Obsession with Confession (1 John 1:9, sin confession)

[Gr8grace]

We grieve and quench the Holy Spirit when we ignore the Lord's Atonement and try to make ourselves acceptable to God.

Actually grieving the Spirit is sinning against God,living in the cosmic system(World) for self.

Quenching the Spirit is living in the world of religion and human good(Evil).

 

[ladylynn]

People get in the ditch on both sides of the road. One side says that sin isn't dealt with until it is confessed. The other side acts as if there is no need for communication of forgiveness and repentance between a father and son.

What it comes down to is having a "Christ conscience" and not a "sin conscience" or "self conscience" The devil wants us to look at ourselves in our weakness. When we do we feel a great lack and obstacle between us and God...sin. BUT Jesus already took care of that great lack and weakness and conquered it. We are now to - instead of focusing on our weaknesses, we focus on HIS strength. Again, it is being aware of Jesus above ourselves. It gives JESUS all our focus. "For I am crucified with Christ never the less I live yet not I but Christ lives in me and the life I now live I live by the faith of the Son of God who loved me and gave Himself for me."

The Bible verses we memorized years ago take on a whole new meaning in light of GRACE. His mercies are new every morning... It's soo true!!



Once the enemy gets us to focus on ourselves and our weaknesses, we lose sight of the truth of what Jesus has already done and we become weak. Adam and Eve had it all but satan lied to them and made them doubt who they were to God and what they had.

Also, when we allow ourselves to feel condemnation, we think it is from the HolySpirit (and we receive it) when it fact it is coming from the devil and we think we are getting it from the HolySpirit as Godly conviction. Again., another truth is - we are convicted of our righteous standing when we are convicted by the HolySpirit. He never condemns us. If you are feeling condemned you must know that is not of God. He is no longer condemning us He is always reminding us of our standing before God IN Christ Always.

Do not receive condemnation because it can only be ours if we take it. We have been given the GIFT of NO CONDEMNATION. Do not allow satan to take away something you have been given as a gift from Jesus...bought and paid for 100%.

 

[Willie-T]

Maybe I am not understanding what you guys mean by FELLOWSHIP. And being, "out of it" or back "in it."

When I went to the CoC, and those legalistic baasheads "disfellowshiped" someone, there was not even the slightest hint of acknowledgment that they ever existed. We were to almost do the Klingon thing of spinning on our heels, and turning our backs to them. I've sinned a lot (I'm not as righteous as some) but God has never once done anything like that to me. He has even answered my prayers when I was still screwed-up.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

Your honesty before God is not in question. By all means, be open with the Lord. You can confess areas that you are struggling with. Nothing here said otherwise. You should be open with the Lord and desire to be victorious in areas that you are weak. The point, however, is that your confession does not grant forgiveness. You already have it in Jesus Christ. That is precisely why you can be open with your Heavenly Father about your shortcomings.

Your fellowship is not restored when you confess your sins, for your fellowship never departed. You are the temple of the Holy Spirit, where is He going to go? He will never forsake you. You, in your sin, may have distanced yourself from the Lord, but the Lord didn't step back. It was you, as with Adam and Eve, who hid. You can have confidence towards God, and in knowing of the forgiveness you have in Jesus, you can be completely open with the Lord.

You say your conscience condemns you and then you confess, but the relief is in thinking that the confession has made you right with God. You get to that state after confessing, where as a person who grasps God's grace by revelation of the Holy Spirit is already in that state (or mindset). They don't feel the need to confess to have peace of mind because they already walk in that mindset of no condemnation and forgiveness.

Hope that clarifies it a little for you.

Christ is in me . . . Am I always IN Christ? Me being IN Christ is walking by the Spirit wherein there is NO condemnation - so as long as I walk by the Spirit and not by the flesh then no condemnation and I am in fellowship. BUT when I step away and walk in the flesh . . . I am no longer IN Christ . . . (I am not saying Christ has left me) but I have allowed something to interfere with my relationship, my communion with the Father and the Son. Just as a child who breaks the rules within the earthly family - they still belong in their family but the relationship may be damaged until an apology is given and forgiveness is given in return . . . if the "misbehavior" continues for a long period it could have severe consequences for the relationship within the family EVEN THOUGH they remain a part of the family.

