Verse for "once saved always saved"?

[John146]

No one is ever saved just because they believe. Why you keep thinking people say this is mind boggling.

They are saved because they trusted God, this may take weeks or months of the work of God to bring you to this point of total humility and repentance in order to fall on our faces.

But when it happens, Then you are saved forever.

It's all about believing. There are dozens more if these don't satisfy.

"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved."

"For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek."

"Even the righteousness of God [which is] by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:"

"that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus."

"For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness"

"For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe."

"even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ"

"But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe."

 

[Gr8grace]

We can turn to religion, Get legalistic in our own lives, And even judge others, But to live like the heathen? Again, God would not allow it..

As you know this is where we butt heads a bit. King Saul is a perfect example of God allowing a believer to go back to their old ways. And the sin unto death was the consequence. If God didn't allow believers to go back into their old ways, there would be no reason for the sin unto death(physical.)

And for purpose of example.......I would rather take the discipline for acting like a heathen again, rather than the discipline for becoming religious,proud, self righteous,legalistic and judgemental.,,,,,how great is our darkness if we think we are in the light?

IMO, based upon my studies, God hates sin, but he absolutely LOATHES religion and creatures trying to be good on their own......because it only breeds pride and arrogance. ANd the majority of believers are stuck in religion......worse than living like a heathen IMO. And God is allowing it.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

As you know this is where we butt heads a bit. King Saul is a perfect example of God allowing a believer to go back to their old ways. And the sin unto death was the consequence. If God didn't allow believers to go back into their old ways, there would be no reason for the sin unto death(physical.)

And for purpose of example.......I would rather take the discipline for acting like a heathen again, rather than the discipline for becoming religious,proud, self righteous,legalistic and judgemental.,,,,,how great is our darkness if we think we are in the light?

IMO, based upon my studies, God hates sin, but he absolutely LOATHES religion and creatures trying to be good on their own......because it only breeds pride and arrogance. ANd the majority of believers are stuck in religion......worse than living like a heathen IMO. And God is allowing it.

Well if you would like to use "sin unto death" this just proves my point

God will bring a person home before he allows them to continue to live as the heathen.

then again I think I said that earlier..

The apostle John said a child of God can not sin, If A child of God can live as a heathen, then he can sin, and the apostle john is wrong..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

It's all about believing. There are dozens more if these don't satisfy.

"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved."

"For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek."

"Even the righteousness of God [which is] by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:"

"that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus."

"For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness"

"For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe."

"even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ"

"But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe."

the word belief in those verses is not the same as "belief" in the English.

It is a trust,, A faith, You do not faith in someone, the word belief is just the noun version of the work faith, which is an action word or verb.

It goes deeper than just mental agreement,,

 

[John146]

the word belief in those verses is not the same as "belief" in the English.

It is a trust,, A faith, You do not faith in someone, the word belief is just the noun version of the work faith, which is an action word or verb.

It goes deeper than just mental agreement,,

Yes, I get what you're saying, but that's what the word belief means, biblically. It means to trust, believe in your heart that something is true.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Why not? Believers at Corinth were living carnally, of the world. I've gone through seasons of my life where I was walking after the flesh and not after the Spirit. There were times that if you saw me, you would never believe I was saved, but I was. Was I convicted? Absolutely, but I never acted upon my convictions, instead, sunk deeper into the pleasures of this world.

I do not think people are listening to what I am saying.

I never once said a christian can not struggle with sin issues, I think people are misunderstanding me (at least I hope)

so you had no conviction, Every section of your life was sinful?

I was a prodigal son for 5 years, Yes, I did some sins which I was not proud of. But I never was like most people I was with.. God would not allow me, the conviction and chastening was just to strong.. If i had continued, I know I would be dead now..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

No, the bible says he who does not have eyes to see and ears to here (stubbornness), they will not see or accept the plain truth right in front of them. I see it all the time on this sight. I feel like the boy in the movie the sixth sense, yet instead of saying, "I see dead people, they don't know they are dead." I say, "I see spiritually dead people, they don't know they are spiritually dead. They walk around like Christians, bending scriptures to mean what they want them to mean."

You need to find a mirror. Look in it, Then while you are looking at yourself. Read what you just posted.


Then after you come to your senses. Please come back, so we can actually have a discussion where you do more than just attack people. but actually discuss what we are talking about..

 

[Gr8grace]

Well if you would like to use "sin unto death" this just proves my point

God will bring a person home before he allows them to continue to live as the heathen.

then again I think I said that earlier..

The apostle John said a child of God can not sin, If A child of God can live as a heathen, then he can sin, and the apostle john is wrong..

Yeah, our new nature or seed cannot sin and will not sin, but our flesh can.

The sin unto death proves that believers can and do live like the heathen on this earth and in time. It may be a day or 50 years that they live like a heathen before God takes them home.

 

[KenAllan]

The reason many people believe and teach we can lose our Salvation is because they have no Foundation. They are not grounded in Jesus nor do they really understand what Salvation is.

Look at Ephesians 2:8,9.

Ephesians 2:8,9
[SUP]8 [/SUP]For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, [SUP]9 [/SUP]not of works, lest anyone should boast.

First, we have been Saved. This means we have received Salvation from God. Second we have been saved by Grace and Faith. Where in this verse does it say anything about receiving Salvation by not sinning?

Since Salvation is not received by not sinning then Salvation cannot be lost by sinning!

We receive Grace and Faith from God because NO one goes looking for God.

