If you believe in OSAS, please answer a few questions for me.
- Thread starter Jason0047
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W
You still think God wrote the KJV, eh?
The definition of doctrine that I was referring to previously, is as it relates to the Church. If we simply consider "doctrine" and "teaching" to be synonymous, then the only doctrine (or teaching) presented by way of the Bible is the teaching of Jesus, which can be summed:
Romans 6:23New International Version (NIV)
23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in[a] Christ Jesus our Lord.
Everything, as it relates to doctrine, was created by man.
I think it could do you good to reflect on the word "gift" above -- do you know the meaning?
Charisma.
The definition of doctrine that I was referring to previously, is as it relates to the Church. If we simply consider "doctrine" and "teaching" to be synonymous, then the only doctrine (or teaching) presented by way of the Bible is the teaching of Jesus, which can be summed:
Romans 6:23New International Version (NIV)
23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in[a] Christ Jesus our Lord.
Everything, as it relates to doctrine, was created by man.
I think it could do you good to reflect on the word "gift" above -- do you know the meaning?
Charisma.
Seems there are a couple of people on here that hammer the truth out on their own anvil of lies while rejecting verb tense, context, definitions of words and the common sense that God gave a goose..........for example....They will say one was saved and then lost when Jesus states clearly that he never KNEW THEM...which means they could not have been saved and then lost it.....their very words and belief that they push makes Christ out to be a liar! This shows they have no ability to logically reason the word of God and are only interested in pushing their dogma and agendas while rejecting obvious truth that contradicts their beliefs......unwilling to be open to learning and instruction while claiming to back everything with scripture....nothing but circular reasoning and a lack of understanding on their part!
E
Now this is to no one in particular but to everyone involved in this thread. I even asked myself this question before I am now typing it.
"How did we come to Christ in the first place?"
Did we come to Christ because we decided it was a good idea? Did we read something and decided we wanted to know Christ? Or did the Holy Spirit apart from anything we did compel us to come to Christ? This is not off topic but actually leads to the subject of OSAS.
Now please don't just answer this without thought. Think about it a bit and pray to God for understanding of this. This is not a trick question. And I am not "goading" anyone into what I think may be a false answer. This is a serious thought and one not to be taken lightly.
And yes I will give my own answer but I will not answer in a way to attack anyone. This one question will lead to why we each have a certain belief for or against OSAS. it will help us each understand better where each other's view comes from.
"How did we come to Christ in the first place?"
Did we come to Christ because we decided it was a good idea? Did we read something and decided we wanted to know Christ? Or did the Holy Spirit apart from anything we did compel us to come to Christ? This is not off topic but actually leads to the subject of OSAS.
Now please don't just answer this without thought. Think about it a bit and pray to God for understanding of this. This is not a trick question. And I am not "goading" anyone into what I think may be a false answer. This is a serious thought and one not to be taken lightly.
And yes I will give my own answer but I will not answer in a way to attack anyone. This one question will lead to why we each have a certain belief for or against OSAS. it will help us each understand better where each other's view comes from.
K
They brought you up in the discussion, not me, and said if you were around you would give the truth in those scriptures.
I told them the truth that me and you have already had discussions and you have misused a number of scriptures in our debates, as you still are doing even though by scripture interpreting scripture proves your stance to be wrong.
I was not sarcastic, call you names, belittle you, or even condemn you in my response, so trying to flip this around to say I lied is false and a way to try and wiggle out and take the focus off your own issues in the faith. There is a big difference in saying mouthy comments and being honest and saying to another I have already had discussions on this issue with a person they brought up.
By your understanding you have quoted scriptures to prove me wrong, and those few others that you speak of come from the same OSAS background as well that you speak on, so their understanding and misuse of scripture would be the same also.
Matthew 10:22, and Matthew 7:21-23 is not taking out of context and Hebrews 10:36 proves this.
Jesus telling them He never knew them is in context to Matthew 10:33, 25:31-46, that if you deny Him before others He will deny you before the Father. In Matthew 25 Jesus says one way to deny Him is by denying others help who are in need, showing that denying Him runs deeper then just simply unbelief.
So my stance does not make Jesus out to be a liar because He did exactly to those in Matthew 7 what He said He would do if you deny Him by your actions. (Titus 1:16)
Professing Jesus as your Lord is not enough if your actions do not show it as well !!!
