CONFESSING YOUR RIGHTEOUSNESS PLEASES GOD

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Grace777x70 said:
Excellent point!..I never thought of it like that but you are right. ..some follow others around and bring false accusations and "twists" in what is being said just like the Pharisees did to Jesus....it's a great sign that you are on the right track...!..:)
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Yes it is. Choo! Choo! :)
 
eternally-gratefull said:
You have to figure out what they believe first. Otherwise all you do is make a mess of the whole discussion thing.
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Exactly., and then it causes me to have to post this picture again. :rolleyes:
 
HeRoseFromTheDead said:
I take the good with the bad. I'd prefer they not be spewing false doctrine, but since I have no control over that the best I can do is engage them to learn and refute.
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I can see that...but it's difficult too because...well, it's like someone in a certain denomination, or even someone in a cult for that matter come to think of it - there are certain things they're taught but not all believe every thing. Do you see what I'm saying? Like, some baptists believe you aren't saved without a water baptism in ADDITION to your Holy Spirit Baptism. Other baptists believe it's not necessary, but they certainly think it's a good idea to make profession of faith before the world. :)

To engage with a baptist, you try to find out where within the gamut they are.
To engage with even a mormon, I've found this to be true. (And no, I'm not comparing mormons to christians).

Do you see what I mean? No one falls within strict parameters, even among us christians. Or even among those in a cult. Even among dog trainers and what they believe is the best way to train a dog. Heavy hand authoritative, gentle guidance, etc.

So to engage with anyone really, we have to let them paint short strokes. We have to give THEM the paintbrush. From the short strokes they paint, we begin to get their broader ideas. We engage with them by listening to how they explain what they believe, not by TELLING them what they believe. For me to walk up to every baptist I meet and tell them I don't think they really understand what the sacrament of baptism really is, or what it stands for or shows a picture of, is to tell them what they believe. It is not finding out what they believe. It is not engaging with them. It is not giving them the paintbrush and then listening to understand them. And it's not true of every baptist, every time, who I meet, so it's not fair to them as single persons.

I can't meet one baptist or one catholic or one pentecostal and then insist they all believe the same exact way about everything, because they don't. And it isn't really engaging with them to walk up to them and begin to tell them what they believe. It isn't even letting them speak at all.
 
The confusing part for me is - even after telling people the same thing for over 50x times and in some cases over 200x times - they still say the complete opposite of what was said. It's like they have blinders on and only see what they think was said and that remains a fixation in their minds. This is without a doubt a deception of some sort that is affecting their minds and has infected them to a point where malice and bitterness has taken over.

And sometimes they do see what is said but don't agree and that is fine - we can just agree to disagree but we can do I in a respectful way without the name-calling and malice and the bearing of false witness and false accusations.
 
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eternally-gratefull said:
yet maybe he will listen to you. His eyes are closed to what we think.
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He's stuck in a single story. But he'll get to listening more closely!
Single stories are always bad.
Single stories say things like...
women can't drive.
all police hate black people.
white men can't jump.
All grace teachers believe...a,b,c.

Single stories refuse to give whole segments of the population a voice. It refuses to let them speak.
 
Stunnedbygrace said:
He's stuck in a single story. But he'll get to listening more closely!
Single stories are always bad.
Single stories say things like...
women can't drive.
all police hate black people.
white men can't jump.
All grace teachers believe...a,b,c.

Single stories refuse to give whole segments of the population a voice. It refuses to let them speak.
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Never heard that before, but like it.

All these are based on one thing, PRIDE..

Pride is an evil thing.. It will kill us, and we may not even see it coming
 
Grace777x70 said:
The confusing part for me is - even after telling people the same thing for over 50x times and in some cases over 200x times - they still say the complete opposite of what was said. It's like they have blinders on and only see what they think was said and that remains a fixation in their minds. This is without a doubt a deception of some sort that is affecting their minds and has infected them to a point where malice and bitterness has taken over.

And sometimes they do see what is said but don't agree and that is fine - we can just agree to disagree but we can do I in a respectful way without the name-calling and malice and the bearing of false witness and false accusations.
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Can you give us a specific example? You've said this like 10000 times in general terms. Let's start with one specific example to see if you are telling the truth.
 
Grace777x70 said:
The confusing part for me is - even after telling people the same thing for over 50x times and in some cases over 200x times - they still say the complete opposite of what was said. It's like they have blinders on and only see what they think was said and that remains a fixation in their minds. This is without a doubt a deception of some sort that is affecting their minds and has infected them to a point where malice and bitterness has taken over.

And sometimes they do see what is said but don't agree and that is fine - we can just agree to disagree but we can do I in a respectful way without the name-calling and malice and the bearing of false witness and false accusations.
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Ah, we've seen something even more confusing than that!
Peter and HeRose have both said to me that I am believing right but you aren't, even though I was just saying what you were saying but in different phrasing. THAT'S the MOST confusing part of it.
 
HeRoseFromTheDead said:
Can you give us a specific example? You've said this like 10000 times in general terms. Let's start with one specific example to see if you are telling the truth.
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Jesus loves me, this I know. For, the Bible tells me so.
Little ones, to Him belong. They are weak, but He is strong!
 
"Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that ye may know how ye ought to answer every man." Col 4:6
 
Stunnedbygrace said:
Do you see what I mean? No one falls within strict parameters, even among us christians. Or even among those in a cult. Even among dog trainers and what they believe is the best way to train a dog. Heavy hand authoritative, gentle guidance, etc.

So to engage with anyone really, we have to let them paint short strokes. We have to give THEM the paintbrush. From the short strokes they paint, we begin to get their broader ideas. We engage with them by listening to how they explain what they believe, not by TELLING them what they believe. For me to walk up to every baptist I meet and tell them I don't think they really understand what the sacrament of baptism really is, or what it stands for or shows a picture of, is to tell them what they believe. It is not finding out what they believe. It is not engaging with them. It is not giving them the paintbrush and then listening to understand them. And it's not true of every baptist, every time, who I meet, so it's not fair to them as single persons.

I can't meet one baptist or one catholic or one pentecostal and then insist they all believe the same exact way about everything, because they don't. And it isn't really engaging with them to walk up to them and begin to tell them what they believe. It isn't even letting them speak at all.
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I understand your point, but is is a mis-perception on your part. I having been engaging some of these folks every day for several months. I know what some of them believe because they either have said so or have posted some video of one of their teachers. They are free at any time to say that what I have described is not what they believe, and then state what they believe. Instead they either say nothing, or simply say that I and others are false accusers. So there's really only one course of action that they've left open for me, and that is to continually expose the falsehoods.
 
Stunnedbygrace said:
Ah, we've seen something even more confusing than that!
Peter and HeRose have both said to me that I am believing right but you aren't, even though I was just saying what you were saying but in different phrasing. THAT'S the MOST confusing part of it.
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Then why don't you seek answers instead of staying confused?
 
HeRoseFromTheDead said:
I understand your point, but is is a mis-perception on your part. I having been engaging some of these folks every day for several months. I know what some of them believe because they either have said so or have posted some video of one of their teachers. They are free at any time to say that what I have described is not what they believe, and then state what they believe. Instead they either say nothing, or simply say that I and others are false accusers. So there's really only one course of action that they've left open for me, and that is to continually expose the falsehoods.
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we have done this so many times, Our fingers fell off.

I have to be honest and ask you. The Holy Spirit never convicts you of the lies you tell??
 
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