Can you direct me to the scripture naming the Bible, "The Bible" or maybe the trinity God? 
I don't find it but we know it is so...
I don't find it
but we know it is so...
Our Kingdom to Come
- Thread starter JaumeJ
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Words are cheap. Jaume failed at it, maybe you can direct me to at least the concept that teaches the Kingdom is the Spiritual Israel? I just don't agree with Jaume's sloppy theology.
The Bible is clear that there are only three groups of people, Judah (the Jews), Israel (Gentiles grafted into the olive tree/spiritual Israel) and the dogs (Gentiles out of covenant). We should decide where we fit in
Neither Abraham, Isaac or Jacob were Jews. All three were Hebrews. Jew simply means Judean, which is a term that encompasses a tribe, a religion, and a geographic area.
I'm not clear on the concept of spiritual promise vs. physical promise. Please elaborate. After GOD promised the land to Isaac, he said he would establish to him his oath that he made to Abraham. So that encompasses something else.
Sojourn in this land, and I will be with you and bless you; for I will give to you and to your seed all this land. And I will establish my oath which I swore to your father Abram; and I will multiply your seed as the stars of heaven. And I will give all this land to your seed; and all the nations of the land will be blessed in your seed. Genesis 26:3
I'm not clear on the concept of spiritual promise vs. physical promise. Please elaborate. After GOD promised the land to Isaac, he said he would establish to him his oath that he made to Abraham. So that encompasses something else.
Sojourn in this land, and I will be with you and bless you; for I will give to you and to your seed all this land. And I will establish my oath which I swore to your father Abram; and I will multiply your seed as the stars of heaven. And I will give all this land to your seed; and all the nations of the land will be blessed in your seed. Genesis 26:3
Friend I am not going to argue over this as we all read the Bible differently. I will tell you what I understand but I am not going to be drawn into a long argument over this
There is no one verse telling us that the Gentiles are Israel but when we put the verses together that is what I believe.
The only material I have on this matter is in Afrikaans but 119 Ministries have a good English explanation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aeQr1tD1rtI
[h=4]Justin Martyr said the following:[/h]Jesus Christ ... is the new law, and the new covenant, and the expectation of those who out of every people wait for the good things of God. For the true spiritual Israel, and the descendants of Judah, Jacob, Isaac, and Abraham (who in uncircumcision was approved of and blessed by God on account of his faith, and called the father of many nations), are we who have been led to God through this crucified Christ
There is no one verse telling us that the Gentiles are Israel but when we put the verses together that is what I believe.
The only material I have on this matter is in Afrikaans but 119 Ministries have a good English explanation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aeQr1tD1rtI
[h=4]Justin Martyr said the following:[/h]Jesus Christ ... is the new law, and the new covenant, and the expectation of those who out of every people wait for the good things of God. For the true spiritual Israel, and the descendants of Judah, Jacob, Isaac, and Abraham (who in uncircumcision was approved of and blessed by God on account of his faith, and called the father of many nations), are we who have been led to God through this crucified Christ
Friend I am not going to argue over this as we all read the Bible differently. I will tell you what I understand but I am not going to be drawn into a long argument over this
There is no one verse telling us that the Gentiles are Israel but when we put the verses together that is what I believe.
The only material I have on this matter is in Afrikaans but 119 Ministries have a good English explanation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aeQr1tD1rtI
Justin Martyr said the following:
Jesus Christ ... is the new law, and the new covenant, and the expectation of those who out of every people wait for the good things of God. For the true spiritual Israel, and the descendants of Judah, Jacob, Isaac, and Abraham (who in uncircumcision was approved of and blessed by God on account of his faith, and called the father of many nations), are we who have been led to God through this crucified Christ
There is no one verse telling us that the Gentiles are Israel but when we put the verses together that is what I believe.
The only material I have on this matter is in Afrikaans but 119 Ministries have a good English explanation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aeQr1tD1rtI
Justin Martyr said the following:
Jesus Christ ... is the new law, and the new covenant, and the expectation of those who out of every people wait for the good things of God. For the true spiritual Israel, and the descendants of Judah, Jacob, Isaac, and Abraham (who in uncircumcision was approved of and blessed by God on account of his faith, and called the father of many nations), are we who have been led to God through this crucified Christ
E
When God gave this promise to abraham, he said it was an eternal covenant
Gen 17: [SUP]7 [/SUP]And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you. [SUP]8 [/SUP]Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.”
This was a physical covenant between abraham and his offspring It is still valid today, God never made a provision in which he would take that land back and it would never be there's again (although he later made a provision on whether they would live in peace in it, or live as slaves, or be cast out until the repent)
There is nothig spiritual in this part of the Abraham covenant.
Gen 17: [SUP]7 [/SUP]And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you. [SUP]8 [/SUP]Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.”
This was a physical covenant between abraham and his offspring It is still valid today, God never made a provision in which he would take that land back and it would never be there's again (although he later made a provision on whether they would live in peace in it, or live as slaves, or be cast out until the repent)
There is nothig spiritual in this part of the Abraham covenant.
E
Friend I am not going to argue over this as we all read the Bible differently. I will tell you what I understand but I am not going to be drawn into a long argument over this
There is no one verse telling us that the Gentiles are Israel but when we put the verses together that is what I believe.
The only material I have on this matter is in Afrikaans but 119 Ministries have a good English explanation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aeQr1tD1rtI
Justin Martyr said the following:
Jesus Christ ... is the new law, and the new covenant, and the expectation of those who out of every people wait for the good things of God. For the true spiritual Israel, and the descendants of Judah, Jacob, Isaac, and Abraham (who in uncircumcision was approved of and blessed by God on account of his faith, and called the father of many nations), are we who have been led to God through this crucified Christ
There is no one verse telling us that the Gentiles are Israel but when we put the verses together that is what I believe.
The only material I have on this matter is in Afrikaans but 119 Ministries have a good English explanation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aeQr1tD1rtI
Justin Martyr said the following:
Jesus Christ ... is the new law, and the new covenant, and the expectation of those who out of every people wait for the good things of God. For the true spiritual Israel, and the descendants of Judah, Jacob, Isaac, and Abraham (who in uncircumcision was approved of and blessed by God on account of his faith, and called the father of many nations), are we who have been led to God through this crucified Christ
it can be good to share our beliefs though.. As you did yours.
As far as I see it, As your quote says, Abraham became the father of many nations. I happen to be part of those many nations. Not the one nation (israel) who were given promises I will never have access too (the physical promises of Israel).
The word eternal (olam) simply means beyond the vanishing point. It doesn't necessarily mean unending. The land was promised unconditionally only to Christ (Galatians 3:16). The promise to Abraham's other descendents was later made conditional: they were allowed to possess the land under the sole condition that they were obedient. The land now belongs to Christ.
E
No No No. While I agree it will one day end (as it will one day no longer exist) it was given to descendents (plural) not descendent (singular)
the church did not replace isreal. and it was not a spiritual promise.
Gal 3 is speaking of the eternal covenant, In you shall all the nations be blessed. It is separating the land promise, which never saved anyone, with the eternal promise, which is through Christ. The SEED.
1. The land always belonged to Christ, He is the one who gave it to isreal (pre0incarnat Christ that is)
2. The only condition is to whether they will actually live in it or not. The were never a condition where it would never be theres again, In fact, The same pre-incarnat Christ tells them in lev 26, If they repent, he will remember his promise and restor them in the land.. That is still applicable today as it was 4000 years ago. Gods promises never fade or go away, If they do or can, we are in serious trouble.