Should we exercise caution sharing personal problems in the church?

[convallaria]

On another thread I was prompted to remember an incident in a fellowship some years ago where I had shared something painful and personal and got attacked for it. It took me ages to get over it as it felt like I was already down on the ground, when the bible teacher started putting the boot in. Thankfully I have been able to find my joy in the Lord once more, and recover ministerial outlets, but I would say that is solely down to the goodness and awesomeness of God and no thanks to that Bible teacher.

Often to me it feels like there is a lonely aspect to our walk where we find out Who Christ is, who we are in Him, and what the substance of our relationship can be through the places He leads us. These things are precious, priceless even, but to accompany this experience for me there is always the sorrow I deeply feel for how the church could be, but isn't.

In discussion this morning with a beloved brother he confessed he never trusts anyone but a tiny few in the church. He and I have passed through things similar over a similar time span and I understand where he is coming from. It seems there is such arrogance out there and an eagerness to make ourselves publicly appear right while not wanting to labour and love each other, or suffer for the good of someone, even a little.

Someone once said to me that I am a very strong person. She meant that I had passed through serious troubles with my faith intact. It made me cry because I had not thought of myself as strong at all, rather the opposite.

But I seem to be mourning for what I see in the church, that there is a shortage of people to whom people may come when they are really struggling with an issue, and that if they do get the courage up to share it, often get blasted for failing rather than encouraged or restored.

Is this anyone else's experience or just my jaundiced view?

 

[pwrnJC]

Every True CHRISTIAN has a special unique spiritual gift(S), as mentioned in 1 Corinthians chapter 12. Sadly, few have patience to use them wisely. My mom, who is a pastor's wife, is so legalistic , with NO gray areas in LIFE, that she instantly condemns people to hell if they listen to certain music, dress a certain way, has body piercings, or tatoos, uses any form of alcohol when preparing food, or dining or celebrating a wedding. Nobody asks for her opinion, but she loves dishing it out. Needless to say, she does not have many friends and her family avoids her at all costs. The old saying goes, "YOU can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar". You have to rise above the 'righteous" ridicule from fellow CHRISTIANS and find your own solid ground to stand upon, using your talents for GOD's glory and moving forth, being guided by the Holy Spirit. HE will lead certain folks across your pathway at just the right time!

 

[Willie-T]

On another thread I was prompted to remember an incident in a fellowship some years ago where I had shared something painful and personal and got attacked for it. It took me ages to get over it as it felt like I was already down on the ground, when the bible teacher started putting the boot in. Thankfully I have been able to find my joy in the Lord once more, and recover ministerial outlets, but I would say that is solely down to the goodness and awesomeness of God and no thanks to that Bible teacher.

Often to me it feels like there is a lonely aspect to our walk where we find out Who Christ is, who we are in Him, and what the substance of our relationship can be through the places He leads us. These things are precious, priceless even, but to accompany this experience for me there is always the sorrow I deeply feel for how the church could be, but isn't.

In discussion this morning with a beloved brother he confessed he never trusts anyone but a tiny few in the church. He and I have passed through things similar over a similar time span and I understand where he is coming from. It seems there is such arrogance out there and an eagerness to make ourselves publicly appear right while not wanting to labour and love each other, or suffer for the good of someone, even a little.

Someone once said to me that I am a very strong person. She meant that I had passed through serious troubles with my faith intact. It made me cry because I had not thought of myself as strong at all, rather the opposite.

But I seem to be mourning for what I see in the church, that there is a shortage of people to whom people may come when they are really struggling with an issue, and that if they do get the courage up to share it, often get blasted for failing rather than encouraged or restored.

Is this anyone else's experience or just my jaundiced view?

I have a longtime friend who ministers and writes Christian books. One of her favorite sayings concerns how much we look to others to "validate" us...... "If you CAN be offended, you WILL be."

 

[convallaria]

Every True CHRISTIAN has a special unique spiritual gift(S), as mentioned in 1 Corinthians chapter 12. Sadly, few have patience to use them wisely. My mom, who is a pastor's wife, is so legalistic , with NO gray areas in LIFE, that she instantly condemns people to hell if they listen to certain music, dress a certain way, has body piercings, or tatoos, uses any form of alcohol when preparing food, or dining or celebrating a wedding. Nobody asks for her opinion, but she loves dishing it out. Needless to say, she does not have many friends and her family avoids her at all costs. The old saying goes, "YOU can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar". You have to rise above the 'righteous" ridicule from fellow CHRISTIANS and find your own solid ground to stand upon, using your talents for GOD's glory and moving forth, being guided by the Holy Spirit. HE will lead certain folks across your pathway at just the right time!

