Are the people who drowned in the flood of Noah doomed forever?
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Yes.
Are they lost forever? or did they go to hell?
Will they get another chance to repent?
Was the message of Noah their gospel and their final chance to repent?
Are they lost forever? or did they go to hell?
Will they get another chance to repent?
Was the message of Noah their gospel and their final chance to repent?
S
Stranger36147
Guest
Very interesting question!
1Tim 2v4-6 states: "who doth will all men to be saved, and to come to the full knowledge of the truth; for one [is] God, one also [is] mediator of God and of men, the man Christ Jesus, who did give himself a ransom for all — the testimony in its own times —" [YLT]
with
2Pet 3v9: "The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance."
The Scriptues teach that Christ died for ALL, so ALL must hear it, and if the Church fails in its responsibility (which it has done miserably in just about every generation) to preach the Gospel (in full power and glory as Christ and the early Church did), so that ALL hear it, then God will make sure that those who have NOT heard it WILL hear it, because of His GREAT love for them (and this really can only be after death). John 3v16, Rom 5v8
The inhabitants of the earth in Noah's day have already had to Gospel preached to them when Christ spent 3 days and 3 nights in Hades after His crucifixion, whether or not they accepted the truth is another matter. Acts 2v23-31, Rom 10v7, 1Peter 3v18-20, 4v6, See Here
Yahweh Shalom
T
Tintin
Guest
[SUP]5 [/SUP]The Lord saw that the wickedness of humankind was great in the earth, and that every inclination of the thoughts of their hearts was only evil continually. [SUP]6 [/SUP]And the Lord was sorry that he had made humankind on the earth, and it grieved him to his heart. [SUP]7 [/SUP]So the Lord said, “I will blot out from the earth the human beings I have created—people together with animals and creeping things and birds of the air, for I am sorry that I have made them.” [SUP]8 [/SUP]But Noah found favor in the sight of the Lord.
Genesis 6:5-8 would seem to suggest that those who died in the Flood were all lost.
Genesis 6:5-8 would seem to suggest that those who died in the Flood were all lost.
I think your question derives from verses in one of Peter's epistles, that IMO have a questionable translation that makes it appear that those people did have the opportunity to repent after death.
P
P1LGR1M
Guest
There is no reason to conclude that all who died in the Flood will be eternally separted from God.
We must remember that in the Old Testament we have a very literal imposing of physical death for those who sin (and that is still in effect today).
Consider the babes in the womb, the newborns, and the young children, would we think they will be eternally separated from God? God has every right to, but, the fact of the matter is that even for those listed in the "Hall of Faith (Hebrews 11), we see that God's grace was and had to be bestowed to them as well.
The reconciliation is therefore understanding the Biblical Doctrine of Grace, which is bestowed to men prior to the Cross. David, for example, was a great candidate for Hell, being a lying adulterous murderer, yet he died at peace with God, believing in his heart that he would be reunited with the child that died.
And we better pay attention to Prophets, right? lol
So this is what I would suggest: God has and always will judge men according to their response to the revelation He provides them. We see this principle taught by Paul, so let's consider what he is saying:
Romans 1:18-21
King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]18 [/SUP]For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
[SUP]21 [/SUP]Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
No commentary needed, right?
Now let's get specific concerning whether those who have not received direct revelation (from the Prophets or the Word of God):
Romans 2:9-15
King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP]Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
[SUP]10 [/SUP]But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:
[SUP]11 [/SUP]For there is no respect of persons with God.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;
[SUP]13 [/SUP](For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
[SUP]15 [/SUP]Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another)
Again, no commentary needed.
So in regards to the OP, we can conclude that it is reasonable that those who had not the ability to understand the three types of revelation God provides all men (the internal witness, the testimony of Creation, and direct revelation (the Word of God through Prophets or Scripture)), w can safely assume that the grace bestowed to every Old Testament Saint who did sin against God directly in violation of the revelation they had...would be bestowed upon babes in the womb and young children, not to mention the mentally infirm.
So we can speculate that they were not resigned to eternal separation from, God.
Then we consider that while God destroyed all men and women, we will still see a principle of judgment in regards to their response to the revelation they were provided which could cause us to expect grace in that judgment.
I would not be dogmatic about the adults, but, I think that there will be those who forfeited their lives through sin, though perhaps not on an eternal basis, but, as most Old Testament teachings are, on a physical level.
Paul wrote of the deaths of believers here:
1 Corinthians 11:26-30
King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]26 [/SUP]For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come.
[SUP]27 [/SUP]Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.
[SUP]28 [/SUP]But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.
[SUP]29 [/SUP]For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.
[SUP]30 [/SUP]For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.
While it could be argued those who partake unworthily are unbelievers, I take the position that this speaks of God's children in sin, and that there is a line where the sinning Christian can lose his life.
The wages of sin is death, and that will never change. But, the grace of God extends to those worthy of death, and we can find many examples of sinning believers who were not cast away, though they sinned.
The grace of God is a consistent theme throughout Scripture, and for the person that thinks that on a temporal level they have earned salvation through grace, I would remind them that salvation is wholly of Holy God, and that salvation is a gift.
God bless.
I think that the answer must be that we are not incontrovertibly told.
Heb 9:27
27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
KJV
This certainly suggests No Hope.
Eph 4:7-9
7 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ.
8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
KJV
But this offers a ray of hope.
Heb 9:27
27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
KJV
This certainly suggests No Hope.
Eph 4:7-9
7 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ.
8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
KJV
But this offers a ray of hope.
If they were carried away with the flood,then they were wicked,so they are lost.On earth God would judge people,like the earth opening up and swallowing some of the Jews because of rebelliousness.If God judged them on earth then they were wicked,when they perished so they were lost.
But what if while the flood occurred some of the people caught in the flood repented of their sins before they perished in the flood,or was it too late once the flood occurred to repent because God's judgment was already set.
I believe that once God's judgment was set to bring the flood on them that it was too late to repent.When the world takes the mark and the wrath of God comes upon them it will be too late for them to repent.
"...it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment." Heb. 9:27
A
atwhatcost
Guest
To answer your question the people who drowned in the flood of Noah are doomed forever. They had many chances on earth to hear the gospel message and as for Jesus descending to Hades or hell that one verse that is used to say that he preached to them in hell was actually an inaccurate translation that plagued the NIV 1984. The newer NIV actually corrects this translation snafu. Still wished that Bible Gateway had kept the 1984 version. Sometimes I want to give them a piece of my mind.
I like the point you made about the three types of revelations.
Now,you are saying that although a believer may lose his life (by physical death) due to a particular sin, their life on the whole may not be worthy of hell, and that they stand a chance of being saved.
I believe that in the OT as well as the NT days, salvation comes through faith and by grace.
If those who died in the flood would have responded by faith, they would have found favor in God's eyes, just as Noah did. So the reason they died in the flood was that they had no faith.
I'm sure that God gave them enough chances to repent, but their sins were so great that God was sorry he had even created mankind, and he grieved in his heart. [Genesis 6:6]
So these were wicked and rebellious people.