All Christians need to know what “the crown of life” means

Grace777x70 · Jun 19, 2016

Well...if you have died...do you need to keep dying? Being filled with the Holy Spirit is different from being crucified on the cross with Jesus. Is Jesus still dying to Himself even though He has already died on the cross?

The scriptures say that we have died in the same likeness of His death. Roman 6:4-10

I fail to see biblically how the Holy Spirit coming upon us by being filled has anything to do with "dying daily" but if somehow that makes any sense to you - go for it!.

I believe that we are continually filled with the Holy Spirit by speaking to ourselves in psalms , hymns, spiritual songs and being thankful. I pray and sing in the spirit more then I do in English. Being submitted to each other in the fear ( awe and reverence ) of the Lord ...just like Paul talked about in Ephesians 5

Ephesians 5:17-21 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is.

[SUP]18 [/SUP] And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;

[SUP]19 [/SUP] Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;

[SUP]20 [/SUP] Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ;

[SUP]21 [/SUP] Submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.

Hey... if you want to keep on dying to yourself after you have already died - then go for it!...die to all your heart's content! I was just giving you my views with the scriptures on that subject and I am still looking for the one where Paul said " I pick up my cross daily"...I may have a defective bible but I have checked multiple translations.

Which one did you use to find Paul saying " I pick up my cross daily"?

Anyway - it's ok to agree to disagree too.....

popeye · Jun 19, 2016

Grace777x70 said:

Well...if you have died...do you need to keep dying? Being filled with the Holy Spirit is different from being crucified on the cross with Jesus. Is Jesus still dying to Himself even though He has already died on the cross?

The scriptures say that we have died in the same likeness of His death. Roman 6:4-10

I fail to see biblically how the Holy Spirit coming upon us by being filled has anything to do with "dying daily" but if somehow that makes any sense to you - go for it!.

I believe that we are continually filled with the Holy Spirit by speaking to ourselves in psalms , hymns, spiritual songs and being thankful. I pray and sing in the spirit more then I do in English. Being submitted to each other in the fear ( awe and reverence ) of the Lord ...just like Paul talked about in Ephesians 5

Ephesians 5:17-21 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is.

[SUP]18 [/SUP] And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;

[SUP]19 [/SUP] Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;

[SUP]20 [/SUP] Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ;

[SUP]21 [/SUP] Submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.

Hey... if you want to keep on dying to yourself after you have already died - then go for it!...die to all your heart's content! I was just giving you my views with the scriptures on that subject and I am still looking for the one where Paul said " I pick up my cross daily"...I may have a defective bible but I have checked multiple translations.

Which one did you use to find Paul saying " I pick up my cross daily"?

Anyway - it's ok to agree to disagree too.....

Then,using the same logic,it would be error to get any filling,or blessing from heaven after our initial fiiling and impartation.

Thus voiding any verses to the contrary

popeye · Jun 19, 2016

SteelToedKodiak said:

The concept of continual dying is valid and scriptural.

How do you reconcile the dying verses?

Conversely,are we to never again receive any impartation,or anointing daily since we already received one time several years ago?

What makes a desert?

Look at the daily manna dimension. That will preach.

popeye · Jun 19, 2016

Grace777x70 said:

Well...personally I don't know all Christians and whether they know what romans 6 means what I think it means or not. I can't make that judgment call on my fellow believers.

To me Romans 6 is all about knowing that we have died with Christ on the cross and that we have newness of life in Him now after we were raised up with Him.

The entity "sin" has no more jurisdiction over me because I am in Christ. I believe that understanding there is a difference between the noun "sin" and the verb "sinning" is paramount to understanding that we are not under sin any more because we have been cut away from the body of flesh.

We then can yield our members of our body for sinning or for righteousness by using our will but it's in "knowing" that we are dead to the noun "sin" where we will have the power to yield to the right things.

Conversely,since we received at salvation,it would be error to receive anything again.

Human logic would demand equal footing

popeye · Jun 19, 2016

Hello?

Are there 2 natures?

popeye · Jun 19, 2016

Do dead men sin?

Why would the remedy for willful sin,as a believer,be offered in the bible if there is no old nature to be tempted?

popeye · Jun 19, 2016

Grace777x70 said:

Well...if you have died...do you need to keep dying? Being filled with the Holy Spirit is different from being crucified on the cross with Jesus. Is Jesus still dying to Himself even though He has already died on the cross?

The scriptures say that we have died in the same likeness of His death. Roman 6:4-10

I fail to see biblically how the Holy Spirit coming upon us by being filled has anything to do with "dying daily" but if somehow that makes any sense to you - go for it!.

I believe that we are continually filled with the Holy Spirit by speaking to ourselves in psalms , hymns, spiritual songs and being thankful. I pray and sing in the spirit more then I do in English. Being submitted to each other in the fear ( awe and reverence ) of the Lord ...just like Paul talked about in Ephesians 5

Ephesians 5:17-21 (KJV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is.

