Bearing fruit

[royalscot]

It all goes back to walking in the Light of the Truth....

1 John 5 "This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.[SUP]6 [/SUP]If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
[SUP]7 [/SUP]But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin."

So as long as you abide in the Light of the Truth, you also abide in Christ.

two different ministries. being preached to. at this time in history. jews and gentiles , who are called christian believers.
paul talking to peter in gal


7 On the contrary, when they saw that I had been entrusted with the gospel to the uncircumcised, just as Peter had been entrusted with the gospel to the circumcised8 (for he who worked through Peter for his apostolic ministry to the circumcised worked also through me for mine to the Gentiles.



Justified by Faith
15 We ourselves are Jews by birth and not Gentile sinners;16 yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified.Galatians 2

12 And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved."Acts 4


70 ad most of the apostles are dead or myartered for there belief in jesus christ.

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

Can I get that in writing?

Sign right here

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

very simple. anytime anyone says or implies that we are saved or kept saved by works, that flies in the face of the Biblical method of grace-faith-works, in that order

and anyone who says they do not sin is lying. these are simple Biblical truths. ya'll can accept them or not, I will not say anything else. i'm done having these fantasy world arguments.

I would have appreciated if you could have pointed out which verse was incorrect, or where Moses (the law) was, or where circumcision, sabbaths or bacon was being either preached or preached against.

That would have been helpful rather then posting two verses to what I posted and then accusing me without providing anything at all. Thats a hit and miss.

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

And surely we know Jesus Christ is not a minister of sin. He would not teach continuance in the same. (your quote)

they are not preaching law, but a saviour that saves. believers, (hebs 9, v15. ) new covenant.

11 This Jesus is the stone that was rejected by you, the builders, which has become the cornerstone.12 And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved."Acts 4:

Why would you think Jesus isnt the one doing the saving and the law is for pointing out that Jesus isnt a minister of sin?

I dont get what your problem is with that.

Jesus condemned not and still said go and sin no more, and he healed and when the guy was still sinning he told him to stop doing so lest something worse come to him and we see Jesus didnt teach anyone to sin, so why the problem with that?

 

[popeye]

Why would you think Jesus isnt the one doing the saving and the law is for pointing out that Jesus isnt a minister of sin?

I dont get what your problem is with that.

Jesus condemned not and still said go and sin no more, and he healed and when the guy was still sinning he told him to stop doing so lest something worse come to him and we see Jesus didnt teach anyone to sin, so why the problem with that?

How come I got more green dots under my name?

Did they tell you to go sit in the corner or something?

LOL

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

How come I got more green dots under my name?

Did they tell you to go sit in the corner or something?

LOL

Popeye you know Im not too swift, and I know you are joking but I missed it (and because things fly over my head pretty easily)

I consider that a gift (because I typically feel nothing if/when I am hit)

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

I got me some green dots too

Now I will go and hide em again

(Jesus made himself of no reputation )

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

You must really be blessed

I am!......


Matthew 5:11
Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

I am!......


Matthew 5:11
Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

Thats the one I had in mind

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

two different ministries. being preached to. at this time in history. jews and gentiles , who are called christian believers.
paul talking to peter in gal


7 On the contrary, when they saw that I had been entrusted with the gospel to the uncircumcised, just as Peter had been entrusted with the gospel to the circumcised8 (for he who worked through Peter for his apostolic ministry to the circumcised worked also through me for mine to the Gentiles.



Justified by Faith
15 We ourselves are Jews by birth and not Gentile sinners;16 yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified.Galatians 2

12 And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved."Acts 4


70 ad most of the apostles are dead or myartered for there belief in jesus christ.

Not sure how you saw someone saying we are justified by the works of the law in my quote from 1John? Unless you also are trying inject the ye ole straw man argument into those verses as well? Seems to be a popular thing to do around here. LOL

 

[BenFTW]

Not sure how you saw someone saying we are justified by the works of the law in my quote from 1John? Unless you also are trying inject the ye ole straw man argument into those verses as well? Seems to be a popular thing to do around here. LOL

Even if we dismiss being obedient to the law of Moses as being justification and replace it with morality, it still is self-righteousness. You say we are saved based upon our fruit, but that is wrong. Sanctification doesn't save us, though it is something a saved/justified person goes through. The moment a person overcomes a particular sin of struggle, for example, is not the moment they are finally saved. Jesus has imputed His righteousness to us, and we stand before God redeemed. This is not dependent upon present action but the grace of God (or rather the blood of Christ).

