Have the New Testament Charismatic gifts ceased?

[ember]

Did Jesus ever speak in tongues?

no one spoke in tongues until the day of Pentecost

the flip side of your question (I have heard mulitple times) is...do you do everything Jesus did? walk on water? multiply food? heal the sick? cast out demons?

why would the Son of God need to speak in tongues? He did things in obedience to the law (of Moses) but changed everything by His death on the cross

 

[notuptome]

we have a new meaning to the word ironic

hi Roger...on your fav topic again, eh?

I did not bring this subject up. It is a great error in the modern church. One that is sending many souls into a Christless eternity through a faulty gospel.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[notuptome]

I'm sure He is smiling at you, He loves you. Maybe if you'd ask, He'd open your eyes to these gifts and even let you operate in them to bless others.

Perhaps if you spent just a little time looking upon Jesus you would see how pathetic the charismatic movement has become.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[BenFTW]

Perhaps if you spent just a little time looking upon Jesus you would see how pathetic the charismatic movement has become.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

I take it you have no interest in entertaining my question to you? VVhich gifts of the Spirit do you operate in?

 

[ember]

I did not bring this subject up. It is a great error in the modern church. One that is sending many souls into a Christless eternity through a faulty gospel.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

I didn't say you brought it up...I said you were 'on' it...meaning responding

 

[RickyZ]

You still deny the scripture. You avoid a truthful examination of charismatic claims in the light of the scriptures.

You will not to see so you remain in darkness.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

WHO is denying scripture?


Mark 11:23

Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and does not doubt in their heart but believes that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.

Matthew 12:21

Jesus replied, "Truly I tell you, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and it will be done.

Originally Posted by notuptome :
You are not going to move mountains with your faith.
Roger

*******

Mark 16:8 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them

Originally Posted by notuptome
So you believe in taking up deadly serpents? Drinking deadly poisons?
Roger

*******

1Co 14:4 Anyone who speaks in a tongue edifies themselves, but the one who prophesies edifies the church.


Originally Posted by notuptome
What possible reason would one have to speak in an unknown tongue to God?
Roger

*******

1 Corinthians 14: 5 I would like every one of you to speak in tongues.
1 Corinthians 14: 39 Therefore, my brothers and sisters, be eager to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues.

Originally Posted by notuptome :
Paul was not encouraging tongues
Roger

********

1Timothy 4:1 The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.

Originally Posted by notuptome :
Why would anyone desire to renounce eternal life for eternal condemnation?
Roger

Roger! Your denial of scripture is legendary!

 

[RickyZ]

Perhaps if you spent just a little time looking upon Jesus you would see how pathetic the charismatic movement has become.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

But we're not talking about the charismatic movement. We're talking about the gifts of the Holy Spirit, which have been hijacked by the charismatic movement. Learn to separate the two and you'll see much more clearly!

 

[trofimus]

WHO is denying scripture?


Mark 11:23

Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and does not doubt in their heart but believes that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.

Matthew 12:21

Jesus replied, "Truly I tell you, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and it will be done.

Originally Posted by notuptome :
You are not going to move mountains with your faith.
Roger

*******

Mark 16:8 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them

Originally Posted by notuptome
So you believe in taking up deadly serpents? Drinking deadly poisons?
Roger

*******

1Co 14:4 Anyone who speaks in a tongue edifies themselves, but the one who prophesies edifies the church.


Originally Posted by notuptome
What possible reason would one have to speak in an unknown tongue to God?
Roger

*******

1 Corinthians 14: 5 I would like every one of you to speak in tongues.
1 Corinthians 14: 39 Therefore, my brothers and sisters, be eager to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues.

Originally Posted by notuptome :
Paul was not encouraging tongues
Roger

********

1Timothy 4:1 The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.

Originally Posted by notuptome :
Why would anyone desire to renounce eternal life for eternal condemnation?
Roger

Roger! Your denial of scripture is legendary!

Please, choose some mountain and cast it to the sea. And please, post it on youtube so we can watch and become charismatic christians

 

[ember]

Please, choose some mountain and cast it to the sea. And please, post it on youtube so we can watch and become charismatic christians

scripture does not record anyone doing that...so perhaps Jesus meant something other than literal?

at any rate, casting mountains into the sea is not listed as a spiritual gift...now casting demons? yeah...that still goes

 

[BenFTW]

Please, choose some mountain and cast it to the sea. And please, post it on youtube so we can watch and become charismatic christians

"Oh ye of little faith." You already are on wrong footing, already in disbelief. If you believed you could do such, but in your post the doubt is already present. You challenge others, but don't do it yourself. How can you mock those that believe such and yet don't have the courage to do it yourself?

 

[RickyZ]

no one spoke in tongues until the day of Pentecost

the flip side of your question (I have heard mulitple times) is...do you do everything Jesus did? walk on water? multiply food? heal the sick? cast out demons?

why would the Son of God need to speak in tongues? He did things in obedience to the law (of Moses) but changed everything by His death on the cross

I've been used by God to do many of these things. But that couldn't happen if I didn't believe in them, could it?

