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So what about the fourth commandment?
- Thread starter disciplemike
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not sure what you are looking for. Unfortunately, I cannot (and will not) boast about how many people I have taught. For years, I was not teaching the whole truth.
I can tell you this. I was a part of a baptist church. There, we would record and report the number of baptisms each month. Again, unfortunately, we never reported how many of those "new baptisms" were still attending a year later. That number would be much lower.
Similarly, Kirk Cameron has said, that his group would go to rallies and see hundreds of teens come forward and be "born again". Later, Kirk would go back and visit the city where the rally was, to find almost zero of those teens still in the congregation. Sad.
Capturing peoples emotions for a couple of hours is not equal to making disciples.
I can't believe that we have almost 50 pages of discussion on a day about an Old Covenant truth that has already been fulfilled in Christ. Christ is our true Sabbath rest now.
These 49 pages of discussion have served to occupy our time on something that is dead from the Old Covenant perspective and we all could have used this time to talk about what Jesus has done for us and grown in the grace and knowledge of Him.
Paul knew these kinds of discussions about the Law were completely fruitless and really just a distraction from Christ Himself. Remember in the last days Paul didn't say people would be "anti-God" but that they would be "anti-Christ".
Titus 3:9 (NASB)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and strife and disputes about the Law, for they are unprofitable and worthless.
These 49 pages of discussion have served to occupy our time on something that is dead from the Old Covenant perspective and we all could have used this time to talk about what Jesus has done for us and grown in the grace and knowledge of Him.
Paul knew these kinds of discussions about the Law were completely fruitless and really just a distraction from Christ Himself. Remember in the last days Paul didn't say people would be "anti-God" but that they would be "anti-Christ".
Titus 3:9 (NASB)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and strife and disputes about the Law, for they are unprofitable and worthless.
Exactly! The 7th day Sabbath was not even a controversy in the Book of Acts.
And [they that shall be] of thee shall build the old waste places:
thou shalt raise up the foundations of many generations;
and thou shalt be called, The repairer of the breach,
The restorer of paths to dwell in.
If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath,
[from] doing thy pleasure on my holy day;
and call the sabbath a delight,
the holy of YHVH, honourable;
and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways,
nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking [thine own] words:
Then shalt thou delight thyself in YHVH;
and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth,
and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father:
for the mouth of YHVH hath spoken [it].
Isaiah 58:12-14 (KJV, MBM)
As I said ..in the last days Paul didn't say that people will not be "anti-God" - but that they will be "anti-Christ".
You always leave out Jesus our Lord and Savior who is our real Sabbath. You are in effect rejecting Him for a mere shadow. This is why going back to the Law for living is committing spiritual adultery on the Lord. Romans 7:1-6
We have died to the Law "SO THAT" we could be "joined" to another - our Lord Jesus.
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FreeNChrist
Guest
Philippians 3:2-3
"Watch out for those dogs, those evildoers, those mutilators of the flesh. For it is we who are the circumcision, we who serve God by his Spirit, who boast in Christ Jesus, and who put no confidence in the flesh."
"Watch out for those dogs, those evildoers, those mutilators of the flesh. For it is we who are the circumcision, we who serve God by his Spirit, who boast in Christ Jesus, and who put no confidence in the flesh."
sir, show me the verse where jesus said that he is replacing the 4th commandment with Himself.
Come out of Babylon man. We were tricked.
I am not leaving out my Savior Yeshua. I get accused of that a lot, but all lies.
It seems to be a trend with the full-o-grace folks, if you disagree with something they say, they IMMEDIATELY attack and say you rejected the Savior or you rejected the Holy Spirit. Nonsense. Lies.
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FreeNChrist
Guest
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FreeNChrist
Guest
It isn't just that 4th one that has been deleted for Christians, it's all of them.
So you say all the commandments are deleted for believers?
Are you sure? That does not sound right.
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FreeNChrist
Guest
Of course not. Because you have missed the cross entirely. Which is why you are still stuck in the old. The new has come, and it is better in every way….because it is centered on Jesus Christ, and He is better in every way.
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FreeNChrist
Guest
Sir. I am always careful in the words I choose.
Why would you think it good that you have missed the cross?
You have exchanged one religion for another one but have left out Christ.
All so-called "holy days" and festivals are mere shadows of the real thing which is Christ. You can deny it but you are committing adultery on the Lord Jesus by going back to the Law.
Colossians 2:16-17 (NASB)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day—
[SUP]17 [/SUP] things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.
The true Sabbath rest is believing in Christ.
Hebrews 4:9-11 (NASB)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] So there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His.
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Therefore let us be diligent to enter that rest, so that no one will fall, through following the same example of disobedience.
here's the thing,
that no one is born again by any man's ministry.
so i don't think Tony's question was a fair one -- even though mike ((as is his custom)) summarily ignored and dismissed it. Tony was also right that mike did not answer it at all.
people come to a knowledge of God and are reborn only by the calling of God, who draws, who foreknew, who predestined and who justifies, sanctifies and glorifies.
no one can "say the right things" and convert another person's heart if God Himself does not place faith in that person's heart.
((this is a difference in thinking that you have some vain kind of 'free will' and understanding that God is sovereign in all these things))
maybe a better question is, who has come to know the gospel of Jesus Christ by the teaching of the Torah?
by the words of the prophets, men in ancient times learned of the hope for the Messiah, and by the Law, they learned the need for Him.
but today - now that He has come and His redemption is here, who hears the gospel of Christ by being taught the Law of Moses?
My good neighbor, there is not a verse you can come up with that says jesus replaced the 4th commandment, because it didn't happen. God wrote all the commandments!!!
by the way, the NASB translator incorrectly provided the word "mere" in Colossians 2:17.
That is why it is in italics. It is trickery.
Shadow of things to come.
things to come.
things to come.
things to come. (not things in the past)
It is FOR the Body of Messiah.
I wonder if that is important?
by the way, the NASB translator incorrectly provided the word "mere" in Colossians 2:17.
That is why it is in italics. It is trickery.
Shadow of things to come.
things to come.
things to come.
things to come. (not things in the past)
It is FOR the Body of Messiah.
I wonder if that is important?
Galatians 2:3-5 (NASB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] But not even Titus, who was with me, though he was a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised. ( doing the requirements of the Law which includes the Sabbath day )
[SUP]4 [/SUP] But it was because of the false brethren secretly brought in, who had sneaked in to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, in order to bring us into bondage.
[SUP]5 [/SUP] But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.
Galatians 5:3-4 (NASB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] And I testify again to every man who receives circumcision, that he is under obligation to keep the whole Law. ( trying to keep any of the Laws of Moses is under obligation to keep the whole Law )
[SUP]4 [/SUP] You have been severed from Christ, you who are seeking to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] But not even Titus, who was with me, though he was a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised. ( doing the requirements of the Law which includes the Sabbath day )
[SUP]4 [/SUP] But it was because of the false brethren secretly brought in, who had sneaked in to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, in order to bring us into bondage.
[SUP]5 [/SUP] But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.
Galatians 5:3-4 (NASB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] And I testify again to every man who receives circumcision, that he is under obligation to keep the whole Law. ( trying to keep any of the Laws of Moses is under obligation to keep the whole Law )
[SUP]4 [/SUP] You have been severed from Christ, you who are seeking to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.
This might be a shocker to you, but the same gospel was preached to the children of Israel in the wilderness.
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FreeNChrist
Guest
That's some very convenient rationalizing you have done there. You are obvious here with the goal of Judaizing Christianity. Do you honestly think you will be successful in that?