How to Spot a Legalist

[KennethC]

Hit a nerve did he? Good. What's better to "feel" loved or to actually be loved? Was Jesus ever less than loving? And yet no one has said anything approaching the "loving" words Jesus used when speaking to the legalists of His day.

That is because Jesus did not condemn the law being taught, He called the Pharisees hypocrites and vipers because they corrupted the law for self gain and recognition and would not lift a finger to help others out to keep them from transgressing.

He did not rebuke the Pharisees for giving the law, but for misusing it for self means !!!

 

[BenFTW]

Oh no, it is literal if that is the path some want to try and take

Here crossnote goes again, trying to get people to mutilate themselves. *Gets a first aid kit ready* lol

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I will ask again as I did earlier can you be saved before receiving the Holy Spirit ?

If you say yes then you have people who are not born again already saved, but Jesus said those who are not born again and who have not repented of their sins will not inherit the kingdom of heaven.

The scripture from Acts 5:32 clearly shows obedience comes before the Holy Spirit is given, as that obedience comes from after faith has been established from hearing the word and trusting in what it says to repent and get baptized in His name.
Then you will receive the Holy Spirit.....(Acts 2:38, 3:19, 19:2-6)


Lord Jesus teaching and commands are the perfect law of liberty that Paul and James are both speaking on !!!





You still are focusing on the physical ordinance of the law which is taking your focus off the Spiritual meaning of what is being said there by Jesus. The actually meaning here by the Lord was the importance of removing sin from your life and the obstacles that would cause us to stumble, NOT about actually cutting hands off or plucking out eyes.

If Jesus ways are tougher then Moses then how come the Word of God says the opposite, that they are easy and not burdensome ??? Because we have the Holy Spirit in us to help keep us in those teachings !!!

Just like a couple others you do the same as them and speak like the disciples/Apostles before they were born again in Matthew 19:25. The Apostles thought the same way as you when they heard this straight form the mouth of Jesus Himself personally, but they soon realized at Pentecost that those things are not impossible !!!

so when are you going to repent and trust God and stop trusting in your ability to follow some law (be in NT law or OT law does not matter.

 

[just-me]

Hit a nerve did he? Good. What's better to "feel" loved or to actually be loved? Was Jesus ever less than loving? And yet no one has said anything approaching the "loving" words Jesus used when speaking to the legalists of His day.

The Pharisees were legalists, and Jesus told them to do it right, but He didn't say to forsake the the law, as the person that started this thread is trying to teach. Jesus told the Pharisees to observe what the law was REALLY all about in truth. Reject this truth and reject grace simultaneously. Grace is not an adversary of the truth in the law of God. You actually think that there are 2 different God's, One that gives grace, and the other that gives the law? Get real!!!

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. Matthew 23:23

Those that reject even a jot or tittle of the law are just as hypocritical as the Pharisees that Jesus confronted. This is truth, and we will like it or hate it.

If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. John 15:18

 

[Brother_Don]

Cold? lukewarm? hot? remember what is said about lukewarm, its better to be cold than lukewarm, as its better to be hot than lukewarm. Talking in circles causes confusion.

 

[FreeNChrist]

I do not believe that is taught anywhere in the Holy Scripture.

However it does declare in Romans that faith establishes the law. Now, what is establishes is not destroyed.

Faith in Jesus Christ is righteousness, and righteousness is considered works, for faith leads to good works, however it is taught nowhere tht faith allows for disobedience at any level and sin is disobedience..

Then you do not know your Bible.


Romans 1:5
through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith among all the Gentiles for His name’s sake,

Romans 16:26
but now is manifested, and by the Scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the eternal God, has been made known to all the nations, leading to obedience of faith

 

[JaumeJ]

May God have mercy on you for your mindless allegations. First, no one here is a legalist. Second no one here believe they can do anything regarding saving themselves.

Who are you to call me a legalist, or accuse me of such blasphemy¿ You and I are nothing, so do ot judge another man's servant, for I am s slave of God, Who is Love..........there is not punishment for any who believe Jesus Christ. Do not call children of obedience sinners, for what you have states is doing just that .......good bye, and I will pray for your soul.

The problem you ALL do not realize.

Is us grace poeple will defend obedience also. It is just you legalists trying to do it by mans own power. and not by Gods power prevent us from doing so. because we have to keep protecting people by proving to the world the legalistic was is not a way which will empower us, but will destroys us. And make us think we are more righteous than we really are.

 

[FreeNChrist]

The Pharisees were legalists, and Jesus told them to do it right, but He didn't say to forsake the the law, as the person that started this thread is trying to teach. Jesus told the Pharisees to observe what the law was REALLY all about in truth. Reject this truth and reject grace simultaneously. Grace is not an adversary of the truth in the law of God. You actually think that there are 2 different God's, One that gives grace, and the other that gives the law? Get real!!!

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. Matthew 23:23

Those that reject even a jot or tittle of the law are just as hypocritical as the Pharisees that Jesus confronted. This is truth, and we will like it or hate it.

If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. John 15:18

Indeed. If you want to be under the Law, you are under all of it. No slicing and dicing allowed.

 

[crossnote]

You still are focusing on the physical ordinance of the law which is taking your focus off the Spiritual meaning of what is being said there by Jesus. The actually meaning here by the Lord was the importance of removing sin from your life and the obstacles that would cause us to stumble, NOT about actually cutting hands off or plucking out eyes.

If Jesus ways are tougher then Moses then how come the Word of God says the opposite, that they are easy and not burdensome ??? Because we have the Holy Spirit in us to help keep us in those teachings !!!

Just like a couple others you do the same as them and speak like the disciples/Apostles before they were born again in Matthew 19:25. The Apostles thought the same way as you when they heard this straight form the mouth of Jesus Himself personally, but they soon realized at Pentecost that those things are not impossible !!!

