Joyce Meyer's $23,000 Toilet

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Just noticed the toilet thread is still running.
Sometimes ya gotta jiggle the handle. Carry on...;)
 
sydlit said:
Just noticed the toilet thread is still running.
Sometimes ya gotta jiggle the handle. Carry on...;)
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Not only that sydlit., you can find that behind these threads on these boards that the discussion has turned out to be much more than the subject matter. :D
 
ladylynn said:
Not only that sydlit., you can find that behind these threads on these boards that the discussion has turned out to be much more than the subject matter. :D
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I suppose sometimes the overflow can spill out into other areas.
It can all be quite draining.;)
 
PeterJens said:
Dear reader, I spent many years talking to muslims, and found they felt they had the truth, and only if you agreed with them were you worthy of respect. As soon as you started talking love, mercy, forgiveness, they went all over the place.

The key issue was how they behaved and how they justified this behaviour. In their mind it was all justified by their theology though the behaviour was obviously selfish and polarised those who agreed with them as Gods chosen and those not, as satan.

The prosperity gospel follows the same agenda. The door that opens up to every spiritual influence is prophecy. A man stand in front of a group of christians and calls out words of knowledge about individuals and gives insights into what is going on. Then they slip in advice from dead prophets, who are praying for the church. Now do you notice their is little difference between this behaviour and psychics who are bringing messages from the dead.

Or take the messages about the angels who are bringing wealth, or gem stones, or feathers, or gold dust.
This is just a mad circus show, without content. What this leads to is saying you are extra blessed if these signs appear, not your lives expressing love and praise to each other and to the Lord.

The fruit of the spirit is simple. Helping widows and orphans, hands reaching out to the needy and those weak and unfortunate in the world. The apostles faced versions of the prosperity gospel and rejected it.

Now listen, you rich people, weep and wail because of the misery that is coming on you.
James 5:1

You say, ‘I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.’ But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked.
Rev 3:17

I counsel you to buy from me gold refined in the fire, so you can become rich; and white clothes to wear, so you can cover your shameful nakedness; and salve to put on your eyes, so you can see.
Rev 3:18

Already you have all you want! Already you have become rich! You have begun to reign—and that without us! ........
For it seems to me that God has put us apostles on display at the end of the procession, like those condemned to die in the arena. We have been made a spectacle to the whole universe, to angels as well as to human beings. We are fools for Christ, but you are so wise in Christ! We are weak, but you are strong! You are honored, we are dishonored! To this very hour we go hungry and thirsty, we are in rags, we are brutally treated, we are homeless. We work hard with our own hands. When we are cursed, we bless; when we are persecuted, we endure it; when we are slandered, we answer kindly. We have become the scum of the earth, the garbage of the world—right up to this moment.
1 Cor 4:8-13
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What has this to do with Joyce Meyers toilet?
 
ladylynn said:
Why jaybird do you allow yourself to be distracted by the Robert Schullers of the world? I have found it most joyous to set my eyes on Jesus instead of the world. Take direction from Him and learn from Him. He is our example. He is the Good Shepherd., we shall not want for anything because of Him. I care not what others do with their material wealth. They are not my example. We are called to follow Jesus the Author and Finisher of our faith.
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you call it distraction, i call it refusing to turn my back on corruption. i live in this world and my kids have to grow up in it, when our Lord created it it was good. do we teach our kids right and wrong or do we let them do what they want and hope for the best.
i agree and dont care about what others do with their wealth, but i do care when Christian leaders tell their followers, seek the Lord and you will get lots of money. i think its wrong. i dont think its leading people on the correct path to the Lord and if i am right then according to Jesus its no different than killing them.
these things are serious and they are destroying our world, turning a blind eye and letting evil dooers have free reign will only make it worse.

By your reasoning here in your post jaybird, we should shun all good things because there are people in the world who are dying and suffering. It is a fact of life that in the world there WILL BE and there IS tribulation., But Jesus said that HE has overcome the world.
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:D Our hope and security are IN JESUS. And it is our responsibility to look to Him and experience that the JOY of the LORD IS OUR STRENGTH., The Bible does not say the tribulations of the world are our strength. In fact, He warns us about tribulation in the world and not to be overcome with evil but to overcome evil with good.
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where did i say to shun all good things? i was trying to point out the bad things. are we not to "test all things'? our faith may be in Jesus, but does that mean we shut ouself in a box and ignore it all.
Jesus showed anger one time, the money changers in the temple.

