Once Saved Always saved....Read this

[PeacefulWarrior]

I was answering your post - to me.

And we do indeed have a new spiritual nature; Christ's nature. And we have that new nature while we still inhabit our flesh.

Our old nature, is sinful, and desires nothing but to sin. Our new nature in Christ, does not, nor can sin. It explains perfectly the paradox of why we still sin, yet are declared holy, sinless, and righteous by God - without any condemnation.

What do you mean when you say: "Our new nature...[cannot] sin."?

 

[Budman]

Obvious? Well, you're wrong--so, I guess it's not so obvious.

I think it's fine to challenge false doctrine and I think we can display a Christian love while doing so!

How loving is is to watch one heading blindly for a cliff and not doing everything possible to warn them of disaster?

It's like Spurgeon said:

“If sinners be damned, at least let them leap to Hell over our dead bodies. And if they perish, let them perish with our arms wrapped about their knees, imploring them to stay. If Hell must be filled, let it be filled in the teeth of our exertions, and let not one go unwarned and unprayed for.”

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Then once again, please tell me why you still sin?

When I have sinned I did so because I chose to do so, not because I was compelled to do so by my sinful nature. I chose to obey my flesh instead of the holy spirit. If I do sin, it is for the same reason.

 

[Blain]

What do you mean when you say: "Our new nature...[cannot] sin."?

I think he maybe misused the phrase cannot sin. From I see he is saying that while we sin and mess up sometimes we strive to not sin and are covered by grace.

 

[Budman]

What do you mean when you say: "Our new nature...[cannot] sin."?

Read 1 John 3:9.; "Whosoever is born of God does not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God."

Our new nature, is the very nature of Christ imputed to us. It's what our salvation is judged upon.

 

[thepsalmist]

Interesting to note that God calls his children sheep ...

Did you know that if you stick your finger in a sheep's mouth you won't be hurt? That is because God made them to have only bottom teeth.

We are commanded to "Be wise as serpents and harmless as doves"

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

How loving is is to watch one heading blindly for a cliff and not doing everything possible to warn them of disaster?

It's like Spurgeon said:

“If sinners be damned, at least let them leap to Hell over our dead bodies. And if they perish, let them perish with our arms wrapped about their knees, imploring them to stay. If Hell must be filled, let it be filled in the teeth of our exertions, and let not one go unwarned and unprayed for.”

In your case, rather than 'wrapping your arms about our knees', you are often found leaving petty remarks. Remarks which add fuel to a fire. A fire which could have been extinguished had you 'wrapped your arms about our knees'. Instead, these petty remarks with no substance or clarification end up adding momentum to the one(s) who are at the edge of that cliff.

Show us that you believe Spurgeon's words here. Let us see you grabbing ahold of us so that we do not fall. I'd much rather see this than see your petty remarks as I fall.

When I say "petty" I mean spiteful and negligible -- you're stirring the pot, but not helping to fix anything.

 

[valiant]

You're just channeling the gnostic dualism that views everything as being determined by nature. The spirit man can't sin, but the old man can. Guess what? This dissociative separation only exists in the mind. Man is a whole comprised of old man and new spirit, and GOD holds the whole man accountable for what he does with the body.

The gnostics did not believe this. They believed that they were saved by their spiritual nature, just as you do; and that the conduct of the body was irrelevant to salvation, just as you do (and even said so in your post).

Budman: how we live our lives has no bearing on whether or not we keep our salvation ... We are holy, righteous, and sinless because that is what He is, and what His nature in us proclaims

Gnostics (per Irenaeus): [the gnostics] hold that they shall be entirely and undoubtedly saved, not by means of conduct, but because they are spiritual by nature... it is impossible that spiritual substance (by which they mean themselves) should ever come under the power of corruption [of sin], whatever the sort of actions in which they indulged.​

Grow up and recognise the big difference between the two The Gnostics are REJECTING their bodies. They hope to be wholly spiritual emanations,

 

[Budman]

When I have sinned I did so because I chose to do so, not because I was compelled to do so by my sinful nature. I chose to obey my flesh instead of the holy spirit. If I do sin, it is for the same reason.

Yet you yourself said:

You must do the righteous work of abstaining from sin and doing the will of GOD in order to be saved.

You don't abstain from sin, because you still sin. So by your own words, you are not saved.

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

Read 1 John 3:9.; "Whosoever is born of God does not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God."

Our new nature, is the very nature of Christ imputed to us. It's what our salvation is judged upon.

1 Peter 1:23

 

[Budman]

When I say "petty" I mean spiteful and negligible -- you're stirring the pot, but not helping to fix anything.

Tell me how I am using Scripture to fight against false doctrine, as being "spiteful" and simply "stirring the pot"?

What would you have us do?

Should we simply say; "Well, whatever you believe to be right, is right for you, and who are we to question any doctrine, because the last thing we should do is hurt someone's feelings".

Would that make you happy? Are feelings more important than the truth?

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

You don't abstain from sin, because you still sin. So by your own words, you are not saved.

At face-value, this sounds an awfully lot like a works-based salvation outline.

 

[Blain]

Tell me how I am using Scripture to fight against false doctrine, as being "spiteful" and simply "stirring the pot"?

What would you have us do?

Should we simply say; "Well, whatever you believe to be right, is right for you, and who are we to question any doctrine, because the last thing we should do is hurt someone's feelings".

Would that make you happy? Are feelings more important than the truth?

it isn't the fact you are using scriptures it's how you use them, the same words they can save a soul or destroy it.
for instance if someone does something and you ask them to apologize but they sorry in a rude way they don't mean it do they? it's easy to use scripture but how you use it effects everything

 

[Budman]

1 Peter 1:23

Exactly. That imperishable seed within us, is our new nature. The very nature of Christ.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Read 1 John 3:9.; "Whosoever is born of God does not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God."

Our new nature, is the very nature of Christ imputed to us. It's what our salvation is judged upon.

Our salvation is dependent upon our abiding in Christ where there is perfect safety.

 

[Budman]

it isn't the fact you are using scriptures it's how you use them, the same words they can save a soul or destroy it.
for instance if someone does something and you ask them to apologize but they sorry in a rude way they don't mean it do they? it's easy to use scripture but how you use it effects everything

I agree.....

 

[Budman]

Our salvation is dependent upon our abiding in Christ where there is perfect safety.

Yet, once again, your own words condemn you. You still sin, so you are not abiding in Christ. Thus, again by your own admission, you are not saved.

To quote you, again:

You must do the righteous work of abstaining from sin and doing the will of GOD in order to be saved.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Exactly. That imperishable seed within us, is our new nature. The very nature of Christ.

The new nature gives us the ability to do GOD's will. It does not, cannot, save us. Abiding in Christ, who has already been judged, saves us from being judged.

 

[Budman]

The new nature gives us the ability to do GOD's will. It does not, cannot, save us. Abiding in Christ, who has already been judged, saves us from being judged.

Really? So you do God's will by no longer sinning?

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Yet, once again, your own words condemn you. You still sin, so you are not abiding in Christ. Thus, again by your own admission, you are not saved.

To quote you, again:

Abiding in Christ means returning to GOD for cleansing if/when we do sin.