What Happens To The Dead When They Die?

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KennethC

Guest
#61
#61
Euphemia said:
Jesus' disciples had no problem recognizing the Lord when He showed Himself to them. To Mary Magdalene and the men on the road to Emmaeus it was a deliberate shrouding of His likeness.

Yes, we will be changed, just like Jesus, and that means changed into an immortal body....our same body but immortal, imperishable, and able to withstand the devastating, most powerful glory of God.

The rapture does not consist of Jesus setting one foot on the Earth, but we are called up to meet Him. At the Second Coming seven years later, after the wedding of the Lamb, we emerge with our Husband and come with Him to Earth, where Jesus' feet set down on the Mount of Olives. We come WITH Him on horseback. There are no horses taking us to heaven with Him. That's because our horses are waiting for us there.
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Then you overlook the scriptures from Genesis 3:19, Ecclesiastics 3:20, 12:7 that shows these bodies return to dust.

They are not persevered and we are not returned to them, we are changed into new eternal bodies..........

I never said Jesus sets foot on earth, I said the picture Paul gives shows Jesus descending from heaven in the clouds while all believers (dead first, then the alive) are ascending.

John 3:13 says no man except for Jesus has ascended to heaven !!!


There is no teaching that Jesus second coming and our gathering to Him takes place at separate times, each time the gathering is mentioned it is spoken with His Second coming.
 
Euphemia

Euphemia

Banned
#62
Dec 5, 2015
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#62
When a believer does, it is exactly as Paul says: we will be found immediately with Jesus, who is at that place, preparing for us. He is always with us...even in death and ever after. There is no such thing as soul sleep, or waiting for Him. We have Him now and when we breathe our last, we will be immediately ushered into His presence. Any other belief is unbelief...and heresy.
 
Euphemia

Euphemia

Banned
#63
Dec 5, 2015
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#63
John 3:13 NLT

No one has ever gone to heaven and returned. But the Son of Man has come down from heaven.
 
K

KennethC

Guest
#64
#64
Euphemia said:
John 3:13 NLT

No one has ever gone to heaven and returned. But the Son of Man has come down from heaven.
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I suggest you use a different translation because the NLT has issues with it, and this rendering shows exactly that.

John 3:13 does not refer to Jesus second coming as the NLT is trying to imply, it refers to Jesus ascending back up to heaven after His resurrection.

"And returned" is not in that verse.................


English Standard Version
No one has ascended into heaven except he who descended from heaven, the Son of Man.

Berean Study Bible
No one has ascended into heaven except the One who descended from heaven--the Son of Man.

Berean Literal Bible
And no one has gone up into heaven except the One having come down out of heaven, the Son of Man.

New American Standard Bible
"No one has ascended into heaven, but He who descended from heaven: the Son of Man.

King James Bible
And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
No one has ascended into heaven except the One who descended from heaven--the Son of Man.

International Standard Version
"No one has gone up to heaven except the one who came down from heaven, the Son of Man who is in heaven.

NET Bible
No one has ascended into heaven except the one who descended from heaven--the Son of Man.
 
Euphemia

Euphemia

Banned
#65
Dec 5, 2015
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12
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#65
I think people have issues. I have none with the NLT. There is the potential for a greater understanding there, but it is up to each person to either embrace it or resist it.
 
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KennethC

Guest
#66
#66
Euphemia said:
I think people have issues. I have none with the NLT. There is the potential for a greater understanding there, but it is up to each person to either embrace it or resist it.
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Well when the interpretation adds words to God's word (which is wrong) then I do take an issue with it !!!

Adding to change the context of what a scripture says is very dangerous, and can lead people to ruin instead of salvation through Christ.

Remembering one of the standings in the Word of God is to keep with His sound doctrine, so if words are added or taken away it is no longer sound doctrine !!!
 
Euphemia

Euphemia

Banned
#67
Dec 5, 2015
973
12
0
#67
Far too many people prop up their misinterpretation of the word of God about this subject by using that verse. They are in error. The meaning is clear that no one but Jesus has come from heaven and returned there IN ORDER TO BE ABLE TO SPEAK WITH AUTHORITY about it!

Give yourself a break.

KennethC said:
Well when the interpretation adds words to God's word (which is wrong) then I do take an issue with it !!!

Adding to change the context of what a scripture says is very dangerous, and can lead people to ruin instead of salvation through Christ.

Remembering one of the standings in the Word of God is to keep with His sound doctrine, so if words are added or taken away it is no longer sound doctrine !!!
Click to expand...
 
prove-all

prove-all

Senior Member
#68
May 16, 2014
5,977
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#68
prove-all said:
Hell Defined

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corrected


The word hell can be traced back only so far as the anglo-saxon word "helle" or "helan"
and it's definition is that of a "hidden place"

There are four words for hell and the translators wrongly used hell each and every
occasion that the words - Hades, Gehenna, Sheol, and Tartarus, were used in the bible.

Gehenna, was the garbage dump just outside of Jerusalem,
where refuse was burned continually.

Hades, is a greek word for hidden place

Sheol, is a Hebrew word used for the grave

Tartarus, was used by Homer, when describing the subterranean prisons
where the "gods" were imprisoned.

use a bible concordence to find in verses what origanly word used, one deffination.

So, by combining all these things together, the translators painted a picture
of a subterranean place where fires burned and was unseen by those living
upon the surface of the earth.

There will be a lake of fire, that is a fact, but hell is not the lake of fire.
The lake of fire does not yet exist...it will at Judgment day,
but that is only after the millennial period.
 
prove-all

prove-all

Senior Member
#69
May 16, 2014
5,977
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#69
Notice what the Jewish Encyclopedia explains: “The belief in the immortality of the soul
came to the Jews from contact with Greek thought and chiefly through the philosophy
of Plato, its principal exponent, who was led to it through Orphic and Eleusinian mysteries
in which Babylonian and Egyptian views were strangely blended” (emphasis ours).

The doctrine of the immortality of the soul, according to this respected encyclopedia,
came from pre-Christian Greek philosophers who acquired it from pagan Egypt and Babylon



6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh;
and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Man is composed of flesh.
Jesus plainly says that if one is born of (and therefore composed of) flesh,
he cannot also at the same time be born of (composed of) spirit.

He must be one or the other!

Was the Apostle Paul an immortal soul clothed with a body of flesh—or did
he speak of himself and his flesh as being synonymous? Romans 7:18.


Paul did not distinguish between himself and his flesh in this verse.
He indicated they were one and the same, he speak of himself and his flesh
as being synonymous



-Adam was made from, and therefore composed of, earth!


God blew air—“the breath of life” containing oxygen—into the man’s lungs through his nostrils,
and the man began to live! The verse does not say God breathed an immortal soul into the man.

21And all flesh died that moved upon the earth, both of fowl, and of cattle, and of beast,
and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth, and every man:

22All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, of all that was in the dry land, died.

-the same “breath of life” also pass through the nostrils of animals.
It is the breath of life that is cut off when a human being [or] an animal drowns.

and man became a living soul.

The soul is composed of the “dust of the ground.” It is material, not spiritual;
it is matter. When man breathes, he is a “living soul.” When man ceases to breathe,
he becomes a nonliving or dead soul.
 
prove-all

prove-all

Senior Member
#70
May 16, 2014
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#70
I believe God did not use the ancient Hebrew wedding model,
for one it is not in Gods oracles, or told us in bible to use.

I believe God used Israels yearly harvests as a model.

you have the first harvest[first fruits]of man, at Christs sec. comming

then you have the larger harvest in the fall
 
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