of you when there was absolutely nothing going on at that time to invoke that reaction then come back to me and we can talk. Depression is the leading mental disorder that leads to suicide my friend and I have seen personally how it effects a person, so don't sit there and tell me they will not be forgiven if they end up going that far. Nor keep saying others that have are not !!!

I know this might be a personal issue for you. But if they are aware of what is right and wrong, the Word of God is not going to cut them any slack if they do decide to kill or murder themselves. If they are not aware of right and wrong, then they cannot be condemned for something they do not know is wrong. God is fair, just, and good in His Judgments.

 

[Sirk]

Love your neighbor as you would love yourself and not as how your neighbor loves you. Loving your neighbor would include loving their soul and caring for them enought to tell them about Jesus. I pray for opportunities to do this thru out my day and God is so good to me on this. I also strive to love the Lord with all my heart, mind, and soul. I strive to do this by following His Word. For Jesus said, if you love me, keep my Commandments.

So if a guy is laying on the side of the road dehydrated, you would tell him about Jesus instead of getting him a drink?