Rapture= false teaching

[joint-heir]

everything that I've learned has never been from simple feeling, joint-heir... it comes from meditation in the Word, prayer, and testing itself with scripture to see if it is harmonious with the rest of the Word of God.

that is rightly dividing the word of truth

HERE is what the bottom line of all this really equates to
ALL of US
can say and make ourselves seem deemed and viable to all others
what is the most fascinating perception of all
no other person here knows
EXCEPT
by the PRESENCE and WITNESS of the HOLY SPIRIT
REVEALS

When you dwell continually in the REALM of GOD
the WITNESS
is APPARENT
whether you are side by side, miles away, on pc, in ANY capacity
THAT WITNESS
EMULATES
PENETRATING
EVERY FACET, ORACLE, SURFACE
AND PERMIATES
THE TRUE PRESENCE OF GOD

Im telling you my brother in CHRIST
people by hundreds that cross our path every day
whether they bare a smile or frown
whether they are saved or lost
whether they know you in church or just are aware you attend
THEY ALL
IMMEDIATELY
CAN ATTEST
AT THAT MOMENT OF INTER-ACTION
THEY ARE WITNESSING YOU
OR
A GREATER POWER

YOU ARE AN INCREDIBLE WITNESS TO OTHERS MY BROTHER
YOU CAN BE THE BIGGEST DIFFERENCE MAKER FOR YOUR OWN GENERATION
BUT
HUMBLENESS
AND
SERVITTUDE
IS THE POWER
BY WHICH WE CONQUER ALL THINGS

 

[miktre]

There is NO compromising in GOD my friend.
and the only reason you see me as your enemy is because
your getting your toes stepped on
Let me give you a clue what GOD is trully about
when a name or image of someone whether I know them or not comes into focus in my mind
I immediately say to GOD
I have no idea what they going thru, but YOU do GOD
but I stand firm and intercede on their behalf no matter what their situation is
May YOU LORD receive all the glory
This is also like my subject matter what I preach
I never know what it is GOD wants me to preach about until
about
FRIDAY evening
YES
I pray daily all thru the day even now as I type this
and I am constantly reading the BIBLE
but
When I step onto that podium and I began preaching
I go by faith
meaning
I have a subject matter by which GOD gave me
but
What is delivered is by the power of GOD the HOLY GHOST
and the message being preached
IS NEVER
rehearsed or practiced for by walking in faith
is to solely rely upon GOD only
SO
when I oppose your theories on your views of RAPTURE
my only position and concern
is that GODs WORD is properly interpreted
not saturated by foolish self centered opinions

I never saw you as a threat, satan is the only threat here and its not about stepping on my toes, like I told all of you before it's about staying in the Truth and staying within the simplicity in which Christ taught. I think your posts have been used as a great opportunity to dispel myths from truth and further document there will be no rapture, that its a lie to lead people to the fake-christ, satan himself with his fallen angels, and satan himself is the spirit behind this great lie. The false doctrine of rapture is a threat to all of Christianity for those days come my friend and many shall follow the fake. I shall never stop preaching about the false christ to come and shall always make a stand against the anti-christ and the false rapture doctrine, till the day that I die or am changed in the twinkling of an eye at the seventh trump, the last trump.

 

[joint-heir]

I never saw you as a threat, satan is the only threat here and its not about stepping on my toes, like I told all of you before it's about staying in the Truth and staying within the simplicity in which Christ taught. I think your posts have been used as a great opportunity to dispel myths from truth and further document there will be no rapture, that its a lie to lead people to the fake-christ, satan himself with his fallen angels, and satan himself is the spirit behind this great lie. The false doctrine of rapture is a threat to all of Christianity for those days come my friend and many shall follow the fake. I shall never stop preaching about the false christ to come and shall always make a stand against the anti-christ and the false rapture doctrine, till the day that I die or am changed in the twinkling of an eye at the seventh trump, the last trump.