We are to help those we come in contact with in need. To follow Christ's example of loving, giving and blessing others with the blessings He has blessed us with. Encourage with the encouragement we have been encouraged with. How can we bless others if we are so unblessed and uncared for? What do we have to offer a lost and dying world? We are told NOT to say to those in need... be blessed!!!!!! and then walk away doing nothing to help them. They not only need to hear about Jesus, they need to see Jesus in us.
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i agree with you
 
ember said:
so it's ok to lie and exaggerate ... THAT says plenty about you!

but you love everybody as you say....which is most likely difficult considering the griping and complaining lifestyle you have chosen to emulate
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I gripe and complain about apostasy..I thought that was a good thing.
 
Yet said:
I gripe and complain about apostasy..I thought that was a good thing.
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The issue of griping and complaining and finding fault with others is they very often might not be 'apostates' and when you gripe and complain wrongly against someone, you are judging them and accusing them.,and your views will be distorted. That is the problem with griping and complaining and finding fault. That is why we are exhorted not to judge one another.
 
I suggest the health wealth brigade put their faith into action and stop going to doctors, hospitals, dentists at all.

The truth is if there ideas were true all they have to do is believe, which they claim they do, to receive the healing.
Some go so far as to say if they admit they are ill when they are ill they are submitting to the illness.

But they are lying, they still go to doctors, hospitals, dentists, take medicine, wear glasses, brush their teeth, eat the right types of food etc. because they know it works and their faith does not. Now occasionally the Lord does heal, they get a gift of faith, pray and the person is healed, but still they claim it applies all the time while living as if this is not true.

That is called being sensible, but preaching a lie. The problem is if they lie to this degree, maybe the whole gospel is a lie, and christians are delusional idiots, living in fairy land. Do you see the problem? Do you see what is the issue with living a lie while claiming to have the truth?

You have no integrity yourself or with others and your faith becomes worthless, because you make God out to be a liar.

God promised with the preaching would come miracles, but not healing of everything and life would be success after success. We are playing a lifetime game and they are playing to destroy the faith in one generation.
 
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PeterJens said:
I suggest the health wealth brigade put their faith into action and stop going to doctors, hospitals, dentists at all.

The truth is if there ideas were true all they have to do is believe, which they claim they do, to receive the healing.
Some go so far as to say if they admit they are ill when they are ill they are submitting to the illness.

But they are lying, they still go to doctors, hospitals, dentists, take medicine, wear glasses, brush their teeth, eat the right types of food etc. because they know it works and their faith does not. Now occasionally the Lord does heal, they get a gift of faith, pray and the person is healed, but still they claim it applies all the time while living as if this is not true.
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i agree with you, does the bible not tell us to bring our sick to the church elders and pray? makes me sad that in todays world many mainstream Christians mock the Amish,mennonites etc for not going to doctors.

whats funny is in todays world (mostly the US) we have more doctors, hospitals, and drugs than ever before, we should be the healthiest people ever, yet today people are sicker than ever. it dont seem to add up.
 
Zacheus was a hated man. He got rich on the back of his own people. Yet Jesus had compassion on him. How is this joyce meyer thread any different than the mob that hated him?
 
Sirk said:
Zacheus was a hated man. He got rich on the back of his own people. Yet Jesus had compassion on him. How is this joyce meyer thread any different than the mob that hated him?
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The issue has never been about wealth, but the idea of entitlement. The aristocrats of every society have always believed God has blessed them and it is divine right. The hindus call these people brahmen or the head of God, which is inherited over many lives. Health similarly, brought as a right.

Jesus promised neither of these things, rather that eternal life transcended these principles. The picture is of Lazarus with God and the rich man in hades. And the reason? Self indulgence. The focus is on love from the heart and behaviour, which is given the stamp of approval by the presence of the Holy Spirit.

Too many seem to want the blessing but without faith or change.
 
PeterJens said:
The issue has never been about wealth, but the idea of entitlement. The aristocrats of every society have always believed God has blessed them and it is divine right. The hindus call these people brahmen or the head of God, which is inherited over many lives. Health similarly, brought as a right.

Jesus promised neither of these things, rather that eternal life transcended these principles. The picture is of Lazarus with God and the rich man in hades. And the reason? Self indulgence. The focus is on love from the heart and behaviour, which is given the stamp of approval by the presence of the Holy Spirit.

Too many seem to want the blessing but without faith or change.
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The truth is that oppressor and slave are cooperators in ignorance. I don't care if joyce meyers craps on a jewel encrusted toilet or not. Jesus still loves her. This mentality is the same one that each of us are guilty of and it pounded the nails in Jesus hands. If one understands Jewish culture...what He did in Jericho was a foreshadowing of his substitutionary death. The crowd murmured when Jesus changed his mind and stayed in Jericho with this hated man...but were ultimately blessed monetarily by His choice. Were they not?
 
