Do we really differ from ISIS?

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Willie-T

Banned
Feb 7, 2015
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The world, as a community, is not far from attempting to eradicate ISIS. Trump even says we should target their families for death in order to deter the male fighters. One man has this to say: (I know most of us here tend to agree with the "Wipe 'em all off the face of the Earth POV. What are your thoughts, in light of this article?)


I must admit, my heart is broken and vexed over the continual flood of news concerning violent acts being carried out in the name of God, regardless of what that name is. This violent deity, for whose glory humans from every nation under the sun are willing to kill and wage war, does not exist.

All over the world, mothers are laying sons to rest, fathers are weeping over the lifeless bodies of their daughters, widows are facing a life they never planned on living, cities lie in ruins and lives are forever shattered, and all because human beings belonging to a barbaric, patriarchal religion are convinced that a being who is nothing more than a figment of their imagination takes pleasure in such things. This is nothing new, and has been happening, more or less, since we've been a species capable of pondering our own existence, and desiring that of another. When there exists no logical reason to kill, we simply look to our gods to justify our violent behaviors.

Honestly, some nights I sit here breathless at the thought that life has left some child's eyes today because someone has convinced themselves that it's holy, or God-approved to drop bombs and pull triggers. Out of the nothingness that is the religions in which these imagined deities are ensconced has crawled the most disgusting and vile of ideologies, and it is high time we outgrew them.

If your God is not a peace-loving, peace-making, humanity-embracing, violence-rejecting Savior, you would be far better off leaving the idea of God behind all together. There is simply no place in the world for barbaric beliefs that can't be challenged since divine authority can be claimed by their adherents. It boggles the mind that those who talk seriously about invisible men living in cloud castles who order the extermination of others have not been ridiculed into extinction, but sadly, many would gladly elect just such a one as our next President, provided that he's willing to exterminate the "right" people.

Only a sane Gospel that reveals the insanity of our unholy, human religions and philosophies, has the power to rupture the system that blinds us, and causes us to think such things are sane. Only a God who looks like Jesus, a suffering God, to quote Bonhoffer, can save us.

The Jesus who hurls down fiery judgments in response to his children's prayers is no better than the god of ISIS. The Jesus who is coming back with his followers to slaughter (yes, I know such a portrait of Jesus can be painted when one irresponsibly and unintelligently dips their uninformed brush into the pallet of apocalyptic works like the Revelation) all those who refuse to bend the knee would hardly be distinguishable from ISIS, were he to don a black hood. Such a god can do nothing but add to the problem, and the proclamation of him can only serve to inspire hatred in the hearts of those we claim a desire to "reach".

Only the suffering God of the cross can save us. The God who hides behind ornate veils, in holy temples atop magic mountains does not exist. That supposedly most holy place sits empty and unoccupied, proving that those who crucify in his name crucify in the name of a non-existent being. But the crucified one, the one thought to be Godless and abandoned, is the one in Whom God is truly revealed and dwells.

This God, this suffering God, alone can save. All others, even those who call themselves by the very name that exposes them, leads us to destruction.
 
I just want my son to be free to have the choice to reach his full potential in this life.
 
I just want my son to be free to have the choice to reach his full potential in this life.

Me too. I have to admit that I am not really opposed to Trump's solution.... or any number of other eradication schemes. (Even though those "solutions" will only take care of the immediate threat this year. Another snake will slither out from under another rock somewhere next year.... and if enough oil is involved, that snake might just be the U.S.A. bombing some third world country.) But, I am just wondering if there is anything to how this man looks at it all.
 
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Long, thoughtful response called for, however, nutshell is "the only way to avoid as much collateral damage as possible is to put enough boots on the ground (100,00 to 250,000 troops) to start at one end of the Middle East and systematically go city to city, village to village, house to house searching every square inch of them t6o identify and eliminate any ISIS fighters.

Drive them into the Ocean, or North Afrika, and then continue to chase them to the ends of the earth.

The US is not going to do that..........soooooooooooooo
 
Long, thoughtful response called for, however, nutshell is "the only way to avoid as much collateral damage as possible is to put enough boots on the ground (100,00 to 250,000 troops) to start at one end of the Middle East and systematically go city to city, village to village, house to house searching every square inch of them t6o identify and eliminate any ISIS fighters.

Drive them into the Ocean, or North Afrika, and then continue to chase them to the ends of the earth.