SINCE you do not believe we will be raptured or as the verse of scripture refers to as.......
"THE CATCHING AWAY"
Do you then believe since there is no reason for us TO GO as in
RAPTURE which is the idea that we will GO from this earth to be with our GOD and MAKER with HIM in heaven.
SINCE
YOUR SAYING there is NO RAPTURE
you are claiming that we will remain on earth
EVEN
thru TRIBLUATION
and then AFTER MILLENEUM
REVELATIONS 4:1 TO YOU
would mean that heaven is the NEW JERUSALEM
that comes down from heaven and set upon earth
SO
SINCE TO YOU THERE IS NO RAPTURE
YOUR SAYING WE NEVER LEAVE EARTH AT ALL
BECAUSE
HEAVEN COMES TO US

I have never ever heard such a thing in my life
SO
Im a bit confused
and almost offended
so I am asking
without an essay just list your scriptures ill search for myself
BUT
is this what your trying to preach here?

 

[greatkraw]

yeah Miktre

right from naming this thread you have set out to tear down

now; tell us where YOU stand and we will see if your position, the one towards which you have been persuaded, stands up to examination

 

[miktre]

SINCE you do not believe we will be raptured or as the verse of scripture refers to as.......
"THE CATCHING AWAY"
Do you then believe since there is no reason for us TO GO as in
RAPTURE which is the idea that we will GO from this earth to be with our GOD and MAKER with HIM in heaven.
SINCE
YOUR SAYING there is NO RAPTURE
you are claiming that we will remain on earth
EVEN
thru TRIBLUATION
and then AFTER MILLENEUM
REVELATIONS 4:1 TO YOU
would mean that heaven is the NEW JERUSALEM
that comes down from heaven and set upon earth
SO
SINCE TO YOU THERE IS NO RAPTURE
YOUR SAYING WE NEVER LEAVE EARTH AT ALL
BECAUSE
HEAVEN COMES TO US

I have never ever heard such a thing in my life
SO
Im a bit confused
and almost offended
so I am asking
without an essay just list your scriptures ill search for myself
BUT
is this what your trying to preach here?

Well yes, thats what God's word says. This is not the same as if you died today and ascended up to heaven. This is the New Earth and New Heaven. Eden restored, if you will.You can read of satan walking in the garden of eden before he fell. So was Eden on earth or was it in heaven? Have you never read about God's covenant with Mt Zion that shall be forever? OK, HERE IS THE VERSES AND YOU SHOW ME VERSES AS TO WHY ONE WOULD BELIEVE OTHERWISE:

Revelation 21

1And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
Should read former heaven and former earth were passed away for this is the third heaven age. 1st being before satan rebelled, second heaven age= the one we ascend to to if we died today. this will be the third.

2And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

3And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.


10And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,

22And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.
23And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.
24And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
25And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
26And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
27And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

 

[miktre]

yeah Miktre

right from naming this thread you have set out to tear down

now; tell us where YOU stand and we will see if your position, the one towards which you have been persuaded, stands up to examination

When Christ said be fishers of men, I don't think he meant trolling on a Christian website.
Ha

 

[greatkraw]

When Christ said be fishers of men, I don't think he meant trolling on a Christian website.
Ha

THEN YOU BETTER STOP DOING IT dUDE?

Q1 Has the Church permanently replaced Israel?

 

[miktre]

THEN YOU BETTER STOP DOING IT dUDE?

Q1 Has the Church permanently replaced Israel?

Go play somewhere else I'm in the middle of a serious conversation.

 

[Zilla64007]

THEN YOU BETTER STOP DOING IT dUDE?

Q1 Has the Church permanently replaced Israel?

not replaced it... but THROUGH CHRIST, both have been UNITED and MADE ONE.