I think that's right, though the process has taken a long time to become in any way clear. When I was first saved I thought everyone who called themselves a Christian probably felt the same way as me, in love with Jesus and wanting to please Him ...but that is not the case seemingly. I also thought naiively that I could share something personal and it would be treated in confidence and respect...that turns out not to be the case either.

I believe I have certain triggers of betrayal, abandonment and control that I am over-sensitive to, because of past experiences in the church and personally: I seem to spot those issues frequently when they arise, and by the same token, I seem to spot them in others...which sometimes means I can be a listener and a helper if I think someone is going down the same road as me. I am concluding that perhaps that is what those experiences are for, all things working together for good to them that love God, to them that are called according to His purpose.

It makes for a lonely walk though, because I never feel I fit in a church setting.

Do you ever challenge your mom on her behaviour? She sounds like she good do with some good spiritual advice.

 

[convallaria]

I have a longtime friend who ministers and writes Christian books. One of her favorite sayings concerns how much we look to others to "validate" us...... "If you CAN be offended, you WILL be."

It isn't really about looking to others to validate us, but about looking for help from those who are supposed to care. We can't go around offending people and then imply it is their fault when they get offended: that seems like an excuse to behave as we want to and not come into a genuine place of caring for each other. Surely no one can read the words of Jesus and think it is OK to offend people and not care?

Even so, I don't think offended was even close to what happened to me really, as I said, it was more like hurt heaped upon hurt when I was already distressed and in pain. That is something else don't you think?

 

[mwc68]

It isn't really about looking to others to validate us, but about looking for help from those who are supposed to care. We can't go around offending people and then imply it is their fault when they get offended: that seems like an excuse to behave as we want to and not come into a genuine place of caring for each other. Surely no one can read the words of Jesus and think it is OK to offend people and not care?

Even so, I don't think offended was even close to what happened to me really, as I said, it was more like hurt heaped upon hurt when I was already distressed and in pain. That is something else don't you think?

I belong to a couple of organizations through my church which are coed and a few that are men's groups. When we meet we have what is called the "River Rule"--anything said on this side of the river, stays on this side of river. This confidentiality allows us to be open and share without fear of ridicule or shame. Maybe your church could institute a similar rule?

 

[MarcR]

On another thread I was prompted to remember an incident in a fellowship some years ago where I had shared something painful and personal and got attacked for it. It took me ages to get over it as it felt like I was already down on the ground, when the bible teacher started putting the boot in. Thankfully I have been able to find my joy in the Lord once more, and recover ministerial outlets, but I would say that is solely down to the goodness and awesomeness of God and no thanks to that Bible teacher.

Often to me it feels like there is a lonely aspect to our walk where we find out Who Christ is, who we are in Him, and what the substance of our relationship can be through the places He leads us. These things are precious, priceless even, but to accompany this experience for me there is always the sorrow I deeply feel for how the church could be, but isn't.

In discussion this morning with a beloved brother he confessed he never trusts anyone but a tiny few in the church. He and I have passed through things similar over a similar time span and I understand where he is coming from. It seems there is such arrogance out there and an eagerness to make ourselves publicly appear right while not wanting to labour and love each other, or suffer for the good of someone, even a little.

Someone once said to me that I am a very strong person. She meant that I had passed through serious troubles with my faith intact. It made me cry because I had not thought of myself as strong at all, rather the opposite.

But I seem to be mourning for what I see in the church, that there is a shortage of people to whom people may come when they are really struggling with an issue, and that if they do get the courage up to share it, often get blasted for failing rather than encouraged or restored.

Is this anyone else's experience or just my jaundiced view?

Convalaria,


There are actually churches where members can share their personal lives and struggles and not be made uncomfortable. I don't know what denominations are available in Britain; but if any of these are available, they would be a good place to look:

Christian Missionary Alliance, Evangelical Free, Christian church, Mission Covenant church, Mennonite, Baptist.

Of course it is true that people who do not understand Christian fellowship can be found in any church. However, you are far more likely to find openness and intimacy among the denominations listed than elsewhere, IMO.

BTW, I think the Lily of the Valley is a lovely flower; and I like its association with our Lord.