[SUP]18 [/SUP] And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;

[SUP]19 [/SUP] Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;

[SUP]20 [/SUP] Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ;

[SUP]21 [/SUP] Submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.

Hey... if you want to keep on dying to yourself after you have already died - then go for it!...die to all your heart's content! I was just giving you my views with the scriptures on that subject and I am still looking for the one where Paul said " I pick up my cross daily"...I may have a defective bible but I have checked multiple translations.

Which one did you use to find Paul saying " I pick up my cross daily"?

Anyway - it's ok to agree to disagree too.....

Paul ," I pick up my cross daily", " I mortify the deeds of the body"

You, " hey Paul,if you want to die daily,then go ahead in your error"

LOL

Grace777x70 · Jun 19, 2016

popeye said:

Okie dokie.....maybe you can help me by showing me where you said Paul said " I pick up my cross daily" as you said to me in post # 18 and you said it again in post #32 and then again in post #47

I am still looking for the one where Paul said " I pick up my cross daily"...I may have a defective bible but I have checked multiple translations.

Which translation did you use to find Paul saying " I pick up my cross daily"?

popeye · Jun 19, 2016

Grace777x70 said:

On my phone so most of what I posted was memory,but apparently Jesus said it too,or maybe I transposed it. If I did then sorry about that. But when Jesus said it,he added " you can not be my disciple".

The point being a daily renouncing since he obviously did not suggest a literal bodily dying.

Also,look up mortify and ask,"why didn't he say we are already mortified"

You still have not affirmed the two natures dimension

popeye · Jun 19, 2016

Also,there has been no response to the "one and ONLY permanent filling at conversion"

Prohibiting any further impartation by heaven.

No daily anything since we got it all at conversion.

The logic being that any receiving makes initial receiving a defective concept

popeye · Jun 19, 2016

There almost Has to be an underlying doctrine here.

I am thinking it is rejection of the two natures dimension

mpaper345 · Jun 19, 2016

oldethennew said:

Joh 3:29 He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, which standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is fulfilled.
Joh 3:30 He must increase, but I must decrease.
Joh 3:31 He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.

Right,Jesus must increase,but we must decrease.

Grace777x70 · Jun 19, 2016

popeye said:

Yes...perhaps you had mixed up with Paul saying "I die daily" when he was referring to having his life in jeopardy from preaching the gospel. It's a common thing.

I did find this scripture that Paul says that the flesh has been crucified - aorist indicative tense = a one time past tense event.

Galatians 5:24 (KJV)
[SUP]24 [/SUP] And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

Then there is Romans 8:13 which I referred to before - this is by the Spirit within us stopping the deeds of the body but it is not "dying to ourselves". Our life is hidden in Christ in God. Col. 3:3

Our real self is who we are in Christ. I will send another post about the flesh/old man/inner man thing.

Romans 8:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] for if you are living according to the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live.

Grace777x70 · Jun 19, 2016

popeye said:

Romans 7 shows the two conflicts that are going on in a believer. One is not real them ( not their true nature ). The flesh even though it stems from the corrupted Adamic influence in the world is now not the real us.

The flesh and the law of sin in our body - it wages war against the real us in Christ.

The flesh is ways to think and act that "were" the manner of living we had when we were in Adam but now are left over the old man died on the cross with Christ. ( Eph 4:22 - in reference to your former manner of living )

Romans 7:17-18 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] So now, no longer am I ( the new man ) the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me (in my body which has the flesh with the power of sin in it ).

[SUP]18[/SUP] For I know that nothing good dwells in me (my body which has the flesh in it ), that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me ( in my new man ), but the doing of the good is not.

Romans 7:20-23 (NASB)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] But if I am doing the very thing I ( new man) do not want, I ( new man ) am no longer the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me ( in the flesh).

[SUP]21 [/SUP] I find then the principle that evil is present in me (new man ), the one who wants to do good.

[SUP]22 [/SUP] For I joyfully concur with the law of God in the inner man, ( new man),

[SUP]23 [/SUP] but I see a different law in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin which is in my members.

italics = my words

Then Romans chapter 8 comes in and shows us how to walk according to the Spirit and not the flesh to put to death the deeds of the body ( flesh in the body ). Rom 8:13

We are not fighting a civil war within ourselves ( the flesh and the law of sin do not belong to our new nature which in Christ. ). Jesus said " A house divided will not stand."

We do not have "2 selves" we have the true self in Christ and we still have the flesh. Even though the flesh manifests "itself" with "it's" lusts through our bodies - it is not the real us in Christ.

We are still responsible for the deeds done in the body as they will affect our life here on this earth. Sin is destructive and will destroy us and those around us if we don't walk by the spirit - our true selves in Christ.

As long as we are on this earth and in this body we will have to contend with the world, the flesh and the devil a and none of these are us.

