lets have some Bible study shall we?

PeterJens · Apr 8, 2016

There is no surprise in saying ignoring sin and not talking about what is acceptable behaviour and what is not leads to confusion.

The real answer is you have a perfect new spirit with the law of God written on your heart. As many confuse the issue with the impossibility of walking without sin the argument becomes confused and just circular. I hope you enjoy this simple repetition because it does not prove anything other than you do not have a complete story.

roaringkitten · Apr 9, 2016

Some Scriptures to feed some spiritual food to this thread:

"For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us: Nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others; For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself." Heb 9:24-26

"In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins" Col 1:14

BenFTW · Apr 9, 2016

PeterJens said:

Are you espousing sinless perfectionism? I am not against holiness, but do you think yourself, in practicality, to not sin at all? Have you been so sanctified? If so, was it by God or through striving in morality? Do you think that in knowing right from wrong you have made yourself presentable to the Lord? Jesus is the way to the Father, not your avoidance of sin. Jesus took care of sin, the thing that alienated you from God. He reconciled you to the Lord. The more you type on this forum the more it seems that you think yourself to walk a narrow path that others have failed at. Are you without sin?

If there was a means to not sin a day in our lives may God shed light on it. To those that you think are living licentiously, you would be surprised to know how quickly they would receive the ability to sin no more. They would rejoice, for in sin there are consequences that hold no pleasure. This is why sin grieves God, He grieves for us and not against us. He has so much better for us, even so in the ways of righteousness.

ladylynn · Apr 9, 2016

roaringkitten said:

Exactly roaringkitten., that picture is a good outlet for frustration and perplexity like you said. And then it also gives some comic relief to the conversation. Showing that we just have to not hold on to this but let God have it.

He knows all about our discussions here on CC and must get a kick out of some of our ways of dealing with frustration. People who don't understand need revelation and only the Holy Spirit can give that. And in the meantime, we can use that picture or others sometimes to still be respectful but also give voice to our consolation. I like that picture and it gives me TONS of consolation.

ladylynn · Apr 9, 2016

phil112 said:

Think of it like this... look up the word "Imputation" When we were born as humans, Adam who is the first human ... when he and his wife Eve sinned, his sin was "IMPUTED" to all of his race... the human race. Alls we had to do was be born into Adam's race and his sin of disobedience for eating the fruit went onto all humans. That is what the word "IMPUTATION" means. We did nothing but be born and we got Adam's sin on us with all it's ramifications.

Jesus Christ is called the 2nd Adam. He came and He gave us HIS "IMPUTED" Righteousness when we were born again. We could DO NOTHING to merit this., we did nothing to make ourselves righteous because the Bible says human righteousness is filthy rags. We simply received this gift Jesus offered., we received Jesus Christ and were born again and received HIS IMPUTED RIGHTEOUSNESS.

In Adam., we did nothing except be born into the human family and made sinners. In Christ., we did nothing but be born into God's family and made RIGHTEOUS.

John146 · Apr 9, 2016

So those Corinthians who were not doing the will of God, but rather, walking as carnal, worldly Christians were not saved according to you even though Scripture says they were.

HeRoseFromTheDead said:

garee · Apr 9, 2016

Hi Pete, my two cents...

Obedience to Christ does not come by one being self-motivated but Christ motivated. Just as we have one father in heaven and are to call no man father on earth, the same applies to teachers (masters) one is our teacher we are all brother and sisters.

No man can serve two masters in that way.. we either hate our own selves by not performing our own will , but rather love Christ who works in us to bless us by His love. Or the other way around, we love ourselves by blessing our own selves while hating the word of our salvation.

Obedience to Christ comes as Christ works in a person’s heart to both will and do His good pleasure. To make obedience evil seems like someone is not hearing God aright but rather is attributing that work to their own heart/conscience, which is desperately wicked and beyond repair as in who can know it?

In doing so they blaspheme the Holy name by which we called heaven-ward and violate the first commandment in doing so. .

I think a good or more adequate bible study would be directed more towards; “how do we hear God” to make sure we are not seeking the approval of sinful men, like us .

