The Pendulum Has Swung.

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oldthennew

Guest
#41
but,

it is a monumental leg-up on realizing how to serve our Father in a new and better way.....
Praise God!
 

NayborBear

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
#42

so it is sort of like the roman church instituting paganistic beliefs to their christian doctrines, and changing the names and ideas to make them appear more christian, so they can get their pagan citizens (of rome) who were the majority, to follow their new found religion to follow Christ


thus become legalistic antimonians.. (rules get you to heaven, but we can sin the sin the pagans do as much as we want. )

I say lets just stick to the word and stop trying to name things,, then there will be no confusion.
I can think of only 1 word that aptly describes this, and, that word is APOSTASY, or, a "falling away, or drifting away" FROM Mosiac Law. This is how the (Jewish) Talmud came to be, and, "appears" to be the same direction we find today's churches in, eh? Funny, ain't it, how things seem to be so different, they remain the same? No, me neither.
Can say this, however, when "heavy hitters" such as "baal, and chemosh" get involved, and they sieze hold of a person, church, denomination, society, country? Katie!!!......BAR THE GATE!!

Next thing ya know, they won't allow us to pray in schools no more, take the 10 commandments out of our public buildings, not use the word "God" in our pledge of allegiance, or even say the pledge at all, teach school children to write "there is no god but allah" IN ARABIC?

DON'T GET ME STARTED!! ;)

 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,742
3,670
113
#43
Labels are simply shorthand way of designating a movement.

The movement of liberalism which at it's core denies the authority of God's Word. It denies it by various means...flat out denial/ regarding it as only relevant for an age gone by, spiritualizing plain texts, using extra biblical references to make their case, etc.
Liberalism tends itself towards antinomianism (lawlessness) and as well as a breakdown of authority regarding God's Word.

As a recent example I had an exchange with an individual over ...

1Ti 2:11-14 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. (12) But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. (13) For Adam was first formed, then Eve. (14) And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

This was over the top for that person. Next came the cultural reasons why it can't be so, then came the Scripture twisting...all so the rebellion against a plain precept could over rule Scripture. This is an example of antinomian that I see cropping up big time here on CC.

Another, I would call 'Gospel Reductionism' where all that matters is that one is justified...outside that nearly anything goes...because hey, God's Word is up for interpretation, so who is to say?
 
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crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,742
3,670
113
#44

so it is sort of like the roman church instituting paganistic beliefs to their christian doctrines, and changing the names and ideas to make them appear more christian, so they can get their pagan citizens (of rome) who were the majority, to follow their new found religion to follow Christ


thus become legalistic antimonians.. (rules get you to heaven, but we can sin the sin the pagans do as much as we want. )

I say lets just stick to the word and stop trying to name things,, then there will be no confusion.
just thinking...perhaps what I'm seeing is the swing from the Pharisees to the onslaught of Saducees.
The Pharisees tended to take God's Word so serious that every dot and tittle must be observed and then some.
The Saducees played fast and loose with God's Word replacing it with their own traditions and denying anything miraculous...like hell.
 

NayborBear

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
#45
I kinda look at like the way in which God told Gideon to "choose" his army. In essence, "MANY, are called, FEW are chosen.".........The "problem" comes, when the "many" think they are "chosen". Can't argue with 'em. THEY, are RIGHT...YOU, are not!......Just hafta let 'em go, in the HOPES that in the coming next earth age (when Jesus Christ returns), and, the devil gets BANNED for 1,000 years, there'll be opportunities to "bring 'em around", so to speak. Can't figure out the WHY, some people wanna get "raptured", when Jesus is coming HERE!
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,742
3,670
113
#46
I kinda look at like the way in which God told Gideon to "choose" his army. In essence, "MANY, are called, FEW are chosen.".........The "problem" comes, when the "many" think they are "chosen". Can't argue with 'em. THEY, are RIGHT...YOU, are not!......Just hafta let 'em go, in the HOPES that in the coming next earth age (when Jesus Christ returns), and, the devil gets BANNED for 1,000 years, there'll be opportunities to "bring 'em around", so to speak. Can't figure out the WHY, some people wanna get "raptured", when Jesus is coming HERE!
That was quite a conglomeration, but I give much leeway when it comes to eschatology.
 
Oct 21, 2015
2,420
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#54
Definition of antinomian. 1 : one who holds that under the gospel dispensation of grace the moral law is of no use or obligation because faith alone is necessary to salvation. 2 : one who rejects a socially established morality.


Is that our only 2 choices? Antinomian or legalist? Doesn't Paul say that those who are of the works of the law are under the curse?

So we are either antinomian or legalist... I suppose I am antinomian then. Unless I am mis-understanding what antinomian is...
Well if the moral law was placed on your heart(2 cor3:3) so you in your heart wanted to obey it, and because you did you had a righteousness apart from the whole law, wouldn't that cover no legalism and at the same time you care about the moral law/you cant view it that it doesn't have obligation
 
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ladylynn

Guest
#55
Definition of antinomian. 1 : one who holds that under the gospel dispensation of grace the moral law is of no use or obligation because faith alone is necessary to salvation. 2 : one who rejects a socially established morality.


Is that our only 2 choices? Antinomian or legalist? Doesn't Paul say that those who are of the works of the law are under the curse?

So we are either antinomian or legalist... I suppose I am antinomian then. Unless I am mis-understanding what antinomian is...

OH Grandpa., this is all very confusing!!! If you don't know what you are, I don't stand a chance!!! Antinomian., legalist., hyper graceist., greasy graceist, hyper legalist., hyper Antinoian., anti antinomian., pro antinomian., pro legalist., ohhhhhhhhhh



eeeeeeeekkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk
make it stooooooppppp!!!!!!!!!!!
 
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ladylynn

Guest
#56
That's interesting. A lot of us would say the same thing..... Yet, we so often demand that others tell us "what they are" or "where they stand"in respect to this or that. Why? Probably so we can label them in our thinking.

​I hate when we do that.
 
Dec 9, 2011
13,994
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#57
That's interesting. A lot of us would say the same thing..... Yet, we so often demand that others tell us "what they are" or "where they stand"in respect to this or that. Why? Probably so we can label them in our thinking.
I won't say Its bad or good but that Is the truth.
 
Dec 9, 2011
13,994
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#58
I've found that it is much more effective to just say if you don't like something in plain language without denigrating someone. When you did or said I felt whatever it is I felt. If you lash out it just proves that on some level you have internalized what another person has said...had a painful feeling based on what they said... and then reacted based on the painful feeling....not very Christlike nor is it indicative of a person who is adept at responding based on the truth.


***Edit*** I am practicing this....it is hard to do sometimes and sometimes I fail. Especially in face to face situations.
Usually people don't internalize what someone said until there Is a lot of back and forth.
 
Dec 9, 2011
13,994
1,769
113
#59
I kinda look at like the way in which God told Gideon to "choose" his army. In essence, "MANY, are called, FEW are chosen.".........The "problem" comes, when the "many" think they are "chosen". Can't argue with 'em. THEY, are RIGHT...YOU, are not!......Just hafta let 'em go, in the HOPES that in the coming next earth age (when Jesus Christ returns), and, the devil gets BANNED for 1,000 years, there'll be opportunities to "bring 'em around", so to speak. Can't figure out the WHY, some people wanna get "raptured", when Jesus is coming HERE!
That was quite a conglomeration, but I give much leeway when it comes to eschatology.
:D response of the day.