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

The doctrine of Christ is according to godliness.

Grace is for the obedience of the faith of Christ Jesus which teaches us to deny ungodliness and live righteously.

Thats not by Moses (the law) by which sin is known but by the grace of God (under which sin shall have no dominion)

 

[popeye]

I got me some green dots too

Now I will go and hide em again

(Jesus made himself of no reputation )

Funny.

I knew that would get a rise outta you.

Thanks for playing along.

You are witty. That is why I do a doubletake on your posts.

(btw,I do not know what those dots mean,so you are the smart one)

 

[UnderGrace]

Amen, if we have believed by faith on what Jesus has accomplished, there is no unrepentant sin and no condemnation.

would you need faith to believe this quote to be a fact. not any action a believer can or has done. so in simple terms has been done for you, by a god through jesus christ.. etc
has this quote , got anything to do with a believer,see, the spirit of life(holy spirit has set you free, from the law of sin, and death.)
Romans 8: Life in the Spirit
1 There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.2 For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death Romans 8: Life in the Spirit

 

[PeterJens]

Jesus has imputed His righteousness to us, and we stand before God redeemed.

This is a distraction. Go back to the temple. Jesus is the appeasing sacrifice that washes us clean.
But a sacrifice does not stop sin, it resolves existing sin.

I think the divide is obvious. If God has met you, inside, in your hidden place, in the place where
your feelings and defences are most strong, then things fall into place. Every person who has
been their gets created new, has everything put into perspective, loneliness put aside,
understanding given and a stream of living water flowing.

There is never a question here of compromise with sin, because why would you want to hurt
your Lord and yourself. When you switch the light on, you do not walk into the furniture,
fall out of the window, fail to see the gapping holes in the floor. So all this theoretical language
disappears, or comparing yourself with others, it is about service and seeing need.

It is why I recoiled at hearing some preachers and their blasphemy. It is just theory, trying
something new to get the congregations to give money to, and feel blessed. It is a business of
faith, where the carrot is so juicy, all your dreams on earth fulfilled.

 

[PilgrimPassingThru]

Funny.

I knew that would get a rise outta you.

Thanks for playing along.

You are witty. That is why I do a doubletake on your posts.

(btw,I do not know what those dots mean,so you are the smart one)

Now you cant go crediting me with knowing anything, I have absolutely no clue to their purpose (other then to make us look more colorful and awarded in some way).

I turn them off but even thats sort of dumb, whats the point if the numbers which represent some fake cyber powers still show? Like how is that turning off your reputation?

Thats not really turning them off (or becoming of none) but just depriving yourself of some much needed color

I might turn them back on.

I noticed I gots more green dots then you

(Now just wait for it....)

Highlight in between my last sentence and this one
(cause I was just trying to help you out saying that)
its how it works sometimes

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Even if we dismiss being obedient to the law of Moses as being justification and replace it with morality, it still is self-righteousness. You say we are saved based upon our fruit, but that is wrong. Sanctification doesn't save us, though it is something a saved/justified person goes through. The moment a person overcomes a particular sin of struggle, for example, is not the moment they are finally saved. Jesus has imputed His righteousness to us, and we stand before God redeemed. This is not dependent upon present action but the grace of God (or rather the blood of Christ).

Again no is preaching we are justified by the works of the law, or that we are saved based on "our own morality", or "self righteousness" or our "own" works. Show me where I have said as much as you suggest? Unless of course you are also just another false accuser and liar. That is the straw man you guys constantly try to prop up in an attempt to poo-poo on anyone who speaks out against ongoing sin, and is for an obedient walk of faith by the grace and power of God. You disagree with the words of Jesus about truly being set free from sin and sinning, as you also disagree that those who are born of God do not commit sin as is written.


