genesis 1:14 - signs

[jaybird88]

And God said, "Let there be luminaries in the expanse of the heavens, to separate between the day and between the night, and they shall be for signs and for appointed seasons and for days and years.

how is this different from astrology? i was always told astrology was "the devils work" but never really looked into what the bible actually says about it. so are the signs here referring to the stars, sun, moon or all of the above?

 

[crossnote]

And God said, "Let there be luminaries in the expanse of the heavens, to separate between the day and between the night, and they shall be for signs and for appointed seasons and for days and years.

how is this different from astrology? i was always told astrology was "the devils work" but never really looked into what the bible actually says about it. so are the signs here referring to the stars, sun, moon or all of the above?

God never said they were to be used for divination, just what astrology does..

 

[Gr8grace]

And God said, "Let there be luminaries in the expanse of the heavens, to separate between the day and between the night, and they shall be for signs and for appointed seasons and for days and years.

how is this different from astrology? i was always told astrology was "the devils work" but never really looked into what the bible actually says about it. so are the signs here referring to the stars, sun, moon or all of the above?

I may be with you on this one Jay. I believe that the stars have the gospel in them and satan has counterfeited it in todays "astrology."

 

[purgedconscience]

Isaiah chapter 47 verses 12 thru 15

Stand now with thine enchantments, and with the multitude of thy sorceries, wherein thou hast laboured from thy youth; if so be thou shalt be able to profit, if so be thou mayest prevail.
Thou art wearied in the multitude of thy counsels. Let now the astrologers, the stargazers, the monthly prognosticators, stand up, and save thee from these things that shall come upon thee.
Behold, they shall be as stubble; the fire shall burn them; they shall not deliver themselves from the power of the flame: there shall not be a coal to warm at, nor fire to sit before it.
Thus shall they be unto thee with whom thou hast laboured, even thy merchants, from thy youth: they shall wander every one to his quarter; none shall save thee.

God doesn't look favorably upon astrologers and monthly prognosticators or those who follow horoscopes.

 

[crossnote]

God never said they were to be used for divination, just what astrology does..

Here is an example of the proper use of signs... found in Genesis 1:14

The sun shall be turned to darkness, and the moon to blood, before the great and awesome day of the LORD comes.
(Joe 2:31)

 

[JimmieD]

And God said, "Let there be luminaries in the expanse of the heavens, to separate between the day and between the night, and they shall be for signs and for appointed seasons and for days and years.

how is this different from astrology? i was always told astrology was "the devils work" but never really looked into what the bible actually says about it. so are the signs here referring to the stars, sun, moon or all of the above?

I've always taken it to mean they were to be used for keeping time (ie, days, years, seasons, etc..), just like we use them today. Ancient people also used the sun, moon, and stars to track time. It's not much more elaborate than this.

 

[jaybird88]

God never said they were to be used for divination, just what astrology does..

the wise men used the stars to locate Jesus.would that not be astrology? the bible makes no mention of them (the magi) using evil means to find Him. but we know for sure the Canaanites and Babylonians used stars and signs and it was a big part of their belief system and the Canaanites / Babylonian belief systems were very evil. so what gives?

 

[flob]

Well the magi I thought were from Persia, which was the empire following Babylon, which had Daniel as an early advisor and respected person, and much influence from the Jews. Wasn't Esther there also? And Ezra and Nehemiah...
Daniel in particular contained a lot of prophecy, even the most specific time-prophecy in the Bible, and much else about the 4 world-empires: Babylon, Persia, Greece, and Rome.
My point is they had the heritage at least, as well as maybe direct writings, such as Daniel, which made them know of the Messiah's time and come to notice a new star in the heavens, or whatever sign it was, which told them the King had been born to the Jews

 

[crossnote]

the wise men used the stars to locate Jesus.would that not be astrology? the bible makes no mention of them (the magi) using evil means to find Him. but we know for sure the Canaanites and Babylonians used stars and signs and it was a big part of their belief system and the Canaanites / Babylonian belief systems were very evil. so what gives?

Sigh, the Astrologers were Chaldeans from Babylonia and probably had read or heard some of Daniels writings who was in captivity there for 70 years. They most likely did the calculation in Daniel 7 or 9 (not my expertise) and seen when the Messiah was due. Maybe they were off a year or so but God in his grace provided them a star to show the way to the young Jesus.

