The norm ?

[Tintin]

only reverence decides that we conclude that Jesus was a perpetual virgin as would also be the case with Mary - married or single or what's wrong wirh sex is not really the issue here - wincam

Or you know, that little thing called the Bible reveals this to us. Have you tried reading it?

 

[ATH1]

the norm is that humans marry and increase and multiply but Jesus did not and neither did His very own mother - any sensible or reasonable comments - wincam

you appear to have NO knowledge at all about a woman that lived 2000 years ago, so what are you trying to say. Did you know that Jesus said in the end times people will be willingly ignorant! so willingly ignorant, that not only would He LET them be ignorant, but that He would actually add to their ignorance. Did YOUR mother have any children?
Let me read your question back to you.

Again, you offered this as a statement: the norm is that humans marry and increase and multiply, but Jesus did not and neither did His very own mother. You in essence are calling Jesus a bas**** and His Mother a w**** Is this what you meant to insinuate ??

lets read this again
you stated that Jesus' mother did not have any children. Let me ask you this same question -Did YOUR mother have any children? Did you write this as a joke? or maybe just didn't come out the way you meant it to say?

I am appalled I think I am even actually angry at your post.! I don't get angry if people don't agree with me. I don't get angry if people don't understand a post I make. I never really get angry at anything but your insinuation about Jesus and His Mother is really right up at the level of an unforgivable sin
Do you know who Jesus' Father is? One day we will all meet Jesus' father face to face

Jesus came to this earth to give all of us, a chance for salvation and died a very painful death so that WE, that includes YOU, could have salvation and live forever.

I want to delete this post I want to pretend I never wrote or read it. I know I should not judge another human being. I make more mistakes than the average person and I am a lot dummer than most people. I am starting to get senile I believe, but I don't think I have ever been more sickened or ashamed than I am at your statement.

 

[Brother_Don]

a violation by Jesus = disparage Mary and you disparage Jesus = all have sinned and none righteous etc - step brothers were Joseph's sons not Mary's - Joseph was referred to as Father[Lk.2:48] but was in fact step father - wincam

Doesn't it seem that we would have been told that Joseph was a widow, if he had been married before Mary, and if Mary was his second wife?

 

[james57]

But he had no UNION with her UNTIL she gave birth to a son. And he gave him the name Jesus
Matt 1:25

 

[wincam]

An initial reading of these Biblical texts seems to clear up the issue: Jesus had brothers and sisters. But such obvious Scriptures are not without their response from Catholic Theologians. The primary argument against these Biblical texts is as follows:
In Greek, the word for brother is adelphos and sister is adelphe. This word is used in different contexts: of children of the same parents (Matt. 1:2, 14:3), descendants of parents (Acts 7:23, 26; Heb. 7:5), the Jews as a whole (Acts 3:17, 22), etc. Therefore, the term brother (and sister) can and does refer to the cousins of Jesus.
There is certainly merit in this argument, however, different contexts give different meanings to words. It is not legitimate to say that because a word has a wide scope of meaning, that you may then transfer any part of that range of meaning to any other text that uses the word. In other words, just because the word brother means fellow Jews or cousin in one place, does not mean it has the same meaning in another. Therefore, each verse should be looked at in context to see what it means.

Lets briefly analyze a couple of verses dealing with the brothers of Jesus.

• Matthew 12:46-47, "While He was still speaking to the multitudes, behold, His mother and brothers were standing outside, seeking to speak to Him. And someone said to Him, "Behold, Your mother and Your brothers are standing outside seeking to speak to You."
• Matthew 13:55, "Is not this the carpenter's son? Is not His mother called Mary, and His brothers, James and Joseph and Simon and Judas?"

In both of these verses, if the brothers of Jesus are not brothers but His cousins, then who is His mother, and who is the carpenter's father? In other words, mother here refers to Mary. The carpenter in Matt. 13:55 refers to Joseph. These are literal. Yet, the Catholic theologian will then stop there and say, "Though carpenter's son refers to Joseph and mother refers to Mary, brothers does not mean brothers but "cousins." This does not seem to be a legitimate assertion. You cannot simply switch contextual meanings in the middle of a sentence unless it is obviously required. The context is clear. This verse is speaking of Joseph, Mary, and Jesus' brothers. The whole context is of familial relationship: father, mother, and brothers.

which is exactly what you have unknowingly and even now will continue to do - the context is not at all clear as you have accepted and require us to do likewise - it was a misconception equally in both cases for Jesus was not the carpenter's son nor were the carpenter's sons and daughters His brothers and sisters nor did here as elsewhere His father and His mother seek Him sorrowing[Lk.2:48] - wincam

 

[wincam]

Or you know, that little thing called the Bible reveals this to us. Have you tried reading it?

the Bible does not reveal a lot of things that reason and common sense do - lets just say that naturally Jesus used the toilet just like every one else - wincam

 

[james57]

the Bible does not reveal a lot of things that reason and common sense do - lets just say that naturally Jesus used the toilet just like every one else - wincam

This comment brought a smile to my face

I remember many years ago chatting to the minister of my then church.
He said he had come to realise Jesus would have used the toilet the same as everyone else.

 

[Budman]

I've often wondered what Jesus dreamed about when He slept.

Weird, huh?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Exactly. Mary would not have sinned by violating God's command to not deny your spouse sexual relations.

And then there's that pesky "until" word.....

"And (Joseph) knew her not until she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS." (Matthew 1:25)

actually, Mary would have been in sin to withold sex from her husband joseph..

imagine if you will a God, who tells jospeh. You wife did not cheat on you (yeah right!) She is pregnant from the HS, Do ot put her away, but take her as your wife. Even though she will be called an aduterer, your son will be called a bastard child. and you will be mocked nd scorned for the rest of your life. Do this think I ask of you.

but one thing you must never do. I know sex is the most blessed thing I have given a man and wife, it represents the union of a man and woman leaving their parents and becoming one, but you must never touch your wife in that way. I want you to suffer, and I want you to never be blessed as you suffer..

rediculous!!!!God owuld never do this! He has no reason too!!