Ephesians 2:11-22
Eph 2:11 Therefore remember that at one time you Gentiles in the flesh, called "the uncircumcision" by what is called the circumcision, which is made in the flesh by hands--
Eph 2:12 remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.
Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
Eph 2:14 For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility
Eph 2:15 by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two, so making peace,
Eph 2:16 and might reconcile us both to God in one body through the cross, thereby killing the hostility.
Eph 2:17 And he came and preached peace to you who were far off and peace to those who were near.
Eph 2:18 For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.
Eph 2:19 So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God,
Eph 2:20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus himself being the cornerstone,
Eph 2:21 in whom the whole structure, being joined together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord.
Eph 2:22 In him you also are being built together into a dwelling place for God by the Spirit.

for God does NOT see Israel as a physical nation, BUT A SPIRITUAL NATION.
Romans 2:26-29
Rom 2:26 So, if a man who is uncircumcised keeps the precepts of the law, will not his uncircumcision be regarded as circumcision?
Rom 2:27 Then he who is physically uncircumcised but keeps the law will condemn you who have the written code and circumcision but break the law.
Rom 2:28 For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical.
Rom 2:29 But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God.

and the Israel of God is NOT found in a nation on earth, BUT IN THE HEART.
Galatians 6:15-16
Gal 6:15 For neither circumcision counts for anything, nor uncircumcision, but a new creation.
Gal 6:16 And as for all who walk by this rule, peace and mercy be upon them, and upon the Israel of God.

for there is NO separation of Jew or Gentile... WE ARE ALL UNITED THROUGH CHRIST.
Galatians 3:26-29
Gal 3:26 for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith.
Gal 3:27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise.

Colossians 3:11
Col 3:11 Here there is not Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave, free; but Christ is all, and in all.


Dispensationalism is nothing but a LIE.

God does not work in man's interpretation of "dispensations".
God has ALWAYS worked in Covenants.

 

[greatkraw]

Well, Zilla, at least YOU HAVE THE GUTS to take a stand.

 

[Zilla64007]

Dispensationalism makes me sick, because with the birth of Dispensationalism came not only Zionism, but also pre-tribulationism

 

[joint-heir]

Well yes, thats what God's word says. This is not the same as if you died today and ascended up to heaven. This is the New Earth and New Heaven. Eden restored, if you will.You can read of satan walking in the garden of eden before he fell. So was Eden on earth or was it in heaven? Have you never read about God's covenant with Mt Zion that shall be forever? OK, HERE IS THE VERSES AND YOU SHOW ME VERSES AS TO WHY ONE WOULD BELIEVE OTHERWISE:



OK

SO
WHEN
after the end of TRIBULATION takes place
and JESUS descends upon earth
for the battle of ARMAGEDDON
WHO
ARE THE SAINTS
we read about that come down with HIM
to battle in this great VICTORY?

I know GOD alone could do it
but
if we are crunching numbers here
lets say from Adam to all those dead now that were saved at their death
possibly lets say
6000 years and and 2000 years we can now add us gentiles
lets throw a guess at since Adam there was 10 billion people including todays living
and lets say only 1/8 of all mankind chose to live for GOD and were saved at death
so remove the 8 billion living now today
this would be 1/8 of 2 billion saved = 250 million
NOW
when JESUS descends with his BRIDE for ARMAGEDDON
is this the people you believe this scripture is refering to?

see
i believe
8 billion people today with tv and radio more and more are saved
and if possibly 1/3 of 8 billion possibly could be saved as we speak right now
I view the BRIDE that are living would be these 1/3 right now
and when the rapture takes place
it is the dead from Adam up to now PLUS the 1/3 living now
that would represent the BRIDE coming down with JESUS at ARMAGEDDON
even at that you would have 2.5 billion representing the BRIDE
for JOHN wrote he could not number them

so explain to me
who is representing with JESUS
at ARMAGEDDON?

 

[greatkraw]

Paul said that God is not finished with Israel.

Once the church is complete(and raptured) He will once again turn His attentionto His people, Israel. After all, He made an unconditional covenant with Abraham and He made a promise to David.