The grace of God is given to us for the obedience of the faith, we cannot bear good fruit without being in Christ, who is our righteousness(not our works but His working in us to bring forth fruit) Jesus said without me you can do nothing. But you like your friends are trying to twist this around and misrepresent our position by saying that we must bear fruit first in order to be saved, that is your straw man because you cannot refute all the scriptures we post about how ongoing sinners shall not inherit the kingdom of God.


If Christ is your righteousness as you say, you will not keep living to the flesh and serving the lusts of the flesh, which is sin. If you are not walking as Jesus walked in righteousness, then His righteousness is not working in you. Prove your own selves if Christ is truly in you!

Titus 2:11-12 "For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,[SUP]12 [/SUP]Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;"

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Notice what the scriptures say Ben, this is what I preach.

Ephesians 2:10
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

 

[Marcelo]

There are those who preach not bearing good fruit has nothing to do with salvation. But scripture warns over and over again about trees and branches that do not bear good fruit.

John the Baptist said in Matthew 3:10 “And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.”

We are not saved by our fruits, but we must bear good fruit. The children of God are guided by the Holy Spirit and as a consequence they will produce good fruit.

 

[miknik5]

There are those who preach not bearing good fruit has nothing to do with salvation. But scripture warns over and over again about trees and branches that do not bear good fruit.

John the Baptist said in Matthew 3:10 “And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.”

Jesus said in Matthew 7:19 “Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.”

So bearing good fruit sounds pretty important doesn’t it? Well some will claim they abide in Christ, and so they trust in his finished works, so what they do, or don’t do as it pertains to bearing fruit makes no difference to their salvation. But the words of Jesus also warns those who did once abide in Him for a time but did not endure and bear fruit, that these shall be taken away.

Notice Jesus says every branch "in Him" (showing they were once in Christ) that do not bear fruit shall be taken away…

John 15:1-6 "I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.[SUP]2 [/SUP]Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Notice Jesus said every branch that did abide (remain in Him) and He in them, the same will bring forth fruit. To abide in Christ is to abide in the Way He told us to walk, and to also abide in the Spirit and the Truth of the gospel message, which leads us to Eternal Life. But not abiding, or not remaining faithful in Christ by unbelief and being unfruitful can get you cut off from the Life of the Vine, and cast forth as a branch and burned. Here is proof…

Romans 11:19-22
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be grafted in.
[SUP]20 [/SUP]Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
[SUP]21 [/SUP]For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue (abide in) in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

Now in the parable above in John 15:2 some will try to twist it’s true meaning and say the Father is not taking away those branches who do not bear fruit, but He is lifting them up to be embraced and nourished, as if God lifts up those who do not bear fruit. But I will prove this wrong by another verse of scripture and words of Jesus which speaks the same message.


First note the word usage "taketh away"G142 used(25X) in the KJV.....The KJV translates Strongs G142 in the following manner: take up (32x), take away (25x), take (25x), away with (5x), lift up (4x), bear (3x), miscellaneous (8x).

Notice the exact same message Jesus said in John 15:2 is spoken of again in the same way here in Matthew 13:12 and with the same words used “taken away”(G142)

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[TD="width: 9%, bgcolor: transparent"]Mat 13:12[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: transparent"]For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away[SUP]G142[/SUP] even that he hath.” [/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 9%, bgcolor: transparent"]Jhn 15:2[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: transparent"] Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away[SUP]G142[/SUP]: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="width: 9%, bgcolor: transparent"][/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: transparent"][/TD]
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​

First note, what does it mean to REMAIN IN HIM...for it is also written, apart from HIM we can't do anything.
As well, HE must increase, I must decrease...when I am weak than I am strong.

So, what works will make manifest that we REMAIN IN HIM?
Certainly not announcing our works as if our works are somehow the justification that we are IN HIM.
Nor after doing our works are we to think ourselves anything more than a servant doing what was expected of us.

So, I guess we could also view John the Baptist's directive to those people who asked, what works must we do...

What did John tell the people they should do but to do what is right in a world that was far from right and righteous:

The man with two coats, should give one away.
The taxpayer should not collect any more than what is required.

Therefore, what works would be identified as "fruit" showing ourselves to be HIS DISCIPLES?