 

[james57]

I've often wondered what Jesus dreamed about when He slept.

Weird, huh?

Nightmares about the Pharisees?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

exactly what the problem is is that Mary was not a normal human nor was Jesus no matter who accepts or says otherwise - wincam

Um, Yes she was a normal human, stained by the sin of adam, and her own sin.

Even jesus was a normal human, the only difference he was not stained by the sin of adam (hence the HS seed, not josephs seed)

 

[eternally-gratefull]

a violation by Jesus = disparage Mary and you disparage Jesus = all have sinned and none righteous etc - step brothers were Joseph's sons not Mary's - Joseph was referred to as Father[Lk.2:48] but was in fact step father - wincam

ok, so joseph was the adulterer.. (rolls eyes)

Man you have been bamboozled by men who twist Gods word..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Being a virgin is normal. Having a baby is normal. Having spousal relations is normal. What isn't normal is to be married and not have spousal relations.

in the day of mary and Joseph, it would not be a marraige, it would never have been consumated.. They did not remain betrothed the rest of their lives, they became one after the birth of her firstborn.

 

[Budman]

When God said to be fruitful and multiply, it wasn't a suggestion. Mary would not have ignored this command either.

 

[wincam]

actually, Mary would have been in sin to withold sex from her husband joseph..

imagine if you will a God, who tells jospeh. You wife did not cheat on you (yeah right!) She is pregnant from the HS, Do ot put her away, but take her as your wife. Even though she will be called an aduterer, your son will be called a bastard child. and you will be mocked nd scorned for the rest of your life. Do this think I ask of you.

but one thing you must never do. I know sex is the most blessed thing I have given a man and wife, it represents the union of a man and woman leaving their parents and becoming one, but you must never touch your wife in that way. I want you to suffer, and I want you to never be blessed as you suffer..

rediculous!!!!God owuld never do this! He has no reason too!!

we can only imagine but what we imagine must be questioned as to why we imagine what we imagine and what others don't and why - sex was not the most blessed thing that God gave Abraham and Sarah or Elizabeth and Zechariah - why did Joseph refrain and restrain from this most blessed thing until when he supposedly did - wincam

 

[HeraldtheNews]

From what I understand, there is biblical support that Jesus did not have biological brothers and sisters, some of which has been mentioned here, and the person who said that the issue was not whether Mary had other children or Jesus was married, is right. If Mary had other biological children, why were they not allowed at the cross? Likely Mary said, "this is my only Son." And half-brothers/sisters or cousins may not have been allowed. John the Baptist is the cousin of Jesus. Also, the Lord committed the care of His mother to John, which would have been an offense to Jewish law if there had been another brother. Another thing to remember is that the LOrd considered His followers His true family. Joseph is not mentioned in the Bible, so it is likely he was older and had died. His death may have been a reason Jesus began His ministry. Also, Mary was close to God and knew His will.

As far as Jesus being married, it wasn't meant for His ministry as He knew He would be traveling and on the move from the treacherous enemies trying to stop Him. It would have been too dangerous for a wife. However, He was clearly close to Mary Magdalene. Since He was the fulfillment of the law, they could have been considered married through the presence of divine love if it was the will of God. No one can know if she was first among sisters or marital love. It's no one's business anyway, since His mission was not to be married and start a biological family, but to announce the Kingdom of Heaven and that all people should enter into the marriage relationship of the New Covenant of grace and prepare the Church to be the bride of Christ, the groom. I believe this can be supported by the Bible, but I'm not willing or really able to look up the verses at this time. I would appreciate it if someone could though.

 

[Budman]

Likely Mary said, "this is my only Son."

Aaaaaannnd that's how the waters get muddied to begin with - when we stick our personal opinions into the Word.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

we can only imagine but what we imagine must be questioned as to why we imagine what we imagine and what others don't and why - sex was not the most blessed thing that God gave Abraham and Sarah or Elizabeth and Zechariah - why did Joseph refrain and restrain from this most blessed thing until when he supposedly did - wincam

well if you think sex is some sinful thing (like some churches do), maybe you would think that way.

Joseph was told not to know (have sex) his wife until after jesus was born, We can imagine (actually we can know) he waited as God said.. then him and his wife consumated their marraige, and become one.

 

[wincam]

Um, Yes she was a normal human, stained by the sin of adam, and her own sin.

Even jesus was a normal human, the only difference he was not stained by the sin of adam (hence the HS seed, not josephs seed)

it seems some are even prepared to call and accept abnormal or supernormal as normal as and when it suits and as self appointed Popes and Gods with an appeal to inspiration by the HS not even be able to see or recognise or accept that they will not accept their error but are even prepared to involve the HS in their blasphemy that Jesus Christ was a normal human or for that matter that His mother was - wincam

 

[eternally-gratefull]

it seems some are even prepared to call and accept abnormal or supernormal as normal as and when it suits and as self appointed Popes and Gods with an appeal to inspiration by the HS not even be able to see or recognise or accept that they will not accept their error but are even prepared to involve the HS in their blasphemy that Jesus Christ was a normal human or for that matter that His mother was - wincam

Mary gave birth to the savior. As a virgin, thats the only thing abnormal about her.

jesus (the second adam) was born without the sin nature, Other than that he was completely human.

Your making Mary A God, thats paganism, Not christianity. Thats the lie.. Mary is not the other of heaven, She is the mother of Christs humanity. and she di dnot have to be sinless to carry Christ, that again, is just another pagan twist on a true christian fact.