I have right standing before God because of my faith in his Son . . . not because of anything I do. 1 John is talking about our walk after being born again. I ask forgiveness because I want to restore my communion with my Father . . . Jesus Christ was set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past . . . what about the ones that are committed after we become born again?

That is my take on the matter . . . Oh, I fully understand what you are saying - I just think God deserves my apologies when I fail him in my walk . . .

 

[crossnote]

I asked two questions, and "Yes" cannot cover both. So, by what you've been saying, I guess you were answering the second part. Then you must feel your assurance in Christ depends upon you making sure you kept up with every possible sin, and regained Salvation by repeated confessions. Is that about it?

Yes to both. It's just like asking me if Jesus is God or man...YES.

 

[Gr8grace]

Maybe I am not understanding what you guys mean by FELLOWSHIP. And being, "out of it" or back "in it."

When I went to the CoC, and those legalistic baasheads "disfellowshiped" someone, there was not even the slightest hint of acknowledgment that they ever existed. We were to almost do the Klingon thing of spinning on our heels, and turning our backs to them. I've sinned a lot (I'm not as righteous as some) but God has never once done anything like that to me. He has even answered my prayers when I was still screwed-up.

I believe "out of fellowship" is not being filled or walking in the Spirit.

The moment a believer sins or does some good from the flesh.............we no longer are filled or walking in the Spirit.


We name and site when we did these things and we are returned to fellowship...... Walking and filled with the Spirit.

Has nothing to do with the indwelling or position we have in Christ. Just our experiential sanctification.

 

[ladylynn]

There also seems to be some verb tenses that states a few things....If I remember right, John the Immerser and Jesus both preached to be repenting (present active indicative form of the verb) for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand....and were are to CONFESS our faults ONE to ANOTHER...just a few more thoughts to chew on!

Again, seeing the differences in how we as believers are no longer under the OLD covenant as John the Baptist preached under the law., apart from grace. He preached right before Jesus came. He was a witness of who was to come.

We have to see the MAJOR change when Jesus died on the cross. The veil was rent in two., that was a happening not only on earth but in the heavenlies. So many of us new covenant believers are doing what the Jews did by going to that veil and sewing it together again wanting to be under the law because we are comfortable doing and getting for our doing.

Grace is a new and living way. When we see our sins and weaknesses now, we see them in light of grace and receive the gift of no condemnation. We do not have to try and sew the veil again but accept the new and living way that Jesus bought for us. Our relationship is based on Jesus righteousness and Grace...not our works and law.

 

[dcontroversal]

Again, seeing the differences in how we as believers are no longer under the OLD covenant as John the Baptist preached under the law., apart from grace. He preached right before Jesus came. He was a witness of who was to come.

We have to see the MAJOR change when Jesus died on the cross. The veil was rent in two., that was a happening not only on earth but in the heavenlies. So many of us new covenant believers are doing what the Jews did by going to that veil and sewing it together again wanting to be under the law because we are comfortable doing and getting for our doing.

Grace is a new and living way. When we see our sins and weaknesses now, we see them in light of grace and receive the gift of no condemnation. We do not have to try and sew the veil again but accept the new and living way that Jesus bought for us. Our relationship is based on Jesus righteousness and Grace...not our works and law.

I don't recall saying anything about being condemned....

 

[Gr8grace]

Again, seeing the differences in how we as believers are no longer under the OLD covenant as John the Baptist preached under the law., apart from grace. He preached right before Jesus came. He was a witness of who was to come.

We have to see the MAJOR change when Jesus died on the cross. The veil was rent in two., that was a happening not only on earth but in the heavenlies. So many of us new covenant believers are doing what the Jews did by going to that veil and sewing it together again wanting to be under the law because we are comfortable doing and getting for our doing.

Grace is a new and living way. When we see our sins and weaknesses now, we see them in light of grace and receive the gift of no condemnation. We do not have to try and sew the veil again but accept the new and living way that Jesus bought for us. Our relationship is based on Jesus righteousness and Grace...not our works and law.

IMO, we have semantics going on. I agree with you. Naming and siting sin to God................is understanding that he ALONE took care of it for us.


