Young Earth Creation. Does it matter what you believe?

[valiant]

Exodus 20:11 KJV
For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.


This verse talks about 7 literal 24 hour days. According to this verse the earth was created in 6 literal 24 hour days. remember this is God talking and giving this commandment. Unless God is wrong the earth was created in 6 literal 24 hour days. Making the earth according to ages and dates in the Bible 6000 years old.

where does it say that the 'days' included nights? You just assume it. Genesis says that 'He called the light DAY. He called the DARKNESS night. I prefer the Bible definition to your arrogant assumptions.

The Israelites lived by DAYS. The nights were for sleeping.

God created the world in six periods of light. He didn't work at night.

I would be especially interested in where you got the 24 hours from. They did not have hours in those days. Jesus, however, said there were twelve hours in the day (although they weren't what we call hours).

 

[valiant]

I agree. We should listen to what it is trying to tell us -- not "tell it" what it says...

lol I would have thought we SHOULD tell it WHAT IT SAYS. Not what you want to make it say.

 

[Laodicea]

where does it say that the 'days' included nights? You just assume it. Genesis says that 'He called the light DAY. He called the DARKNESS night. I prefer the Bible definition to your arrogant assumptions.

The Israelites lived by DAYS. The nights were for sleeping.

God created the world in six periods of light. He didn't work at night.

I would be especially interested in where you got the 24 hours from. They did not have hours in those days. Jesus, however, said there were twelve hours in the day (although they weren't what we call hours).

So you are saying that Israel kept the Sabbath of the Lord for 12 hours only during the light? The Bible is clear the Sabbath of the Lord was from even to even. Also I think you need to calm down and not make accusations by saying arrogant assumptions. you will never convince anyone with that attitude.

 

[Tintin]

Keep back-bending, valiant. No need for a plain reading of the Bible when we've got you around.

 

[valiant]

So you are saying that Israel kept the Sabbath of the Lord for 12 hours only during the light? The Bible is clear the Sabbath of the Lord was from even to even. Also I think you need to calm down and not make accusations by saying arrogant assumptions. you will never convince anyone with that attitude.

well they certainly didn't observe the Sabbath during the night. They slept. Except for those on essential WORK.



well the way you present yourself is arrogant. You don't prove your case you dictate and expect everyone to agree. Just read how you put your position. Dogmatism in every word. That's arrogance. I require PROOF.

LOL I'm not trying to convince you. I'm speaking to those whose minds are not so closed. Those who will THINK.

 

[Laodicea]

well they certainly didn't observe the Sabbath during the night. They slept. Except for those on essential WORK.



well the way you present yourself is arrogant. You don't prove your case you dictate and expect everyone to agree. Just read how you put your position. Dogmatism in every word. That's arrogance. I require PROOF.

LOL I'm not trying to convince you. I'm speaking to those whose minds are not so closed. Those who will THINK.

I think you need to look in the mirror because it is you who is arrogant. Providing proof is not the problem, the problem is for you who has your mind set believing that.

 

[Tintin]

Valiant, the burden of proof is on you. You're the one who doesn't believe what the Bible clearly states and has been believed for most of Church history, until uniformitarianism and evolutionary theory entered the mainstream.

 

[valiant]

Keep back-bending, valiant. No need for a plain reading of the Bible when we've got you around.

what you mean is that there is no need to think about the Bible, Just interpret it in the same old way as every 21st century American fundie does.

Its ME who reads it plainly.

And God called the light Yom and the dusk and the dawn was of the first Yom.

Now the plain reading of that is that yom means a period of light. so surely yom IN THE SAME SENTENCE must mean a period of light? Isn't that the purpose of definition? And my reading of the actual words is proved correct because it is a period of light that commences at dawn and ends at dusk.

This is also confirmed by the fact that having just made a period of light it WAS the first period of light.

I am reading Scripture literally. It is you who is twisting it to say what you want it to say. But I don't suppose you can see that. You can't think outside the groove.

evening and morning is a very strange way of describing a day in your sense. we would expect 'night and day'. Find me any other example in the Bible where a evening and morning indicates a 24 hour day

 

[valiant]

I think you need to look in the mirror because it is you who is arrogant. Providing proof is not the problem, the problem is for you who has your mind set believing that.

ok show where my proof is wrong from the text. I have shown you where you are wrong. I have just stated what the Bible ACTUALLY SAYS.

 

[valiant]

Valiant, the burden of proof is on you. You're the one who doesn't believe what the Bible clearly states and has been believed for most of Church history, until uniformitarianism and evolutionary theory entered the mainstream.

see post 788 I am saying what the BIBLE ACTUALLY SAYS not what I want it to say. try unblocking your mind for a moment

and if you disagree PROVE it wrong from the text, not by dogmatic assertion.

