Albert Pike

[jaybird88]

You seem to have acquired the idea that Masons are in agreement when each other's spiritual beliefs and political views. That isn't even close. Pike was a high ranking MASON, this has nothing to do with his spiritual/political beliefs. That's like the NYPD Chief saying something racist against minorities. Does that have anything to do with the beliefs of some Deputy in a small Oklahoma town? Nope. They just aren't the same people, but they are both COPS. Same thing is happening with Pike in comparison to other Freemasons.There's plenty of Christian Masons and Muslim Masons who would disagree with his ideas and spiritual beliefs.



ah not even close brother. Hebrew was still being rediscovered during the time of King James. Where did you get that info?



See above my friend.

EDIT: Ugh! I promise that I didn't purposely quote you twice Jay. For some reason, the html is doing it automatically no matter how many times I attempt to fix it haha.

i agree not every mason is behind the beliefs of pike. the masons are no different than many other organizations, the masses are normal and the leadership is corrupt, sometimes downright evil. this thread had to do with pike as a leader among other leaders, not pike and the masons. the point i was making is i believe we have many global leaders that have evil goals, pike was just one of many. hope that makes sense.

 

[Elysian]

And anyone who digs deeper than youtube knows that Freemasons think Albert Pike was looney
I have yet to hear from a credible source that Freemasons are evil. It's all crazy evangelical sites that also talk about how KJV is the only REAL Bible version and how Pokemon is an idea spawned from the deepest, darkest pits of hell.

What makes you want to believe this''Albert Pike's a looney'' rubbish?.Read through the degrees or are you that gullible you would really believe masons think Pike was a looney?, he's a liability to them, that's what he is (it's called damage control) and it's the exact same tactic the Watchtower used to avert liability from themselves when they started to get on the nose a while back -they blamed poor old CT Russell,their founder,the oldest trick in the book - dead men tell no tales.

Here we go again another KJV 1611 basher, please leave the holy bible alone because it's clear you don't have a clue what you are talking about.Every evangelical site I have ever seen who supports the KJV have been truly Christian and far from crazy as you and your world likes to call them

I have heard from credible sources that Freemasonry is evil and I have heard this from ex masons also.Do the Freemasons believe Jesus Christ is king?,Do they believe he was God in the flesh?,do they believe he died for our sins and was resurrected in the flesh?,do they believe he will return? If they answer no to any of these questions then they are surely evil.

 

[RussellJBenigno]

I don't remember reading anywhere that Noah, the Prophets, Moses, Jesus, Peter or Paul used the KJV 1611. Isn't that strange they didn't. How in the world did God ever speak to them? Maybe God didn't speak to them because they didn't have the KJV 1611. HHhhmmmmm!

 

[Bushido8000]

Here we go again another KJV 1611 basher, please leave the holy bible alone because it's clear you don't have a clue what you are talking about....Do the Freemasons believe Jesus Christ is king?,Do they believe he was God in the flesh?,do they believe he died for our sins and was resurrected in the flesh?,do they believe he will return? If they answer no to any of these questions then they are surely evil.

I can only love you Elysian!!!!!

 

[Brainfreeze]

You seem to have acquired the idea that Masons are in agreement when each other's spiritual beliefs and political views. That isn't even close. Pike was a high ranking MASON, this has nothing to do with his spiritual/political beliefs. That's like the NYPD Chief saying something racist against minorities. Does that have anything to do with the beliefs of some Deputy in a small Oklahoma town? Nope. They just aren't the same people, but they are both COPS. Same thing is happening with Pike in comparison to other Freemasons.There's plenty of Christian Masons and Muslim Masons who would disagree with his ideas and spiritual beliefs.

References to the construction of King Solomon's temple at Jerusalem have been included in the rituals of the operative freemasons since ancient times. In operative lodges the layout of the lodge room in each of the several degrees symbolises either a stoneyard or the temple building at one of the various stages of construction. As he participates in each of the several degrees, the candidate progressively represents the various types of stone used in the building, until ultimately he represents the plan of the temple.

The ceremonial for each degree is based on the preparation and usage of the relevant stone during construction and ultimately on the application of the plan to achieve completion of the temple. The way in which a stone is prepared by a stonemason in the stoneyard and utilised by fitters and erectors on the building site, in conjunction with the application of the plans and gauges, is used to illustrate how an individual should prepare himself for the life hereafter. The moral lessons imparted are also illustrated by the application of the various working tools used at the various stages of the work, not only in the shaping, testing, fitting and marking of the stones, but also during erection on the site. Many aspects of the operative ceremonials and catechisms have been included in the rituals of speculative freemasonry, though in a very abbreviated form.





ah not even close brother. Hebrew was still being rediscovered during the time of King James. Where did you get that info?


Well I will stay with the Tyndale version, rediscovered? ...what version do you use ?


See above my friend.

EDIT: Ugh! I promise that I didn't purposely quote you twice Jay. For some reason, the html is doing it automatically no matter how many times I attempt to fix it haha.

Bold.......