Romans 3:10-12
[SUP]10 [/SUP]As it is written:
“There is none righteous, no, not one;
[SUP]11 [/SUP]There is none who understands;
There is none who seeks after God.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]They have all turned aside;
They have together become unprofitable;
There is none who does good, no, not one.”

If none seek for God and all have turned aside, then where do we receive the Faith needed for Salvation?

We receive the Faith from God FIRST then we seek Him out and receive Salvation!

Face it folks, trying to keep your Salvation by your deeds is a waste of time. We can never lose our Salvation because receiving Salvation is based on what God has done, not on what we have done.

 

[Grace777x70]

Yeah, our new nature or seed cannot sin and will not sin, but our flesh can.

The sin unto death proves that believers can and do live like the heathen on this earth and in time. It may be a day or 50 years that they live like a heathen before God takes them home.

I agree with this too...if someone all of a sudden takes up shooting heroin...there is a good chance he will die way before his time.....

or it can come this way too..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Yeah, our new nature or seed cannot sin and will not sin, but our flesh can.

The sin unto death proves that believers can and do live like the heathen on this earth and in time. It may be a day or 50 years that they live like a heathen before God takes them home.

50 years?

Now that is licentiousness.

I can not preach that.. God is not going to styand by for 50 years,, Chastening of God.. That has a bearing.

 

[Gr8grace]

50 years?

Now that is licentiousness.

I can not preach that.. God is not going to styand by for 50 years,, Chastening of God.. That has a bearing.

Yeah. Its what I believe.

If it is not true, God would take about 80% of believers home early because they live in a worse state..........self righteousness and religion.

 

[PurerInHeart]

If our salvation was dependent on us and something we had to do then none would be saved. If it were possible for us to lose our salvation then we would all lose it. But Because it is God alone who has saved us we are secure and can not lose it. Those who fear they can lose their salvation have not been perfected in love.

Just a thought.

Our obedience does not save us, but God only saves those who put effort into obeying.

 

[PurerInHeart]

50 years?

Now that is licentiousness.

I can not preach that.. God is not going to styand by for 50 years,, Chastening of God.. That has a bearing.

Licentiousness is sexual sin. But those who live in sin for any amount of time are in an unsafe state during that time.

 

[Grace777x70]

Our obedience does not save us, but God only saves those who put effort into obeying.

This is biblically untrue. You said "God only saves those that put effort into obeying " - This is called works-based salvation. God saves us by grace through faith only - not of works. Eph 2:8-9

Faith comes when you hear the message of Jesus and His salvation. The obedience we have is to be "obedient to the faith" - which is to believe in what Christ has already done for us.

It's called the gospel of the grace of Christ bought with the precious blood of Jesus. ( not the gospel of you putting in effort to be saved )

 

[PurerInHeart]

This is biblically untrue. You said "God only saves those that put effort into obeying " - This is called works-based salvation. God saves us by grace through faith only - not of works. Eph 2:8-9

Faith comes when you hear the message of Jesus and His salvation. The obedience we have is to be "obedient to the faith" - which is to believe in what Christ has already done for us.

It's called the gospel of the grace of Christ bought with the precious blood of Jesus. ( not the gospel of you putting in effort to be saved )

No, works salvation is you attempting to save yourself by your own works. Only God can save us, but He does not save everyone, but He does save few. So what makes this group different that He is willing to save them? The put forth effort into obeying Him.

The bible says not to be deceived, those who live sin will not enter heaven. Therefore we have to put forth effort to not sin. Yet according to your thinking, someone can be murderous, a homosexual offender, a drunkard, a swindler, etc, and still get into heaven without effort to sin not, all because they were once saved. Either that or they were never saved in the first place- which was not the case for some in the bible.

Ok, Faith is belief in God, but THEE Faith is specifically belief in the doctrine of Christ for His church.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Licentiousness is sexual sin. But those who live in sin for any amount of time are in an unsafe state during that time.

No, Licentiousness is taking the grace of God and mocking it by living a lifestyle of sin. Thinking you are saved and it does not matter how you live..

1 sin causes death apart from grace, so there is no amount of sin in which we are safe.. Only by Gods grace are we safe

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Yeah. Its what I believe.

If it is not true, God would take about 80% of believers home early because they live in a worse state..........self righteousness and religion.

1 Who said they are saved.
2. How can a person sin MORE after they are saved, then before? It aint happening..

Thats teaching licentiousness, That we can live however we want after we are saved, Jude taught against this.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Our obedience does not save us, but God only saves those who put effort into obeying.

No, God saves us then gives uus the power to obey.

Its all Gods power. not our own, Lets please not take credit away from where credit is due.

 

[Grace777x70]

No, works salvation is you attempting to save yourself by your own works. Only God can save us, but He does not save everyone, but He does save few. So what makes this group different that He is willing to save them? The put forth effort into obeying Him.

The bible says not to be deceived, those who live sin will not enter heaven. Therefore we have to put forth effort to not sin. Yet according to your thinking, someone can be murderous, a homosexual offender, a drunkard, a swindler, etc, and still get into heaven without effort to sin not, all because they were once saved. Either that or they were never saved in the first place- which was not the case for some in the bible.

Ok, Faith is belief in God, but THEE Faith is specifically belief in the doctrine of Christ for His church.

It's obvious you do not understand the gospel of the grace of Christ yet. I encourage you to ask the Lord to show you about His finished work.

Whatever religious upbringing you had has filled your mind with thoughts that are not the gospel...the grace of Christ is scandalous which is why Paul had to answer those that accused him of saying people should sin all they want now because of grace.