 

[Laodicea]

ok show where my proof is wrong from the text. I have shown you where you are wrong. I have just stated what the Bible ACTUALLY SAYS.

You have given your opinion on where you think I was wrong. The 4th commandment says that God created the earth in six days and rested the 7th which was the Sabbath of the Lord. The Bible says the Sabbath of the Lord started at evening and went from evening to evening, other verses in the Bible also show that the Sabbath was kept from evening to evening. So the Sabbath was for 24 hours according to the Bible.

So that being the case then the six days of creation in the 4th commandment are also 6 24 hour days as the Sabbath of the Lord is 24 hours.

 

[valiant]

Valiant, the burden of proof is on you. You're the one who doesn't believe what the Bible clearly states and has been believed for most of Church history, until uniformitarianism and evolutionary theory entered the mainstream.

Oh by the way. Can you PROVE that your view was believed for most of church history?. Lets have the EVIDENCE. Or do you just ASSUME it as usual? Augustine of Hippo didn't hold it, and millions would have followed him. They saw Genesis 1 as signifying God's days..

 

[valiant]

You have given your opinion on where you think I was wrong. The 4th commandment says that God created the earth in six days and rested the 7th which was the Sabbath of the Lord. The Bible says the Sabbath of the Lord started at evening and went from evening to evening, other verses in the Bible also show that the Sabbath was kept from evening to evening. So the Sabbath was for 24 hours according to the Bible.

So that being the case then the six days of creation in the 4th commandment are also 6 24 hour days as the Sabbath of the Lord is 24 hours.

that is a statement without evidence. the fact that later the Sabbath is said to be from even to even elsewhere (text please) does not mean that Exodus 20 was not speaking of six periods of light. The later description is simply an added definition.

 

[Laodicea]

that is a statement without evidence. the fact that later the Sabbath is said to be from even to even elsewhere (text please) does not mean that Exodus 20 was not speaking of six periods of light. The later description is simply an added definition.

You can believe that the earth is millions of years old if you want. I prefer to believe the Bible. A day in the 4th commandment is 24 hours

Leviticus 23:32 KJV
(32) It shall be unto you a sabbath of rest, and ye shall afflict your souls: in the ninth day of the month at even, from even unto even, shall ye celebrate your sabbath.

This verse shows the Sabbath of the Lord was 24 hours not 12.

Luke 23:54 KJV
(54) And that day was the preparation, and the sabbath drew on.

Luke 23:56 KJV
(56) And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.


In the NT this shows that the Sabbath started at sunset not in the daytime only. show me in the Bible that they did not keep the Sabbath for 24 hours, sunset to sunset. Also keeping the Sabbath sunset to sunset comes from creation where the Bible says a day begins with sunset.

Now with this proof that the Sabbath was 24 hours not 12 according to the commandment also shows that the other 6 days in the commandment are also six 24 hour days. I suggest you come down of your high horse and think about this with an open mind not with your mind set on your opinion of truth.

 

[PeterJens]

A simple observation of our solar system.

Let us just say the earth is only 10,000 years old.

Taking the measurements of the neptune going round the sun, it would only be 60 revolutions.

Just from this simple observation the universe is vastly older than this.
The distance between the stars is vast. Our nearest star is 4.37 light years or 25 million million miles away (2.49 * 10 ^13).
If we could travel at 157,000 miles an hour it would take 18,074 years to get there.
(157,000 miles an hour is the speed of the fastest space craft yet built)

Now this is so vast, it dwarfs the idea of 10,000 year old creation. It is therefore difficult to put these kind of time frames into this vast universe which literally blows ones mind when considering what it is. I do not have an answer, but whatever it is it is not simple.

 

[GaryA]

when you can get your jumble sorted out I will guide you to the truth.

With that attitude, I don't think you will ever guide anyone to any truth...

I really can't waste time on this scramble.

All I see when I look at your posts is a mountain of arrogance, cowardice, and PRIDE.

I leave you to wallow in it.

 

[GaryA]

A simple observation of our solar system.

Let us just say the earth is only 10,000 years old.

Taking the measurements of the neptune going round the sun, it would only be 60 revolutions. { "So...?" }

Just from this simple observation the universe is vastly older than this.
The distance between the stars is vast. Our nearest star is 4.37 light years or 25 million million miles away (2.49 * 10 ^13).
If we could travel at 157,000 miles an hour it would take 18,074 years to get there.
(157,000 miles an hour is the speed of the fastest space craft yet built)

Now this is so vast, it dwarfs the idea of 10,000 year old creation. It is therefore difficult to put these kind of time frames into this vast universe which literally blows ones mind when considering what it is. I do not have an answer, but whatever it is it is not simple.