 

[Bushido8000]

References to the construction of King Solomon's temple at Jerusalem have been included in the rituals of the operative freemasons since ancient times. In operative lodges the layout of the lodge room in each of the several degrees symbolises either a stoneyard or the temple building at one of the various stages of construction. As he participates in each of the several degrees, the candidate progressively represents the various types of stone used in the building, until ultimately he represents the plan of the temple.

The ceremonial for each degree is based on the preparation and usage of the relevant stone during construction and ultimately on the application of the plan to achieve completion of the temple. The way in which a stone is prepared by a stonemason in the stoneyard and utilised by fitters and erectors on the building site, in conjunction with the application of the plans and gauges, is used to illustrate how an individual should prepare himself for the life hereafter. The moral lessons imparted are also illustrated by the application of the various working tools used at the various stages of the work, not only in the shaping, testing, fitting and marking of the stones, but also during erection on the site. Many aspects of the operative ceremonials and catechisms have been included in the rituals of speculative freemasonry, though in a very abbreviated form.

Exactly. Not spiritual in the slightest. Using symbolism of masonry to build the Temple as a metaphor for using the philosophies of Freemasonry to build a moral, upstanding foundation as a man.

Well I will stay with the Tyndale version, rediscovered? ...what version do you use ?

Yeah, up until fairly recently, Hebrew was a "lost" language. It's only been through recent (relatively speaking) archaeological finds and whatnot that we have regained the ability to properly speak and translate Hebrew (for the most part. Some things are still lost in translation like the proper pronunciation of YHWH's name).

The gold standard for most seminary schools is the American Standard Version (because of accuracy). I like the ESV myself as it remains fairly accurate to other solid translations while still being easy to read and comprehend. Also, "accuracy" is a VERY relative term when talking about translation. Especially when it comes to Hebrew.

 

[Brainfreeze]

Exactly. Not spiritual in the slightest. Using symbolism of masonry to build the Temple as a metaphor for using the philosophies of Freemasonry to build a moral, upstanding foundation as a man.





it's spiritual ... Why use king solomons temple " metaphorically " for ritual ? Then to listen to pike, it aligns with this type of rhetoric. Then factor in all the " mystic " type of stuff associated with solomon, " the keys of solomon " and so fourth, ...occultic. lifting up solomon seems weird in itself be it that, he disobeyed God.





Yeah, up until fairly recently, Hebrew was a "lost" language. It's only been through recent (relatively speaking) archaeological finds and whatnot that we have regained the ability to properly speak and translate Hebrew (for the most part. Some things are still lost in translation like the proper pronunciation of YHWH's name).

The gold standard for most seminary schools is the American Standard Version (because of accuracy). I like the ESV myself as it remains fairly accurate to other solid translations while still being easy to read and comprehend. Also, "accuracy" is a VERY relative term when talking about translation. Especially when it comes to Hebrew.

If you want to use something that's constantly being changed word for word...up to you. I like kjv, and if I want to search other translations of words for in depth description or study, I do... But kjv has always been fine for me. Did Jesus speak ancient hebrew or Aramaic ? ...

Bold......

 

[Moab]

I have a copy of Morals and Dogma by Albert Pike and yes, he was a looney tune, but not in his own mind. It is also interesting that very high ranking government officials are noted as 33rd degree Masons......Presidents, Supreme court justices, Generals, etc. Another thing is that no one seems to know just how one achieves the 33rd degree. There are lifelong members who never achieve anything closer that a twenty something degree, they want to and do everything they deem necessary to achieve it, but for one reason or another, they do not. I am not a member of the Masons, but I was close to one who was and inherited the book from him after his death. Lucifer is an equal to God in their eyes even though they do not know the difference, for they are steeped in Masonry and lacking knowledge of the word of God.

 

[jaybird88]

why do so many think pike was a loony toon crazy psycho? i think there is a big difference between crazy and evil. if you met a dark evil person what do you think their spiritual beliefs would be like?

 

[Elysian]

I have a copy of Morals and Dogma by Albert Pike and yes, he was a looney tune, but not in his own mind. It is also interesting that very high ranking government officials are noted as 33rd degree Masons......Presidents, Supreme court justices, Generals, etc. Another thing is that no one seems to know just how one achieves the 33rd degree. There are lifelong members who never achieve anything closer that a twenty something degree, they want to and do everything they deem necessary to achieve it, but for one reason or another, they do not. I am not a member of the Masons, but I was close to one who was and inherited the book from him after his death. Lucifer is an equal to God in their eyes even though they do not know the difference, for they are steeped in Masonry and lacking knowledge of the word of God.

It was no just Albert pike who was looney tune,there was Foster Bailey and to be honest the whole cult is looney tune.

 

[Elysian]

why do so many think pike was a loony toon crazy psycho? i think there is a big difference between crazy and evil. if you met a dark evil person what do you think their spiritual beliefs would be like?

Pike was most likely evil/crazy. Evil literally mens twisted. It is evil to deny Christ and it is evil to sin.The Puritans called sin a form of madness and I absolutely agree with them.
It is my opinion Pike was most likely a practicing Satanist as Freemasonry and organized Satanism are intricately entwined and every single high level Satanists, bar none have emerged from masonry. I believe all saved people can clearly see the problem with masonry when educated on it,it's ones who don't I worry about.