I hope I heard you aright? I am not directing it towards you seeing three finger point towards myself, just more curious to your approach as to the end of the matter.?

thepsalmist · Apr 9, 2016

ladylynn said:

Think of it like this... look up the word "Imputation" When we were born as humans, Adam who is the first human ... when he and his wife Eve sinned, his sin was "IMPUTED" to all of his race... the human race. Alls we had to do was be born into Adam's race and his sin of disobedience for eating the fruit went onto all humans. That is what the word "IMPUTATION" means. We did nothing but be born and we got Adam's sin on us with all it's ramifications.

Jesus Christ is called the 2nd Adam. He came and He gave us HIS "IMPUTED" Righteousness when we were born again. We could DO NOTHING to merit this., we did nothing to make ourselves righteous because the Bible says human righteousness is filthy rags. We simply received this gift Jesus offered., we received Jesus Christ and were born again and received HIS IMPUTED RIGHTEOUSNESS.

In Adam., we did nothing except be born into the human family and made sinners. In Christ., we did nothing but be born into God's family and made RIGHTEOUS.

LadyLynn ... That is a wonderful way of expressing it.

Well done! Thank you.

ember · Apr 9, 2016

this thread

eternally-gratefull · Apr 9, 2016

BenFTW said:

And it seems self righteousness is not sin anymore either

HeRoseFromTheDead · Apr 9, 2016

BenFTW said:

Are you espousing sinless perfectionism? I am not against holiness, but do you think yourself, in practicality, to not sin at all? Have you been so sanctified? If so, was it by God or through striving in morality? Do you think that in knowing right from wrong you have made yourself presentable to the Lord? Jesus is the way to the Father, not your avoidance of sin. Jesus took care of sin, the thing that alienated you from God. He reconciled you to the Lord. The more you type on this forum the more it seems that you think yourself to walk a narrow path that others have failed at. Are you without sin?

What is holiness in your doctrine?

HeRoseFromTheDead · Apr 9, 2016

BenFTW said:

You really have a confused mind about numerous issues. We all know that Jesus is the way to the father. So it's pointless to even say that. Avoidance of sin has nothing to do with coming to GOD, but it has everything to do with abiding in Christ. Those who say they know GOD and don't do GOD's will (keep/do his word, do his commandments) are simply liars. That's what the book says. It's not GOD's will that we sin. Jesus took care of the penalty for sin, but he didn't remove your ability to sin or to become alienated from GOD. Those who persist in the necessity to sin are simply expressing a rebellious, lawless spirit. GOD has given us the ability to not sin. And if/when we do sin he has given us the means to be cleansed and remain in Christ. And that's the will of GOD: that we remain in Christ.

HeRoseFromTheDead · Apr 9, 2016

John146 said:

I'm just not going to respond to your stupid, baited questions anymore.

John146 · Apr 9, 2016

("If I answer no, the Corinthians were not saved, I'd be going against the Bible. But, If I say yes, the Corinthians were saved despite their carnal, worldly living, I'd be going against what I've been preaching all along.") Hmmmm...ok, I'm not going to respond to such a stupid baited question...

HeRoseFromTheDead said:

Grace777x70 · Apr 9, 2016

Abiding in the Vine:

A promise, not a condition

Jesus told the disciples, you are in me (our imperfections are hidden in His perfection) and I am in you (we carry His sinless DNA). Jesus didn’t sin and He won’t ever sin. If you let Him live His life through you, then without any conscious effort on your part you’re going to start talking and acting just like sinless Jesus. This is a glorious promise for all who believe:

“Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.” (1 Jn 3:9)

So what does it mean to abide in the vine? Here’s the answer we’ve all been waiting for…

“Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God.” (1 Jn 4:15)

Have you confessed that Jesus is the Son of God? Then God abides in you and you in Him. You may wonder, But how did this happen? All I did was confess. Well you could not have believed and confessed Jesus as Lord unless the Holy Spirit had led you to do so (1 Cor 12:3). The work and the glory are all His. Rest in that!

The trouble is, you can’t rest because somewhere inside there is a little voice that’s asking, Can I abide today and not abide tomorrow? Can I be in the vine one moment and cut off the next? Why would Jesus tell his disciples to abide if there wasn’t any danger of not abiding?

The problem, as usual, is found between our ears. Most of us have grown up with a slave mentality that says our value is determined by what we do. This was certainly true of the disciples who had been born and bred under the law. They were conditioned to think in terms of their performance. This works mindset is also evident in some of our English translations:

“Remain in me, and I will remain in you.” (Jn 15:4, NIV)

Again, that sounds like a condition. It sounds like Jesus is saying, if your abiding performance is up to scratch, then I will reward you by abiding as well. But it is not a condition to make us sweat; it is a promise to make us rest.