You have to look at it from God's perspective...


Isaiah 45:

[SUP]12[/SUP] I have made the earth, and created man upon it: I, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded.


I believe this verse indicates the possibility / probability that the stars - at one time - were a lot closer to each other. ( And, of course, to the Earth. )

Do you think we could be seeing light now that left the stars before they were "stretched out"...?

The answer is simple for God -- not so much for us -- but, this is where faith in God comes in...

 

[eternally-gratefull]

people want to say they trust God and his word.

yet they do not agree with his word. or the power of God to do anything. like create a world of age, able to be immediately habital by men, with every star created seen in the heavens the day they were created.

That proves a powerful God.

don;t try to force God into science, Just let science flow, and it will prove God in areas that can be seen and proven. Trust the Scripture in areas that can not be seen and proven (like how stars were seen the moment they were created)

 

[valiant]

You can believe that the earth is millions of years old if you want. I prefer to believe the Bible.

I make no claims as to how old the earth is. But the idea that it is only 6,000 years old is patently false. The diggings at Jericho resulted in the discovery of a town older than that. And that was post-flood. Writing was invented 5,500 years ago and it was certainly not before the flood.

Besides the idea that Shem was still alive when Abraham died (as the genealogies require) and is never mentioned is simply not feasible. Ancient Israelites did not ignore the father of the tribe in that way. And it would mean that Abraham left him among the idol worshippers. It would also mean that he was ignored by them also for when wives were sought for Isaac and Jacob the oldest patriarch mentioned is Bethuel.

A day in the 4th commandment is 24 hours

thus saith the prophet Laodicea. !!!

Leviticus 23:32 KJV
(32) It shall be unto you a sabbath of rest, and ye shall afflict your souls: in the ninth day of the month at even,

from even unto even, shall ye celebrate your sabbath.

This verse shows the Sabbath of the Lord was 24 hours not 12.

I did not deny that the Sabbath could be seen as lasting a day and a night. It would be natural if the day was observed, that the night would be also. But that is the point. It was 'a day and a night' NOT a modern 24 hour day.

There is no mention of a yom in the verse you cite.

However that citation in no way proves that the yoms mentioned in Exodus 20 represented a day and a night. The Israelites thought in terms of yoms = periods of light. Otherwise it would be unthinkable that someone could speak of 'forty days and forty nights.

And this is confirmed by Genesis 1 which SAYS that a yom is a period of light. You can give no example where a 'day' is 'a day and a night'.

Luke 23:54 KJV
(54) And that day was the preparation, and the sabbath drew on.

Luke 23:56 KJV
(56) And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.

we are not discussing the New Testament period when the treatment of time had completely changed. By then 'days' were divided into twelve, and nights into four watches. So that is irrelevant. I realise that you ignore context and fail to discern how man's knowledge expanded. But that is the case.

In the NT this shows that the Sabbath started at sunset not in the daytime only.

Sooooooo? I have not denied it. I have only denied that Exodus 20 refers to it.

show me in the Bible that they did not keep the Sabbath for 24 hours, sunset to sunset.

They did observe the Sabbath from sunset to sunset. It is just not mentioned in Genesis or Exodus 20.

Also keeping the Sabbath sunset to sunset comes from creation where the Bible says a day begins with sunset.

The account of creation teaches that a yom is a period of light. so you are clearly wrong. it commences at dawn AND ENDS AT DUSK. Nowhere in Scripture is a day and a night said to be 'the evening and the morning'. but a day is said to commence at dawn and end at dusk.

Now with this proof that the Sabbath was 24 hours not 12 according to the commandment also shows that the other 6 days in the commandment are also six 24 hour days.

It is not proof at all. It simply depends on your dogmatic statement. I realise that you 'Bible believing Christians' DO NOT BELIEVE THE BIBLE when it disagrees with you. The ONLY definition in Genesis 1 of a yom is as a period of light. and it is in THE SAME VERSE as the dusk and the dawn were of the first yom. If you really believe the Bible and not your own ideas the meaning is clear..

I suggest you come down of your high horse and think about this with an open mind not with your mind set on your opinion of truth.

Do you mean I should not believe the Bible when it defines words but should take your definition instead?

 

[valiant]

With that attitude, I don't think you will ever guide anyone to any truth...




All I see when I look at your posts is a mountain of arrogance, cowardice, and PRIDE.

I leave you to wallow in it.

LOL.....................................wallows away. enjoy your trip to the moon.