Of course God deals with people in different ways at different times in history. Have you ever actually READ the Bible?

Are you anti semitic? See Genesis 12:3


Daniel 11 (King James Version)

28 Then shall he (ANTICHRIST) return into his land with great riches; and his heart shall be against the holy covenant; and he shall do exploits, and return to his own land.

29 At the time appointed he shall return, and come toward the south; but it shall not be as the former, or as the latter.

30 For the ships of Chittim shall come against him: therefore he shall be grieved, and return, and have indignation against the holy covenant: so shall he do; he shall even return, and have intelligence with them that forsake the holy covenant.

31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.

32 And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits.

33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.

34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries.

35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.

36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.

37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.

38 But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.

39 Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.

40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.

41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.

42 He shall stretch forth his hand also upon the countries: and the land of Egypt shall not escape.

43 But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and of silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt: and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps.

44 But tidings out of the east and out of the north shall trouble him: therefore he shall go forth with great fury to destroy, and utterly to make away many.

45 And he shall plant the tabernacles of his palace between the seas in the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and none shall help him.

Daniel 12 (King James Version)
1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, (TRIBULATION) such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time (GREATEST): and at that time thy people (ISRAEL) shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life (THE FIRST RESURRECTION), and some to shame and everlasting contempt. (THE SECOND RESURRECTION)

3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever (BELIEVERS).

4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book(IT IS NOT TIME TO UNDERSTAND THESE THINGS UNTIL…..), even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro(WORLDWIDE COMMUNICATION), and knowledge shall be increased(EXPONENTIAL INCREASE IN KNOWLEGE).

5 Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river.

6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders?

7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half (SECOND (THE GREAT) HALF OF THE TRIBULATION); and when he (ANTICHRIST) shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people (ISRAEL), all these things shall be finished.

8 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things?

9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.

10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand (Snail).

11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. (SECOND (GREAT) HALF OF TRIBULATION)

12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days

 

[Zilla64007]

Christ was hidden within the Old Testament, just as the church was hidden within the Old Testament.
it has already been Biblically proven that the church has fulfilled prophecies that were meant for Israel alone, which, in the words of Charles C Ryie (a fellow dispensational teacher), entirely condemns dispensationalism

 

[Wug]

I'm pretty sure that if you guys keep it up, one of you will agree with the other. Keep at it. lol, jk, it's interesting, f'real keep it up, but be sure to keep as civil as it's been.

 

[greatkraw]

Christ was hidden within the Old Testament, just as the church was hidden within the Old Testament.
it has already been Biblically proven that the church has fulfilled prophecies that were meant for Israel alone, which, in the words of Charles C Ryie (a fellow dispensational teacher), entirely condemns dispensationalism

Spell it out then, say....

"The Church has replaced Israel and God has no more use for them(Israel)"

 

[miktre]

Well yes, thats what God's word says. This is not the same as if you died today and ascended up to heaven. This is the New Earth and New Heaven. Eden restored, if you will.You can read of satan walking in the garden of eden before he fell. So was Eden on earth or was it in heaven? Have you never read about God's covenant with Mt Zion that shall be forever? OK, HERE IS THE VERSES AND YOU SHOW ME VERSES AS TO WHY ONE WOULD BELIEVE OTHERWISE:



OK

SO
WHEN
after the end of TRIBULATION takes place
and JESUS descends upon earth
for the battle of ARMAGEDDON
WHO
ARE THE SAINTS
we read about that come down with HIM
to battle in this great VICTORY?