If we don't acknowledge our sin.............we will live in guilt,worry and fear. We will naturally try to "fix" it ourselves. It is in our nature.

So naming and siting sin is getting back to the Grace of the Lord.............Its done and paid for. We just carry on in the Christian way of life.

If you notice David and his confession(Acknowledgment) to the Lord..................the Lord forgave(wiped out) his guilt that David had. Guilt is not in the Christian way of life. And Guilt keeps us from acknowledging our sin and problems.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

Maybe I am not understanding what you guys mean by FELLOWSHIP. And being, "out of it" or back "in it."

When I went to the CoC, and those legalistic baasheads "disfellowshiped" someone, there was not even the slightest hint of acknowledgment that they ever existed. We were to almost do the Klingon thing of spinning on our heels, and turning our backs to them. I've sinned a lot (I'm not as righteous as some) but God has never once done anything like that to me. He has even answered my prayers when I was still screwed-up.

Fellowship is - koinoia meaning fellowship, association, community, communion, joint participation, intercourse (interaction); A. the share which one has in anything B. intercourse, fellowship, intimacy

And no Willie-T . . . God never leaves us . . . but our full sharing with Him, our intimacy with him, our communion with him can be interrupted how we WALK - We walk by the Spirit, in the light, we have fellowship . . . If we walk by the flesh.
in darkness - that fellowship is broken - (NOT OUR position in the household of God) but our communion, our association, our intimacy is broken. We need to apologize in order to restore that intimacy. Think of it in terms of your earthly family your child does something you don't like - the relationship, the intimacy of that relationship is broken - don't you want and expect an apology?

"The moment a believer sins or does some good from the flesh.............we no longer are filled or walking in the Spirit."

The highlighted above - That Spirit is born within us - NOTHING can effect that . . . . once a child always a child . . . .

 

[Gr8grace]

Fellowship is - koinoia meaning fellowship, association, community, communion, joint participation, intercourse (interaction); A. the share which one has in anything B. intercourse, fellowship, intimacy

And no Willie-T . . . God never leaves us . . . but our full sharing with Him, our intimacy with him, our communion with him can be interrupted how we WALK - We walk by the Spirit, in the light, we have fellowship . . . If we walk by the flesh.
in darkness - that fellowship is broken - (NOT OUR position in the household of God) but our communion, our association, our intimacy is broken. We need to apologize in order to restore that intimacy. Think of it in terms of your earthly family your child does something you don't like - the relationship, the intimacy of that relationship is broken - don't you want and expect an apology?

"The moment a believer sins or does some good from the flesh.............we no longer are filled or walking in the Spirit."

The highlighted above - That Spirit is born within us - NOTHING can effect that . . . . once a child always a child . . . .

The black font is from me.........Here is the rest of it:

Has nothing to do with the indwelling or position we have in Christ. Just our experiential sanctification.

 

[Gr8grace]

There are no commands to be indwelt with the Spirit. We are when we are saved.......passively.


There are commands to be filled(actively). Which means we can lose fellowship. Not salvation, but we can lose the filling and our walk with the Spirit.

 

[Willie-T]

Ya see, what I don't get is that what you guys seem to be saying is that God is withholding "fellowship" from us, and we have to ask Him to take us back. And I see it as being The Parable of The Prodigal Son. It is only US who PERCEIVE separation or broken fellowship. And as with the PS, the Father never withheld anything. In fact, he went running to his returning son. The son never said one single word of remorse or anything, prior to the Father falling all over him, and kissing him. All the time he was gone, the son was thinking he was going to have to beg for the job of Hired Hand to get back in his Father's good graces..... when he (just like us) was never OUT of his Father's love. He simply FELT that way, and he caused himself all sorts of anguish by accepting that guilt....... guilt that we SHOULD know only comes from one source. And it ain't God.