We are not of the world, nor the flesh, nor the devil.

The good news is that our Lord Jesus Christ has defeated all 3 of them and now we just need to walk in the truth of this!

popeye · Jun 19, 2016

Grace777x70 said:

Romans 7 shows the two conflicts that are going on in a believer. One is not real them ( not their true nature ). The flesh even though it stems from the corrupted Adamic influence in the world is now not the real us.

The flesh and the law of sin in our body - it wages war against the real us in Christ.

The flesh is ways to think and act that "were" the manner of living we had when we were in Adam but now are left over the old man died on the cross with Christ. ( Eph 4:22 - in reference to your former manner of living )

Romans 7:17-18 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] So now, no longer am I ( the new man ) the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me (in my body which has the flesh with the power of sin in it ).

[SUP]18[/SUP] For I know that nothing good dwells in me (my body which has the flesh in it ), that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me ( in my new man ), but the doing of the good is not.

Romans 7:20-23 (NASB)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] But if I am doing the very thing I ( new man) do not want, I ( new man ) am no longer the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me ( in the flesh).

[SUP]21 [/SUP] I find then the principle that evil is present in me (new man ), the one who wants to do good.

[SUP]22 [/SUP] For I joyfully concur with the law of God in the inner man, ( new man),

[SUP]23 [/SUP] but I see a different law in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin which is in my members.

italics = my words

Then Romans chapter 8 comes in and shows us how to walk according to the Spirit and not the flesh to put to death the deeds of the body ( flesh in the body ). Rom 8:13

We are not fighting a civil war within ourselves ( the flesh and the law of sin do not belong to our new nature which in Christ. ). Jesus said " A house divided will not stand."

We do not have "2 selves" we have the true self in Christ and we still have the flesh. Even though the flesh manifests "itself" with "it's" lusts through our bodies - it is not the real us in Christ.

We are still responsible for the deeds done in the body as they will affect our life here on this earth. Sin is destructive and will destroy us and those around us if we don't walk by the spirit - our true selves in Christ.

As long as we are on this earth and in this body we will have to contend with the world, the flesh and the devil a and none of these are us.

We are not of the world, nor the flesh, nor the devil.

The good news is that our Lord Jesus Christ has defeated all 3 of them and now we just need to walk in the truth of this!

OK,that same dimension right there ,the 2 natures,is where the dying comes in. We put to death,the deeds of the body,the ambition,the will etc,and put on the Lord Jesus Christ.

It has zero conflict with the death at conversion and putting on the Lord Jesus has zero conflict with infilling at conversion.

Gal 5;16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

ZacharyB · Jun 20, 2016

popeye said:

Yes, I understand Romans 6, but who else does?

All I see is Paul's choice for believers:
Be a slave of sin
... or ...
be a slave of obedience-righteousness-God,
which leads to holiness and eternal life!

This choice for believers is only possible because ...
Believers have a new nature, which is no longer a slave to sin!

Butski, with our free-will:
We can CHOOSE to
continue being a slave of sin
or
go back to living as a slave of sin!

Grace777x70 · Jun 20, 2016

popeye said:

One must remember that the flesh is not our true selves in Christ. The flesh has "it" desires - we are not the flesh - we are in the Spirit.

The real us is the new nature in Christ which is why the flesh is an enemy to God. So, we are not "dying to ourselves". The truth is we should be only "living to ourselves" in Christ now that we have died with Him.

We are still responsible with what we do with our bodies which is why we are to walk by the Spirit. It is walking by the Spirit that we do not fulfill the lusts of the flesh -not the other way around - don't do the lusts of the flesh and then you will be walking by the Spirit . This is why I say we are not "dying to ourselves" in reality "we are living to our true selves" in Christ.

Sometimes trying to get our minds around these things can cause confusion. Here is a great teaching about the outer man and inner man which helped me with understanding this. Also understanding the circumcision of the flesh and the heart in Christ when we were born again brings more clarity to this topic for me.

[video=youtube;vRwok6bfzrU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRwok6bfzrU[/video]

ZacharyB · Jun 23, 2016

Yea, methinks I should re-post this from post #56 ...

I understand Romans 6, but who else does?

All I see is Paul's choice for believers:
Be a slave of sin
... or ...
be a slave of obedience-righteousness-God,
which leads to holiness and eternal life!

This choice for believers is only possible because ...
Believers have a new nature, which is no longer a slave to sin!
(And the indwelling Holy Spirit to lead us, guide us, teach us!)

Butski, with our free-will:
We can CHOOSE to
continue being a slave of sin
or
go back to living as a slave of sin!

ZacharyB · Jun 30, 2016

Anyone been able to understand Romans 6 yet?

popeye · Jul 1, 2016

ZacharyB said:

Yes many understand it.

What is your take?

All Christians need to know what “the crown of life” means

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