I told them the truth that me and you have already had discussions and you have misused a number of scriptures in our debates, as you still are doing even though by scripture interpreting scripture proves your stance to be wrong.
I was not sarcastic, call you names, belittle you, or even condemn you in my response, so trying to flip this around to say I lied is false and a way to try and wiggle out and take the focus off your own issues in the faith. There is a big difference in saying mouthy comments and being honest and saying to another I have already had discussions on this issue with a person they brought up.
By your understanding you have quoted scriptures to prove me wrong, and those few others that you speak of come from the same OSAS background as well that you speak on, so their understanding and misuse of scripture would be the same also.
Matthew 10:22, and Matthew 7:21-23 is not taking out of context and Hebrews 10:36 proves this.
Jesus telling them He never knew them is in context to Matthew 10:33, 25:31-46, that if you deny Him before others He will deny you before the Father. In Matthew 25 Jesus says one way to deny Him is by denying others help who are in need, showing that denying Him runs deeper then just simply unbelief.
So my stance does not make Jesus out to be a liar because He did exactly to those in Matthew 7 what He said He would do if you deny Him by your actions. (Titus 1:16)
Professing Jesus as your Lord is not enough if your actions do not show it as well !!!
K
False allegations are not becoming of a Christian, as no I do not sin everyday nor does the bible say we will continue to be that sinful.
Do we still backslide and sin here or there? Yes we do but sinning every single day I do not do, and you do not know me to make that claim. The word of God does not agree or support a sin everyday nature, as that shows that one is not born again in the Spirit. For if the Holy Spirit abides in you you would keep His commandments, and the fruits will give you self-control and lead you away from sins grasp on your life.
Now your just misrepresenting the facts which makes you a ?????? Your words were obvious and you said exactly what you believe and mean.....
Originally Posted by Jason0047
Paul kicked the man who committed fornication out of a church. So a believer can correct other believers. That is not sowing discord but it is called correcting believers on false beliefs.
As for your statement about trolls: The Word of God tells us to speak full of grace seasoned with salt. How exactly are you doing that by still calling me a troll and saying I am worse than an enemy. How is that even a New Testament teaching?
As for your statement about trolls: The Word of God tells us to speak full of grace seasoned with salt. How exactly are you doing that by still calling me a troll and saying I am worse than an enemy. How is that even a New Testament teaching?
DUDE, your nothing but a joke...I have seen you on numerous occasions use those verses to try and prove one can lose salvation....everybody one here can see how you twist the scriptures and your own words when you get nailed.......keep on deceiving yourself in pride.....you will be abased in due time!
One Question you failed to ask, which i believe is the most evident question that proves OSAS can't possibly be True is:
If once you are Saved, your name is written in the Book of Life and can't never be removed, why are there Scriptures which plainly teach a persons name can be removed from the Book of Life?
The mere fact that Scriptures teach a name once written in the Book of Life, can be blotted out of it. is ABSOLUTE PROOF, that Once Saved Always Saved, can't possibly be True.
Same line of questioning would be. Is it True once you are SAVED, your name is written in the Book of Life? Most know the answer to be TRUE. Then ask those who believe OSAS to explain how a person is blotted out of the Book of Life, ask them "Wasn't that persons name written in the Book prior, wasn't that person SAVED, thereby being written in the Book of Life, how then are they now blotted out of it?
People have been wearing those blinders for so long, they don't know the Truth, nor are they willing to learn the Truth, they are so use to the blinders.
Responding to OP
If once you are Saved, your name is written in the Book of Life and can't never be removed, why are there Scriptures which plainly teach a persons name can be removed from the Book of Life?
The mere fact that Scriptures teach a name once written in the Book of Life, can be blotted out of it. is ABSOLUTE PROOF, that Once Saved Always Saved, can't possibly be True.
Same line of questioning would be. Is it True once you are SAVED, your name is written in the Book of Life? Most know the answer to be TRUE. Then ask those who believe OSAS to explain how a person is blotted out of the Book of Life, ask them "Wasn't that persons name written in the Book prior, wasn't that person SAVED, thereby being written in the Book of Life, how then are they now blotted out of it?
People have been wearing those blinders for so long, they don't know the Truth, nor are they willing to learn the Truth, they are so use to the blinders.
Responding to OP