The US is not going to do that..........soooooooooooooo

And if we did........ what of next year, and the next snake?

And, realistically, what if the rest of the world one day sees our thirst for oil and our power-grabbing façade of "protection of the oppressed" as the snake it may well be, and decides to hunt and exterminate THAT snake?
 
And if we did........ what of next year, and the next snake?

And, realistically, what if the rest of the world one day sees our thirst for oil and our power-grabbing façade of "protection of the oppressed" as the snake it may well be, and decides to hunt and exterminate THAT snake?

We fell asleep at the wheel and government small g god took the wheel. It's interesting to me that the Jews were the first to attempt self governance...under the guidance of God of course....except they wanted a king....had to have a king. Earthly kings usually end up on the bad side of things and lead their people to destruction. Such is the nature of sinful man...co-conspriators in ignorance.
 
Wouldn't killing the ISIS members just turn them into martyrs and make that religion grow. Look at what the martyrdom of Christians did when they wouldn't deny Jesus, Christianity spread like wildfire. I am not saying it wouldn't be the right answer, just wondering if it would make problems worse.
 
Wouldn't killing the ISIS members just turn them into martyrs and make that religion grow. Look at what the martyrdom of Christians did when they wouldn't deny Jesus, Christianity spread like wildfire. I am not saying it wouldn't be the right answer, just wondering if it would make problems worse.

This is one of the reasons we humans are convinced TOTAL annihilation, and continued immediate killing of any hint of new sprouts is the answer.

I wouldn't suggest this to many people here, but I think you are someone who would really appreciate a study of René Gerard's Mimetic Theory.

He's a French-American literary theorist and philosophical anthropologist
 
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I know what God has taught me..real love protects those we love from the evil forces in this world. This is the very image of the good shepherd ..watching over the flock and protecting them..and if need be to lay down our lives to protect them...not turn them over to the wolves. I want the young children that I know and love to have a chance at living in a decent world ..at least as decent and safe as the world I was raised in.
 
I know what God has taught me..real love protects those we love from the evil forces in this world. This is the very image of the good shepherd ..watching over the flock and protecting them..and if need be to lay down our lives to protect them...not turn them over to the wolves. I want the young children that I know and love to have a chance at living in a decent world ..at least as decent and safe as the world I was raised in.

That's good. I certainly understand.

Now, imagine that you and those young children are citizens of one of the countries we "good" people of the world are going to be invading and tearing apart to ferret out ISIS. "Decent and safe?" For whom?

"Yes" as long as it is OUR God on OUR side, it sounds pretty righteously upright. (It is sometimes very difficult for us to see that they want the same things for their children.)
 
That's good. I certainly understand.

Now, imagine that you and those young children are citizens of one of the countries we "good" people of the world are going to be invading and tearing apart to ferret out ISIS. "Decent and safe?" For whom?

"Yes" as long as it is OUR God on OUR side, it sounds pretty righteously upright. (It is sometimes very difficult for us to see that they want the same things for their children.)

Look the idea that the USA is going around oppressing people is just a lie ... There has never been a greater force for good and liberty than this country ... even in our greatest errors we are far above any other Nation that has ever been on this planet. In fact no nation has ever sought the good of others as we do...we basically could have taken over most of the world after WW2..but what did we do? we feed the world ..rebuilt it and tried to establish liberty where we could. This nonsense about us being evil and doing evil is just disgusting to those of us who have served our country..you should be ashamed for promoting such lies!
 
Our God wants us to live free and in peace and to be safe from evil and to believe in Jesus and accept him as Lord and Savior.

Evil people do not want us to live free or to have peace and want to kill us no matter what God we believe in.

They do not accept Jesus as the Savior or else why would they want to kill and destroy everything? And it is not about being a "freedom fighter".

Jesus is the way, the truth and the life amen.
 
Violence begets violence.

As simplistic as it is, I think the cycle can only be broken by love. Specifically the love of God through the saving power of the gospel of Jesus.
 
Violence begets violence.

As simplistic as it is, I think the cycle can only be broken by love. Specifically the love of God through the saving power of the gospel of Jesus.

Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay
 
When the News reports on thousands of Christians attacking some large City within the US, seizing control of the City, killing all of the Police, Political Leaders, and hunting down all the Muslims living there and placing them in cages and drowning them or setting them on fire. Or, butchering them by cutting off their heads, or making mass numbers of them kneel down and systematically executing them............

Well, when this happens, come back, and we will have this discussion.