Does waterskiing on the Sea of Galilee count as walking on water? Then I guess crashing into the lake qualifies as sinking like Peter!

I asked about Jesus speaking in tongues because a comment was made about 'everything I have done you will do and more', and someone questioned the more part of the equation. But you're right, that didn't start until Pentecost. So I guess we have done more.

 

[RickyZ]

Please, choose some mountain and cast it to the sea. And please, post it on youtube so we can watch and become charismatic christians

I haven't actually cast a mountain into the sea, but I've seen God honor a faithful request to stir up the seas. I figure that's in the same ballpark.

http://christianchat.com/blogs/rickyz/4349-beach-incident.html

 

[trofimus]

But the verse is talking about a real physical mountain, right? So if it really literally applies to every christian, why not to do it?

 

[1ofthem]

thank you you have just proved me right, God IS a respecter of person in the way you mention, To compare yourself with an Apostle is ridiculous

I'm not comparing myself with an apostle. I'm just saying that God is no respecter of person the gift that he gave to the Jews, he also gave to the gentiles. The gift that he gave to the apostles, he can also give to any of his children that ask of him. The scripture says to ask and you shall receive, but if we don't believe and don't ask then we won't receive.
Acts 10:34-46
Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
35But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.
36The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all
37That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judaea, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;
38How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.
39And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:
40Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly;
41Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before of God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.
42And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and dead.
43To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.
44While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
45And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
46For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,

 

[RickyZ]

Please, choose some mountain and cast it to the sea. And please, post it on youtube so we can watch and become charismatic christians

And are you too saying that scripture is a lie?

The gifts have absolutely NOTHING to do with the charismatic/pentecostal movements. I believe that much of these movements is of satan to confuse the saints!

 

[trofimus]

And are you too saying that scripture is a lie?

Are you? You posted it, so do it. Or dont you trust the Scripture? What is the problem?

 

[notuptome]

WHO is denying scripture?


Mark 11:23

Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and does not doubt in their heart but believes that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.

Matthew 12:21

Jesus replied, "Truly I tell you, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and it will be done.

Originally Posted by notuptome :
You are not going to move mountains with your faith.
Roger

*******

Mark 16:8 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them

Originally Posted by notuptome
So you believe in taking up deadly serpents? Drinking deadly poisons?
Roger

*******

1Co 14:4 Anyone who speaks in a tongue edifies themselves, but the one who prophesies edifies the church.


Originally Posted by notuptome
What possible reason would one have to speak in an unknown tongue to God?
Roger

*******

1 Corinthians 14: 5 I would like every one of you to speak in tongues.
1 Corinthians 14: 39 Therefore, my brothers and sisters, be eager to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues.

Originally Posted by notuptome :
Paul was not encouraging tongues
Roger

********

1Timothy 4:1 The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.

Originally Posted by notuptome :
Why would anyone desire to renounce eternal life for eternal condemnation?
Roger

Roger! Your denial of scripture is legendary!

The only thing I have denied is your corrupted interpretation of scripture.

You do not look like a Christian when you act like this. This is slander and malicious accusations toward me. You are rapidly losing any credibility because you fail on every point to address the scriptures.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[ember]

I've been used by God to do many of these things. But that couldn't happen if I didn't believe in them, could it?

Does waterskiing on the Sea of Galilee count as walking on water? Then I guess crashing into the lake qualifies as sinking like Peter!

I asked about Jesus speaking in tongues because a comment was made about 'everything I have done you will do and more', and someone questioned the more part of the equation. But you're right, that didn't start until Pentecost. So I guess we have done more.

I received the gift of speaking in tongues through simple faith...and I often interpret..on occasion regarding a future event...but I think that qualifies more as a word of knowledge?

I love waterskiing!!...but messed up my right knee too much to do it anymore...was my favorite thing...besides riding..when you hit water at a high speed, it's like cement...as you prob found out LOL!

 

[RickyZ]

The only thing I have denied is your corrupted interpretation of scripture.

You do not look like a Christian when you act like this. This is slander and malicious accusations toward me. You are rapidly losing any credibility because you fail on every point to address the scriptures.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

So correction is now slander.

Again, your lack of understanding holds you back!

The only thing un-Christian going on here is your refusal to understand scripture as truth.

 

[notuptome]

But we're not talking about the charismatic movement. We're talking about the gifts of the Holy Spirit, which have been hijacked by the charismatic movement. Learn to separate the two and you'll see much more clearly!

You argue that between the charismatics and Pentecostals I think you both are equally in error. Even within the divisions there is no unity. You have no coherent doctrine of what is tongues and what is not. Never has anyone who claimed the gift of tongues demonstrated from the scriptures that the tongues they received were the tongues of Pentecost or any other place in the book of Acts.

You scream at the wind and hope no one will see that your argument is wholly without merit.

For the cause of Christ
Roger