 

[crossnote]

On another thread I was prompted to remember an incident in a fellowship some years ago where I had shared something painful and personal and got attacked for it. It took me ages to get over it as it felt like I was already down on the ground, when the bible teacher started putting the boot in. Thankfully I have been able to find my joy in the Lord once more, and recover ministerial outlets, but I would say that is solely down to the goodness and awesomeness of God and no thanks to that Bible teacher.

Often to me it feels like there is a lonely aspect to our walk where we find out Who Christ is, who we are in Him, and what the substance of our relationship can be through the places He leads us. These things are precious, priceless even, but to accompany this experience for me there is always the sorrow I deeply feel for how the church could be, but isn't.

In discussion this morning with a beloved brother he confessed he never trusts anyone but a tiny few in the church. He and I have passed through things similar over a similar time span and I understand where he is coming from. It seems there is such arrogance out there and an eagerness to make ourselves publicly appear right while not wanting to labour and love each other, or suffer for the good of someone, even a little.

Someone once said to me that I am a very strong person. She meant that I had passed through serious troubles with my faith intact. It made me cry because I had not thought of myself as strong at all, rather the opposite.

But I seem to be mourning for what I see in the church, that there is a shortage of people to whom people may come when they are really struggling with an issue, and that if they do get the courage up to share it, often get blasted for failing rather than encouraged or restored.

Is this anyone else's experience or just my jaundiced view?

In that fellowship where you were attacked, was that the pastor who did the attacking or some other of it's members?
If the pastor, then that's pretty serious but when it comes to members...they come in all kinds of sizes and flavors. I stay away from sharing anything too personal with members because there are too many leaky faucets.

 

[mwc68]

I belong to a couple of organizations through my church which are coed and a few that are men's groups. When we meet we have what is called the "River Rule"--anything said on this side of the river, stays on this side of river. This confidentiality allows us to be open and share without fear of ridicule or shame. Maybe your church could institute a similar rule?

The church should be where we come for healing as well as worship. I would rather discuss these things with Gods people rather than a therapist. I pray God through the Holy Spirit leads you to a caring church!

 

[Gr8grace]

It isn't really about looking to others to validate us, but about looking for help from those who are supposed to care. We can't go around offending people and then imply it is their fault when they get offended: that seems like an excuse to behave as we want to and not come into a genuine place of caring for each other. Surely no one can read the words of Jesus and think it is OK to offend people and not care?

Even so, I don't think offended was even close to what happened to me really, as I said, it was more like hurt heaped upon hurt when I was already distressed and in pain. That is something else don't you think?

We have it backwards in todays Christianity. A gifted teacher teaches problem solving devices so the believer can handle their problems. Most of us are not taught these problem solving devices and don't know how to handle the problem. So we get advice from other believers who have no clue how to help.

We are basically taught to be fruit inspectors and when someone has a problem the solution is to inspect the fruit. And that helps no one.

Proper order......

rebound......name and site the problem to God(Not to other people) and carry on. Be done with it.
Filling of the Spirit......we are filled with the Spirit again when we name and site our sins to God(Not other people)
faith rest.....rest in His faith. This is true rest.
Grace orientation.....live in Grace. No condemnation in Christ.
Doctrinal orientation......every problem has a solution in His word.
Personal love for God the father...this keeps us in the sphere if the Christian way of life.
impersonal love for mankind.....keeps us from hating or despising those who bug or irritate us.
Sharing the happiness of God...we have assurance and biblical hope in God.
A personal sense of destiny.....no matter what we go through, God has a personal,signature plan for each of us.
occupation with Christ....where your heart is..........


We are to fellowship these kinds of things to others. Then those around us have tools and devices to solve their problems.

 

[convallaria]

I belong to a couple of organizations through my church which are coed and a few that are men's groups. When we meet we have what is called the "River Rule"--anything said on this side of the river, stays on this side of river. This confidentiality allows us to be open and share without fear of ridicule or shame. Maybe your church could institute a similar rule?

That would be fantastic but so far nothing!

 

[convallaria]

Convalaria,


There are actually churches where members can share their personal lives and struggles and not be made uncomfortable. I don't know what denominations are available in Britain; but if any of these are available, they would be a good place to look:

Christian Missionary Alliance, Evangelical Free, Christian church, Mission Covenant church, Mennonite, Baptist.

Of course it is true that people who do not understand Christian fellowship can be found in any church. However, you are far more likely to find openness and intimacy among the denominations listed than elsewhere, IMO.

BTW, I think the Lily of the Valley is a lovely flower; and I like its association with our Lord.

Hi there Marc, thanks for knowing what the name means!!