 

[Gr8grace]

Ya see, what I don't get is that what you guys seem to be saying is that God is withholding "fellowship" from us, and we have to ask Him to take us back. And I see it as being The Parable of The Prodigal Son. It is only US who PERCEIVE separation or broken fellowship. And as with the PS, the Father never withheld anything. In fact, he went running to his returning son. The son never said one single word of remorse or anything, prior to the Father falling all over him, and kissing him. All the time he was gone, the son was thinking he was going to have to beg for the job of Hired Hand to get back in his Father's good graces..... when he (just like us) was never OUT of his Father's love. He simply FELT that way, and he caused himself all sorts of anguish by accepting that guilt....... guilt that we SHOULD know only comes from one source. And it ain't God.

I am saying the same thing as you Willie. If we run, we are running. If we quit running, He is there waiting for us. It is us that chooses to run and break fellowship. If we quit running, He is right there.


When we grieve and quench the Spirit.....It is US that is breaking fellowship,not Him. If we rebel, we break fellowship. We quit rebelling......................we see that He never left us.


Just a disclaimer......this is not salvation. This is growing in Grace and knowledge for the saved believer.

 

[BarlyGurl]

Ya see, what I don't get is that what you guys seem to be saying is that God is withholding "fellowship" from us, and we have to ask Him to take us back. And I see it as being The Parable of The Prodigal Son. It is only US who PERCEIVE separation or broken fellowship. And as with the PS, the Father never withheld anything. In fact, he went running to his returning son. The son never said one single word of remorse or anything, prior to the Father falling all over him, and kissing him. All the time he was gone, the son was thinking he was going to have to beg for the job of Hired Hand to get back in his Father's good graces..... when he (just like us) was never OUT of his Father's love. He simply FELT that way, and he caused himself all sorts of anguish by accepting that guilt....... guilt that we SHOULD know only comes from one source. And it ain't God.

you entirely neglect the context that the son W-A-S out of fellowship... gone, outa the country, separated from the father and the fathers resources....the son had to COME BACK... but it was a loving father who delighted at the son's RETURN.

 

[crossnote]

Did I say, somewhere, that you didn't need to acknowledge your errors, or didn't need to accept responsibility for doing such? All I have ever been saying here is that it borders on unbelief to keep repeatedly asking God to forgive you when He has made it all too clear that He has already forgiven us through Christ's sacrifice.

So when you sin, you never ask God for forgiveness of that sin?

 

[Willie-T]

you entirely neglect the context that the son W-A-S out of fellowship... gone, outa the country, separated from the father and the fathers resources....the son had to COME BACK... but it was a loving father who delighted at the son's RETURN.

Only because the son TOOK HIMSELF away. The Father didn't do a thing but give him tons of gifts, and sadly watch him remove himself.

That was the point of my last post. The Father imposed NOTHING on the son. It was all in the son's hands, and he did not even have to ask to be right back in Dad's arms.

 

[crossnote]

Christ is in me . . . Am I always IN Christ? Me being IN Christ is walking by the Spirit wherein there is NO condemnation - so as long as I walk by the Spirit and not by the flesh then no condemnation and I am in fellowship. BUT when I step away and walk in the flesh . . . I am no longer IN Christ . . . (I am not saying Christ has left me) but I have allowed something to interfere with my relationship, my communion with the Father and the Son. Just as a child who breaks the rules within the earthly family - they still belong in their family but the relationship may be damaged until an apology is given and forgiveness is given in return . . . if the "misbehavior" continues for a long period it could have severe consequences for the relationship within the family EVEN THOUGH they remain a part of the family.

I have right standing before God because of my faith in his Son . . . not because of anything I do. 1 John is talking about our walk after being born again. I ask forgiveness because I want to restore my communion with my Father . . . Jesus Christ was set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past . . . what about the ones that are committed after we become born again?

That is my take on the matter . . . Oh, I fully understand what you are saying - I just think God deserves my apologies when I fail him in my walk . . .

According to their argument you are perfect in Christ (true) therefore there is no failing Him (false).

 

[Willie-T]

So when you sin, you never ask God for forgiveness of that sin?

No, I do not. All I do is let my Father know how sorry I am for screwing up and hurting Him. And then I thank My Father for having permanently forgiven me so long ago.

 

[crossnote]

No, I do not. All I do is let my Father know how sorry I am for screwing up and hurting Him. And then I thank My father for having permanently forgiven me so long ago.

Screwing up is not sin? Sounds like some here have a phobia of the word 'sin'.