In John 15 Jesus goes to great lengths to counter the law-mentality of the disciples. He does this by hitting them with promise after promise:

“As the Father loved Me, I also have loved you; abide in My love.” (Jn 15:9)

How does the Father love Jesus? Ask yourself this question: How many miracles or works had Jesus done when the Father declared from heaven, “this is my beloved Son?” None! The Father loves Jesus unconditionally, without any reference to His performance or fruit. That means that Jesus loves us unconditionally! He wants us to rest in His unconditional love.

You’re free? Be free!

Just to recap – if you think abiding is something we must do, then understand that the evidence of abiding is zero sin. This is humanly impossible. The only logical response to the command “abide!” is to trust in Jesus and His performance and quit trying to impress Him with yours. The word “abide” connotes “rest” and “surrender,” not “struggle” and “try harder.”

Trust God, the abiding issue is all settled from His side. “Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him.” But it may not be settled from your side. You may still be struggling with that old servant mentality.

Instead of rest there is insecurity. Instead of joy there is anxiety. Am I in? Can I be cut off? If this is you, let Jesus speak to your insecurity:

“I tell you the truth, everyone who sins is a slave to sin. Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.” (Jn 8:34-36)

The reality is, you are free indeed because Jesus has set you free. The reality is, you are abiding in the vine because you have confessed Him as Lord. But you may not be experiencing that reality.

You may feel like you’re not free or you’re not abiding. Although you are a son with a permanent place in the family, you may still think and act like the slave that you used to be. There’s only one solution: renew your mind! Stop living by feelings and start walking by faith. You are abiding in fact, so start abiding in practice.

When Jesus said, “anyone who does not abide in Me is cast out as a branch, withers, and is thrown into the fire,” He was not referring to fruitless Christians. (They are lifted up.) He was describing those who refuse to believe to that He is the Son of God. He was describing those who are looking for life outside of the true vine.

If you have confessed Jesus as your Lord, then walk in that the truth: You are free, God Himself abides in you, and as a son or daughter you have a permanent place in His family.

Thank you Jesus!

https://escapetoreality.org/2011/06/08/john-15v6_abide-in-the-vine/

Grace777x70 · Apr 9, 2016

John146 said:

("If I answer no, the Corinthians were not saved, I'd be going against the Bible. But, If I say yes, the Corinthians were saved despite their carnal, worldly living, I'd be going against what I've been preaching all along.") Hmmmm...ok, I'm not going to respond to such a stupid baited question...

phil112 · Apr 9, 2016

John146 said:

The correct answer would have been to respond with a parable. Just saying......................

oldethennew · Apr 9, 2016

in 1 Cor.10.

Moses was making a comparison to the Israelites being delivered from Egypt - they all ate the same
Spiritual food, all drank the same Spiritual drink, etc. - and they were baptized into Moses in the cloud
and in the sea...so, Paul concludes that MOST of them, the Israelites, God was not pleased with them,
(because most of them kept repeating the same Egyptian, pagan evil, over and over, all along their new journey)).
so Paul makes the point to the Corinthians NOT to follow the same path of error..as Paul says,
'Now these things became our examples, to the intent that we should not lust after evil things as
they also lusted. And do not become idolaters as were some of them.'

the lesson is, - Israel brought so many of the wicked Egyptian customs with them on their journey,
and these behaviours were so ingrained that they 'could not CHANGE' their Egyptian wicked behavior..
for it is written,
Although the gospel is preached unto them, not being mixed with FAITH, it profited them nothing.'

the difference with the Corinthians is, that the 'gospel' was preached to them and they were sanctified,
with the Holy Spirit and the gift of Faith - but they came from generations of wicked Sodom and Gomorrah
customs, but the beauty of this is, the Gospel is mixed with Faith, so that they are able, as we are,
to 'over-come' all of these culturally ingrained, wicked, worldly behaviours...for our HOPE is in Jesus Christ,
and, is there anything to hard for our Lord and Saviour???

roaringkitten · Apr 9, 2016

phil112 said:

Since you interjected, would you like to answer John146's question?

John146 said:

phil112 · Apr 9, 2016

roaringkitten said:

I'm not going back to look. What Corinthians are you talking about?

lets have some Bible study shall we?

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