Infortunately in UK I have not found any of those churches mentioned, and not being a driver I am confined to the town where I live, But I haven't stopped hoping for a real loving fellowship where the commands of Jesus are taken to heart!

Many thanks for reply

 

[convallaria]

In that fellowship where you were attacked, was that the pastor who did the attacking or some other of it's members?
If the pastor, then that's pretty serious but when it comes to members...they come in all kinds of sizes and flavors. I stay away from sharing anything too personal with members because there are too many leaky faucets.

He was the Bible study teacher and the stand-in pastor. Unfortunately what put the tin hat on it later was that the pastor himself said from the pulpit that..."we like to keep the Holy Spirit in a low profile here"... I thought "whaaaaaaaaaaaaat????!!!!! I am definitely in the wrong place" lol

 

[Willie-T]

It isn't really about looking to others to validate us, but about looking for help from those who are supposed to care. We can't go around offending people and then imply it is their fault when they get offended: that seems like an excuse to behave as we want to and not come into a genuine place of caring for each other. Surely no one can read the words of Jesus and think it is OK to offend people and not care?

Even so, I don't think offended was even close to what happened to me really, as I said, it was more like hurt heaped upon hurt when I was already distressed and in pain. That is something else don't you think?

All you have to do is look right here, at this forum, to see that wearing the tag, "Christian" means very little to some people. Posters right here seem to be just waiting and looking for people (not simply ideals nor beliefs) to attack and belittle.

So, of course, it is foolhardy to think you can blab personal things to others just because they happen to sit through the same service you do each Sunday.

 

[convallaria]

Proper order......

rebound......name and site the problem to God(Not to other people) and carry on. Be done with it.
Filling of the Spirit......we are filled with the Spirit again when we name and site our sins to God(Not other people)
faith rest.....rest in His faith. This is true rest.
Grace orientation.....live in Grace. No condemnation in Christ.
Doctrinal orientation......every problem has a solution in His word.
Personal love for God the father...this keeps us in the sphere if the Christian way of life.
impersonal love for mankind.....keeps us from hating or despising those who bug or irritate us.
Sharing the happiness of God...we have assurance and biblical hope in God.
A personal sense of destiny.....no matter what we go through, God has a personal,signature plan for each of us.
occupation with Christ....where your heart is..........


We are to fellowship these kinds of things to others. Then those around us have tools and devices to solve their problems.

Well....I wasn't confessing or confiding a personal sin, I was hurting and brokenhearted over sins that had been done to me, and I was looking for prayer, spiritual advice, help. Isn't it curious that I was attacked for doing that, and made out to be the bad guy?

In some places it is as if they simply do not accept that believers go through bad things. It is like sticking our fingers in our ears and going lalalalala because guess what, there are LOADS of hurting people out there, and many are hurt by the church. We really have to get our act together on this.

 

[convallaria]

All you have to do is look right here, at this forum, to see that wearing the tag, "Christian" means very little to some people. Posters right here seem to be just waiting and looking for people (not simply ideals nor beliefs) to attack and belittle.

So, of course, it is foolhardy to think you can blab personal things to others just because they happen to sit through the same service you do each Sunday.

And that is so sad isn't it?

 

[VioletReigns]

I don't put my trust in anyone. And nobody should put their trust in me. I'm not saying all people are untrustworthy; I'm saying all people are imperfect. I only trust the Lord Jesus.

Having three adult children, they and I have learned that we disappoint one another. Sometimes it's unintentional, and other times it's just plain careless.

I like what Willie-T posted, "If you CAN be offended, you WILL be." One of the best lessons I've learned from this site is that I'm blind to my own judgmental attitude sometimes. And in most cases where I've gotten offended in the forums or my feelings were hurt by someone's comment, it caused me to grow up a little more in Jesus whenever I recognized my own bad attitude towards someone. lol

 

[atwhatcost]

On another thread I was prompted to remember an incident in a fellowship some years ago where I had shared something painful and personal and got attacked for it. It took me ages to get over it as it felt like I was already down on the ground, when the bible teacher started putting the boot in. Thankfully I have been able to find my joy in the Lord once more, and recover ministerial outlets, but I would say that is solely down to the goodness and awesomeness of God and no thanks to that Bible teacher.

Often to me it feels like there is a lonely aspect to our walk where we find out Who Christ is, who we are in Him, and what the substance of our relationship can be through the places He leads us. These things are precious, priceless even, but to accompany this experience for me there is always the sorrow I deeply feel for how the church could be, but isn't.