 

[crossnote]

Great, Flob beat me to it Grrrr

 

[Gr8grace]

Well the magi I thought were from Persia, which was the empire following Babylon, which had Daniel as an early advisor and respected person, and much influence from the Jews. Wasn't Esther there also? And Ezra and Nehemiah...
Daniel in particular contained a lot of prophecy, even the most specific time-prophecy in the Bible, and much else about the 4 world-empires: Babylon, Persia, Greece, and Rome.
My point is they had the heritage at least, as well as maybe direct writings, such as Daniel, which made them know of the Messiah's time and come to notice a new star in the heavens, or whatever sign it was, which told them the King had been born to the Jews

I believe you are correct Here Flob. Most people think that the magi were believers. Not so. They may have been afterwards, but not before. They were just aware of the things going on.

 

[jaybird88]

Well the magi I thought were from Persia, which was the empire following Babylon, which had Daniel as an early advisor and respected person, and much influence from the Jews. Wasn't Esther there also? And Ezra and Nehemiah...
Daniel in particular contained a lot of prophecy, even the most specific time-prophecy in the Bible, and much else about the 4 world-empires: Babylon, Persia, Greece, and Rome.
My point is they had the heritage at least, as well as maybe direct writings, such as Daniel, which made them know of the Messiah's time and come to notice a new star in the heavens, or whatever sign it was, which told them the King had been born to the Jews

Sigh, the Astrologers were Chaldeans from Babylonia and probably had read or heard some of Daniels writings who was in captivity there for 70 years. They most likely did the calculation in Daniel 7 or 9 (not my expertise) and seen when the Messiah was due. Maybe they were off a year or so but God in his grace provided them a star to show the way to the young Jesus.

so it was a sign and it was a good sign. so some signs in the heavens are ok. so what would be an example of a bad sign? or the way the Babylonians did it? im thinking maybe if one lookd for a sign in the stars for answers in their life that they think they could not get from the Lord? or maybe looking for divine knowledge that they would not ask the Lord for?
I have never completely understood what divination was.

 

[flob]

I've read that 'gospel in the constellations' thing. It could be.


Hmm, what is divination? Trying to find out answers of the future through miraculous or mystical means........other than God, Himself, as a person, personally.
I think

 

[crossnote]

so it was a sign and it was a good sign. so some signs in the heavens are ok. so what would be an example of a bad sign? or the way the Babylonians did it? im thinking maybe if one lookd for a sign in the stars for answers in their life that they think they could not get from the Lord? or maybe looking for divine knowledge that they would not ask the Lord for?
I have never completely understood what divination was.

It was a sign based on God's Word and the star was appointed by God to direct the Maji to Christ.
An inappropriate use is when one tries peeking into future matters using stars, tea leaves, palms, ouija boards, etc., that God has not ordained.

 

[Gr8grace]

Sigh, the Astrologers were Chaldeans from Babylonia and probably had read or heard some of Daniels writings who was in captivity there for 70 years. They most likely did the calculation in Daniel 7 or 9 (not my expertise) and seen when the Messiah was due. Maybe they were off a year or so but God in his grace provided them a star to show the way to the young Jesus.

Crossnote, I love ya to death. But why the sigh? I find this kind of stuff fascinating and have only begun the journey into the "deeper depths" of some of this stuff. I hate feeling like a burden to glean some of your wisdom.

 

[crossnote]

Crossnote, I love ya to death. But why the sigh? I find this kind of stuff fascinating and have only begun the journey into the "deeper depths" of some of this stuff. I hate feeling like a burden to glean some of your wisdom.

It was an anticipatory 'sigh' having experienced going round and around with Jaybird before, I was just bracing myself. Sorry if it offended.

 

[Gr8grace]

I've read that 'gospel in the constellations' thing. It could be.


Hmm, what is divination? Trying to find out answers of the future through miraculous or mystical means........other than God, Himself, as a person, personally.
I think

That is where I am at. Your only 15? I got some catching up to do!

 

[Gr8grace]

It was an anticipatory 'sigh' having experienced going round and around with Jaybird before, I was just bracing myself. Sorry if it offended.

Ok. Didn't realize that part. I take you very seriously on what you post and you have taught me things just in this thread alone Sir.

 

[crossnote]

Ok. Didn't realize that part. I take you very seriously on what you post and you have taught me things just in this thread alone Sir.

Well ya, I have a deeply humorous side to me that too easily steps on toes.

 

[crossnote]

That is where I am at. Your only 15? I got some catching up to do!

At 15 I never even heard the word or meaning of 'sin'.