Sirk said:
The truth is that oppressor and slave are cooperators in ignorance. I don't care if joyce meyers craps on a jewel encrusted toilet or not. Jesus still loves her. This mentality is the same one that each of us are guilty of and it pounded the nails in Jesus hands. If one understands Jewish culture...what He did in Jericho was a foreshadowing of his substitutionary death. The crowd murmured when Jesus changed his mind and stayed in Jericho with this hated man...but were ultimately blessed monetarily by His choice. Were they not?
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The issue people have with prosperity preachers is their claim wealth and health are something you need to claim by faith and is not a gift of grace. In a prosperous society it is easy to preach keep the blessing you deserve it. In a poor community you are saying you are judged because you do not have wealth. Neither statement is true. We are equally blessed in both situations, but self indulgence is pre-eminent. It is simply a lie to suggest God blesses sacrifice with greater wealth, and when it fails to materialise, Jesus has failed. People are being hurt by this approach, giving to preachers not because the Lord is leading them but because of this lottery idea.

Faith is not a lottery, it is about discovering Jesus's heart and walking in love.
There are many who deny this reality, and claim to follow Jesus. Without love we have nothing. It is that simple.
But not to these people.

Joyce can have as much wealth as she likes, it is this distortion and worldly aspiration that is the lie.

One of the contributors here claimed Jesus was rich with a house and a team of support staff etc. How do they know this? Because Jesus wore a garment that could not be cut up. Jesus cared zero about wealth, he relied on Gods provision through people he met. This has been the tradition in the church since its beginning. Only now in the fabulously wealthy 20-21 century does the prosperity gospel appear, because until now it would be laughed out of existance.
 
PeterJens said:
The issue people have with prosperity preachers is their claim wealth and health are something you need to claim by faith and is not a gift of grace. In a prosperous society it is easy to preach keep the blessing you deserve it. In a poor community you are saying you are judged because you do not have wealth. Neither statement is true. We are equally blessed in both situations, but self indulgence is pre-eminent. It is simply a lie to suggest God blesses sacrifice with greater wealth, and when it fails to materialise, Jesus has failed. People are being hurt by this approach, giving to preachers not because the Lord is leading them but because of this lottery idea.

Faith is not a lottery, it is about discovering Jesus's heart and walking in love.
There are many who deny this reality, and claim to follow Jesus. Without love we have nothing. It is that simple.
But not to these people.

Joyce can have as much wealth as she likes, it is this distortion and worldly aspiration that is the lie.

One of the contributors here claimed Jesus was rich with a house and a team of support staff etc. How do they know this? Because Jesus wore a garment that could not be cut up. Jesus cared zero about wealth, he relied on Gods provision through people he met. This has been the tradition in the church since its beginning. Only now in the fabulously wealthy 20-21 century does the prosperity gospel appear, because until now it would be laughed out of existance.
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The fact is that none of us deserve what we do have.
 
Sirk said:
The fact is that none of us deserve what we do have.
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I 100% agree. We are just stewards of the gift of grace, a precious thing. The way some talk it is like somehow winning the lottery rather than something we need to learn to respect.

Ahab could not cope with not getting an extension to his vegitable patch. He murdered Naboth via Jezebel.

Herod kills John the baptist because his young neice dances nicely for him so he promises anything.

The desire for power, respect, status, leads to so much evil, yet christians are running to it as if it is the best gift ever.
 
Seriously sometimes it seems that people on here just like to argue. This person who originally posted this discussion has every right to wonder about if a 23000 dollar toilet is too extravagant for a profession preacher to have. Jesus tells us to make friends with the unrighteous money and that it isn't even our money and those who do not Jesus says " who than will give to you the true riches" as it is written in the book of Luke. So yeah I think that is a good question. My answer would be no she shouldn't if it is the case especially if it is earned promoting a false gospel in the name of God
 
eternallife7 said:
Seriously sometimes it seems that people on here just like to argue. This person who originally posted this discussion has every right to wonder about if a 23000 dollar toilet is too extravagant for a profession preacher to have. Jesus tells us to make friends with the unrighteous money and that it isn't even our money and those who do not Jesus says " who than will give to you the true riches" as it is written in the book of Luke. So yeah I think that is a good question. My answer would be no she shouldn't if it is the case especially if it is earned promoting a false gospel in the name of God
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Except that she doesn't even have a $23,000 toilet...and I don't listen to Joyce...don't send her money....she's just not my cup of tea.....but there isn't a darn thing I can do about how Joyce poops. She can buy a space machine so she can fly to space and poop upside down for all I care and I still won't really give a rats dirty sphincter.
 
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