No. Jesus exposed our sinful hearts by revealing the true intent of the Law. You fail to see and admit that Jesus' commandments were tougher than Moses' because it dashes your delusion that you are keeping them.

Romans 5:19-21 (KJV)
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
20 Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound:
21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

 

[KennethC]

Correcting error is not fighting.

It is when you use unedifying and demeaning tactic's along with your opinions on what you think scripture says.

That is not at all the way the bible shows for the proper way of rebuking and reproving a brother or sister in error, and on top of that it specifically says to exhort and esteem them after the rebuking and reproving.

If you are not following that standard as laid out in the Word of God you are just wrongfully judging and falsely accusing the brethren. The bible says that way of thinking comes from a spirit but not the Holy Spirit !!!

 

[FreeNChrist]

That is because Jesus did not condemn the law being taught, He called the Pharisees hypocrites and vipers because they corrupted the law for self gain and recognition and would not lift a finger to help others out to keep them from transgressing.

He did not rebuke the Pharisees for giving the law, but for misusing it for self means !!!

Which is what all legalists do.

 

[FreeNChrist]

It is when you use unedifying and demeaning tactic's along with your opinions on what you think scripture says.

That is not at all the way the bible shows for the proper way of rebuking and reproving a brother or sister in error, and on top of that it specifically says to exhort and esteem them after the rebuking and reproving.

If you are not following that standard as laid out in the Word of God you are just wrongfully judging and falsely accusing the brethren. The bible says that way of thinking comes from a spirit but not the Holy Spirit !!!

Thats the way you see every correction, which has more to do with you than anyone else.

 

[crossnote]

Here crossnote goes again, trying to get people to mutilate themselves. *Gets a first aid kit ready* lol

No, I'd rather them take the path of grace not law.

 

[KennethC]

Which is what all legalists do.

Yet you still believe one who teaches to keep Jesus teachings and commandments are a legalist !!!

That is not a legalist my brother and is far from it, and you will not find one scripture in the NT that states we do not have to keep and obey His teachings from the gospel books !!!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

May God have mercy on you for your mindless allegations. First, no one here is a legalist. Second no one here believe they can do anything regarding saving themselves.

First off. Don;t call me mindless when you state no one here is a legalist. when this room is full of legalism.
Second, God has my soul, you do not have to worry about it.

Who are you to call me a legalist, or accuse me of such blasphemy¿ You and I are nothing, so do ot judge another man's servant, for I am s slave of God, Who is Love..........there is not punishment for any who believe Jesus Christ. Do not call children of obedience sinners, for what you have states is doing just that .......good bye, and I will pray for your soul.

Dude, You condemn things you do not know. If you do not want to get called out. Then speak the truth, You know (if you really thought about it) that we who believe in the grace of God can not have a room to speak on obedience, because we have to many people telling us our eternal life is dependent on obedience, and not on the cross. That the law is powered by the law. When Jesus himself said it is not that way, that Love empowers us to fulfill the law.

People get sick of being told they love sin, and do not care about obedience, when it is nothing but a strawman from a legalist to excuse their own legalism.

If your going to stand up for them, You are going to be judged just like them!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Which is what all legalists do.

a legalist who does not see he does the very thing the legalist in jesus time were chastened for.

How ironic is that!!

 

[JaumeJ]

Your personal interpretation does not justify your allegations against teh children of obedience. Truth includes all of our Father's will. It is an unhappy state when brethren acuse those who believe in being children of obedience somethng called legalists, and people who "do" things to assure their salvation. My salvation is assured by the Lamb of God, but this grace does not allow for deliberately turning back to a life of disobedience for this is tramping the Blood of the Lam o God.

Now, I have never, not here nor elsewhere in the forum stated anyone obey anything other than what is taught by Jesus Christ, and how He teaches it.

You are not required to go back through my years of posting, but you are required not to jude other in this regard.

Do you know anything about what anyone here whom you have labeled "legalists" believe? I think not, otherwise you would not be on this rant.

We all believe we are saved only by the Blood of the Lamb. We all the Writings ae all valid, as Çrossnote implied, all of the Bible is true, so why do you find fault with fellow servants? I know, when we say we should do works worthy of our Salvation, and obey God as best we are able, this bothers you. It is better ot over-obey then to teach the brethren to sin.

Then you do not know your Bible.


Romans 1:5
through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith among all the Gentiles for His name’s sake,

Romans 16:26
but now is manifested, and by the Scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the eternal God, has been made known to all the nations, leading to obedience of faith

 

[KennethC]

Thats the way you see every correction, which has more to do with you than anyone else.

From certain people that I have on ignore, and from you just the other day yes that got you close to being put on ignore !!!

That is not my opinion FreeNChrist that is exactly how the bible says we are to handle others in error and walking in a sinful way. Reprove + rebuke + exhort + esteem.

If you don't use all of those steps then you are just being judgmental and falsely accusing !!!

Notice you said correction and that is where the exhortation and esteeming comes from, not the rebuking and reproving as that is the half to expose the error. Nowhere does it give us the right to be demeaning and belittling in the correction process !!!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Thats the way you see every correction, which has more to do with you than anyone else.

Amen, Like the Pharisee, A legalist who is all about self does not handle correction very well. They come out swinging.

then wonder why everyone treats them the way they do.

 

[BenFTW]

Cold? lukewarm? hot? remember what is said about lukewarm, its better to be cold than lukewarm, as its better to be hot than lukewarm. Talking in circles causes confusion.

Yes, cold being Law and hot being Grace. The combination of the two being lukewarm and nullifies the two. At least if you are under Law you can be lead to Jesus, in that way it is better to be one or the other. Much better however to be hot (in grace).