I know GOD alone could do it
but
if we are crunching numbers here
lets say from Adam to all those dead now that were saved at their death
possibly lets say
6000 years and and 2000 years we can now add us gentiles
lets throw a guess at since Adam there was 10 billion people including todays living
and lets say only 1/8 of all mankind chose to live for GOD and were saved at death
so remove the 8 billion living now today
this would be 1/8 of 2 billion saved = 250 million
NOW
when JESUS descends with his BRIDE for ARMAGEDDON
is this the people you believe this scripture is refering to?

see
i believe
8 billion people today with tv and radio more and more are saved
and if possibly 1/3 of 8 billion possibly could be saved as we speak right now
I view the BRIDE that are living would be these 1/3 right now
and when the rapture takes place
it is the dead from Adam up to now PLUS the 1/3 living now
that would represent the BRIDE coming down with JESUS at ARMAGEDDON
even at that you would have 2.5 billion representing the BRIDE
for JOHN wrote he could not number them

so explain to me
who is representing with JESUS
at ARMAGEDDON?

He comes with clouds of angels and we are gathered from both Earth and Heaven. Is this what you mean?
Mark 13
24But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, 25And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.
26And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.
27And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

 

[greatkraw]

you up past your bed time Miktre?

 

[miktre]

you up past your bed time Miktre?

I'm at work, it's my watch right now.

 

[Cup-of-Ruin]

not replaced it... but THROUGH CHRIST, both have been UNITED and MADE ONE.

Ephesians 2:11-22
Eph 2:11 Therefore remember that at one time you Gentiles in the flesh, called "the uncircumcision" by what is called the circumcision, which is made in the flesh by hands--
Eph 2:12 remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world.
Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
Eph 2:14 For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility
Eph 2:15 by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two, so making peace,
Eph 2:16 and might reconcile us both to God in one body through the cross, thereby killing the hostility.
Eph 2:17 And he came and preached peace to you who were far off and peace to those who were near.
Eph 2:18 For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.
Eph 2:19 So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God,
Eph 2:20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus himself being the cornerstone,
Eph 2:21 in whom the whole structure, being joined together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord.
Eph 2:22 In him you also are being built together into a dwelling place for God by the Spirit.

for God does NOT see Israel as a physical nation, BUT A SPIRITUAL NATION.
Romans 2:26-29
Rom 2:26 So, if a man who is uncircumcised keeps the precepts of the law, will not his uncircumcision be regarded as circumcision?
Rom 2:27 Then he who is physically uncircumcised but keeps the law will condemn you who have the written code and circumcision but break the law.
Rom 2:28 For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical.
Rom 2:29 But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God.

and the Israel of God is NOT found in a nation on earth, BUT IN THE HEART.
Galatians 6:15-16
Gal 6:15 For neither circumcision counts for anything, nor uncircumcision, but a new creation.
Gal 6:16 And as for all who walk by this rule, peace and mercy be upon them, and upon the Israel of God.

for there is NO separation of Jew or Gentile... WE ARE ALL UNITED THROUGH CHRIST.
Galatians 3:26-29
Gal 3:26 for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith.
Gal 3:27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise.

Colossians 3:11
Col 3:11 Here there is not Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave, free; but Christ is all, and in all.


Dispensationalism is nothing but a LIE.

God does not work in man's interpretation of "dispensations".
God has ALWAYS worked in Covenants.

Yes all of Israel and all of Judah became Christians and took the gospel of the Lord's Salvation to the ends of the earth. Many people are lost today because they have fallen for the lie that the criminal state "Israel" in present day Palestine is the home of the literal descendants of Jacob/Israel of the Bible and nothing could be further from the truth, this is essential to understanding end time prophecy and essential to understanding the Bible. Modern Jewry are descended from Ashkenaz, Jewry in the time of Jesus was descended from Edom/Esau, to pretend to be the 'chosen people' has proven to be profitable especially in the last 50 years, mainly in America where the Zionists hace complete control and to a lesser extent Britain and colonies.

Also keep in mind that Paul uses the Greek ethnos to describe apostate Israel and refers to himself as a Judean, a true Judean as opposed to a false one, you know a false Judean because they are not Christian i.e. circumcision of the flesh and not the heart.

Dispensationalism is most definitely a LIE of major proportions.