 

[Bushido8000]

Bold......

Brainfreeze you're killing me with your response format man, haha it's ok though.

for your first bolded response, Solomon's Temple is used because supposedly Freemasons can trace back their origins to the Masons who built Solomon's temple. There's nothing "mystical" about it. Supposedly the secrets that the Masons have has to do a lot with geometry. If you ask most Freemasons, geometry is a very big deal to them.

For your second response:

ASV and ESV are not being constantly changed word for word, they were written at a time when Hebrew was better understood. It doesn't matter if Jesus spoke German. The Holy Bible is written in ancient Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek. The reason why KJV only people get knocked so hard is because of the cult-like mentality. Anyone who doesn't read the KJV is automatically reading inferior Bibles and HATES the KJV. Where in the WORLD does that mentality come from? I'm not bad-mouthing the KJV in anyway and it's totally fine that you read and perfectly comprehend Old English. You can even believe that KJV can be the "inspired" version of the Bible (even though it was the 2nd version to be translated in English). But why....why must there be a huge argument every time someone doesn't read the KJV. And this isn't just for you. This is for all KJV only people.

 

[Brainfreeze]

Brainfreeze you're killing me with your response format man, haha it's ok though.

You comprehend what I'm writing, that's what's necessary. I'm not an English major... Sorry.

for your first bolded response, Solomon's Temple is used because supposedly Freemasons can trace back their origins to the Masons who built Solomon's temple. There's nothing "mystical" about it. Supposedly the secrets that the Masons have has to do a lot with geometry. If you ask most Freemasons, geometry is a very big deal to them.

I know they like geometry, " sacred geometry " and so fourth, so does satan... Why do they draw pentagrams and have to do elaborate things to summon spirits ? The keys of solomon is about doing just that. Weren't the ones who built solomons temple mostly the men of the king in Tyre ? Why would they identify with the temple ? Your explanations seem to simple ...like your playing ignorant. I doubt your a 33rd degree mason so we will never know about it, but out of pikes book seems pretty self explanatory ..


For your second response:

ASV and ESV are not being constantly changed word for word, they were written at a time when Hebrew was better understood. It doesn't matter if Jesus spoke German. The Holy Bible is written in ancient Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek. The reason why KJV only people get knocked so hard is because of the cult-like mentality. Anyone who doesn't read the KJV is automatically reading inferior Bibles and HATES the KJV. Where in the WORLD does that mentality come from? I'm not bad-mouthing the KJV in anyway and it's totally fine that you read and perfectly comprehend Old English. You can even believe that KJV can be the "inspired" version of the Bible (even though it was the 2nd version to be translated in English). But why....why must there be a huge argument every time someone doesn't read the KJV. And this isn't just for you. This is for all KJV only people

Ok ...so, Jesus didn't speak ancient hebrew, that's understood. I like kjv because I believe it to be the closest translation to the original but I'm not a kjv only person, I sometime will use the NIV version to get a more simple read, and mostly crossing it over the kjv for a better understanding ...so you got me wrong, not only kjv.


.

Bold......

 

[Brainfreeze]

It is a sufficient argument with which to refute those who think they believe in no God, that it is simply impossible that the Moral Sense could originate in or be produced by any combination of material atoms, or by the action or interaction of any conceivable forces of matter. To create a Moral Law, or a single tenet of it, there must be a superior Will to enact it.

-albert pike

Masonic Dictionary | Atheist | www.masonicdictionary.com

this is straight out of the masonic dictionary, updated from recent... So to say his thoughts don't exists in today's " order " is bogus.

 

[GaryA]

I think it would be closest to the truth to say that Albert Pike is "highly revered" / "highly regarded" in the Masonic Order.

 

[tanach]

The dualist God belief is the main belief in the Zoroastrian religion which apart from this has a number of beliefs akin to
Judaism. It was the main religion in Persia for centuries prior to Islam. It is now practiced in India and its followers are known as Parsees

 

[jaybird88]

for anyone that thinks pike was just a nutter or only big in free mason circles, washington dc has a statue of him in front of the police dept, and little rock arkansas has a street named after him.

 

[WarriorHadassah]

Great Topic! One day I was walking downtown, I was studying about Albert Pike the day before and I turned to right in the window was the Albert Pike Covenant with an eagle. I see the symbols every day in my town of Mason order and there are churches part of this madness.

 

[jaybird88]

Great Topic! One day I was walking downtown, I was studying about Albert Pike the day before and I turned to right in the window was the Albert Pike Covenant with an eagle. I see the symbols every day in my town of Mason order and there are churches part of this madness.

glad you like WH. my point of this topic. is to bring awareness of these things. pike is just one small example of many evil things that surround us everywhere yet so many choose to ignore.
we should not ignore these things. our bible commands us to test all things, how are we to do this when we chose to ignore the matters at hand that need to be tested. if Satan and his demons really are out to get us would it not be better to have some knowledge and not need it than to not have the knowledge and need it.

 

[Dude653]

Well, their symbol is a pentagram, which represents a goat's head, which represents Lucifer