In discussion this morning with a beloved brother he confessed he never trusts anyone but a tiny few in the church. He and I have passed through things similar over a similar time span and I understand where he is coming from. It seems there is such arrogance out there and an eagerness to make ourselves publicly appear right while not wanting to labour and love each other, or suffer for the good of someone, even a little.

Someone once said to me that I am a very strong person. She meant that I had passed through serious troubles with my faith intact. It made me cry because I had not thought of myself as strong at all, rather the opposite.

But I seem to be mourning for what I see in the church, that there is a shortage of people to whom people may come when they are really struggling with an issue, and that if they do get the courage up to share it, often get blasted for failing rather than encouraged or restored.

Is this anyone else's experience or just my jaundiced view?

There are two churches in Christianity -- the visible and invisible church. Some law of physics says two objects cannot share the same space. That's simply wrong. The visible church is what we see, a bunch of people gathering together supposedly to praise God. The invisible church is there too. There the people and spirits truly praising God. It looks like all the church is praising God, but that's not true. There are tares among us, there are plants growing in rocky soil, and there are nonbelievers checking out the church for a variety of reasons.

We cannot easily discern the visible with the invisible.

I am deeply, deeply flawed. God's been chipping at me for 43 years and yet I'm still flawed and still screwing up. BUT he is working on me. AND he's doing a great job. And I see him doing that with others. And I see his plan unfolding.

I will not let the tares, the stunted vegetation, and the nonbelievers deny him by pointing at me for being flawed. I will not stop seeking him even in the midst of tough problems. I will not shut up. They can point at me and laugh all they want, because God wins so I'm on the winner's side.

So, let them laugh. Let them mock. Let them point at me and try to make me feel bad about me. They can't make me feel bad. I already know what's wrong with me and who is fixing me. God still wins! And he's given me the power to know that well enough that they cannot dictate how I feel about anything. I cannot control them, but God's strength gives me what is needed to not play their games.

I will shout it to the rooftops. God has healed me of chronic UTIs. He has brought my level of pain to a thorn in my side. He has saved my life. He has saved my husband's life. He has changed that stubborn, pigheaded, obnoxious, arrogant, judgmental, whiny teen girl into a better-stubborn, sieve-headed, less-obnoxious, much-less-whiny older woman, who has learned enough lessons to not judge as quickly as I used to.

He has given me his sight to see how all this mess works out. GOD WINS! GOD WON ALREADY! What have I to be ashamed of -- in front of the visible or invisible church?

 

[atwhatcost]

I think that's right, though the process has taken a long time to become in any way clear. When I was first saved I thought everyone who called themselves a Christian probably felt the same way as me, in love with Jesus and wanting to please Him ...but that is not the case seemingly. I also thought naiively that I could share something personal and it would be treated in confidence and respect...that turns out not to be the case either.

I believe I have certain triggers of betrayal, abandonment and control that I am over-sensitive to, because of past experiences in the church and personally: I seem to spot those issues frequently when they arise, and by the same token, I seem to spot them in others...which sometimes means I can be a listener and a helper if I think someone is going down the same road as me. I am concluding that perhaps that is what those experiences are for, all things working together for good to them that love God, to them that are called according to His purpose.

It makes for a lonely walk though, because I never feel I fit in a church setting.

Do you ever challenge your mom on her behaviour? She sounds like she good do with some good spiritual advice.

You're not the only one like you. I'm like you too. Along with the sensitivity to see the users and the used, there is also the sensitivity to see the ones who are neither. Those are the ones we can trust. Better yet, if they're in the invisible church. (You can still trust nonbelievers, but they tend to have foreign advice to give.)

 

[atwhatcost]

Every True CHRISTIAN has a special unique spiritual gift(S), as mentioned in 1 Corinthians chapter 12. Sadly, few have patience to use them wisely. My mom, who is a pastor's wife, is so legalistic , with NO gray areas in LIFE, that she instantly condemns people to hell if they listen to certain music, dress a certain way, has body piercings, or tatoos, uses any form of alcohol when preparing food, or dining or celebrating a wedding. Nobody asks for her opinion, but she loves dishing it out. Needless to say, she does not have many friends and her family avoids her at all costs. The old saying goes, "YOU can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar". You have to rise above the 'righteous" ridicule from fellow CHRISTIANS and find your own solid ground to stand upon, using your talents for GOD's glory and moving forth, being guided by the Holy Spirit. HE will lead certain folks across your pathway at just the right time!

And you don't see you are your mom?