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L
God bless you JGIG., (wouldn't let me give you a rep.) Your writing is really good. And the words
Godly discipline is training for the future, not punishment for our past.
That is so very wise. There are many Christians who think God is going to "take us to the woodshed" But I've since learned Our Good Shepherd never beats the sheep with that rod and staff. Reading Psalm 23 it says how the rod and the staff they comfort. The Good Shepherd is not behind the sheep driving them with His rod and staff like a bunch of horses or cattle. No no. Jesus "leads" the sheep. He goes before the sheep. NEVER NEVER does He drive the sheep. We are the sheep of His pasture and He tenderly looks after us.
JP said in one of his messages about how people have misrepresented our Good Shepherd. Psalms 23 doesn't say "The Lord is my Shepherd., He breaketh my legs"
But many believers find comfort in the idea they are going to the wood shed to get wacked with the rod. NOT ME. Am not interested in getting spanked in the wood shed or anywhere. The natural consequences of sin are enough to make us miserable. The Lord doesn't have to add to the burden. And neither do believers for that matter. Yet many are of a different mind set. I've since changed and no longer see the Good Shepherd driving and swatting me.
I heard a preacher say that some Christians believe that the Good Shepherd breaks the legs of the sheep. (!!!) For many reasons a good shepherd would never do that to one of his sheep. For one thing the sheep need to be able to walk and do all the things a sheep need to do to survive. How could a shepherd do his job for all the other sheep if he was carrying a sheep with broken legs and taking the sheep to get water and food and to get to the bathroom etc etc... Only hireling shepherds would break the legs of the sheep and then sell them for lamb chops. Those shepherds have no love or concern for the sheep.
Our Good Shepherd Jesus is nothing like anyone we have ever met. His grace is what teaches us and that kind of learning is not understood by the natural mans way of thinking. We Christians need a revelation of the grace of God IN Jesus.
Will check out your link here JGIG. Thanks so much for your wise helpful words as always. Love you sis and you are deeply appreciated.
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There is a problem in this statement. What makes you different from the world doomed to hell?
If one takes all the words, actions you do or I do we end up a worthy follower of Christ or a player
on the world stage?
Because unless there is a difference we have nothing. It is very easy to sit and listen, to become
part of a crowd, to believe this is what it means.
What I am pointing to is like a farmer who plants a seed. No leaves, no stem, no life, then it is dead.
Now I am purposely saying this is not like action to prove to God something, I am saying this is action
as a fruit of knowing Christ.
So many parables talk about change, action, response. Now for those brought up in the church, the
idea is this response has to be obvious, leading services, ministry etc. when Jesus is just looking for
a loving heart, loving actions and loving words.
Think about this idea. Your best friend, who you have known for years is going to work abroad.
On leaving he says, give me a bell, I will come to help is you call. How much value are those words?
Everything because you know you can rely on them. So it is with Jesus. You are saved when you
trust on Him. Because you trust you will obey and follow. It is no simpler than this.
If one takes all the words, actions you do or I do we end up a worthy follower of Christ or a player
on the world stage?
Because unless there is a difference we have nothing. It is very easy to sit and listen, to become
part of a crowd, to believe this is what it means.
What I am pointing to is like a farmer who plants a seed. No leaves, no stem, no life, then it is dead.
Now I am purposely saying this is not like action to prove to God something, I am saying this is action
as a fruit of knowing Christ.
So many parables talk about change, action, response. Now for those brought up in the church, the
idea is this response has to be obvious, leading services, ministry etc. when Jesus is just looking for
a loving heart, loving actions and loving words.
Think about this idea. Your best friend, who you have known for years is going to work abroad.
On leaving he says, give me a bell, I will come to help is you call. How much value are those words?
Everything because you know you can rely on them. So it is with Jesus. You are saved when you
trust on Him. Because you trust you will obey and follow. It is no simpler than this.
One dimensional thinking or multidimensional.
Every concept or principle, ethic, idea, action can be discussed in different perspectives.
For instance the killing of a person in a foreign country.
1. An act of war, a casualty
2. An innocent murder
3. A freedom fighter heroically dying for a cause
4. Justice for death of another in another community
5. An accident
6. An act of self defence
7. An execution
There are many scenarios one could paint. The concept of innocense of communities
or individuals, a debt owed by actions done a country level or a debt owed by a person.
So the term misperceptions has to be handled carefully. Two groups could correctly describe the
other in terms that make sense to them but insult or upset the other group. They could suggest the
other is lying about them, which in their own language could well be true, but not for the other side.
So I see hope if people can see both sides of the argument, unless ofcourse that is what they are
saying is the problem. To see both sides is evil, because it is a delusion that dooms them to hell.
We are called to have the mind of Christ and He knew the perspective the pharisees had of Him and
their failure. So until you can honestly can do this, you are failing to have the mind of Christ.
My heart tells me if you love the Lord then you will also love me. But it appears you hurt and pain
from following legalism makes you paint me your enemy and hate everything I write because that is
how you feel. This is the key point Jesus was making about why loving your enemy is so important.
You will truly know that you are pure, holy, standing in the presence of the King, because this is what
God does all the time.
So I say from the bottom of my heart I love you. Christ is victory over sin, He holds out the hand of life
through love, set free in our hearts, healed and made whole through the cross. It is this love that unites
us in Christ, ministered to each and everyone, one to another, Christ and God to us, and us to God.
Every concept or principle, ethic, idea, action can be discussed in different perspectives.
For instance the killing of a person in a foreign country.
1. An act of war, a casualty
2. An innocent murder
3. A freedom fighter heroically dying for a cause
4. Justice for death of another in another community
5. An accident
6. An act of self defence
7. An execution
There are many scenarios one could paint. The concept of innocense of communities
or individuals, a debt owed by actions done a country level or a debt owed by a person.
So the term misperceptions has to be handled carefully. Two groups could correctly describe the
other in terms that make sense to them but insult or upset the other group. They could suggest the
other is lying about them, which in their own language could well be true, but not for the other side.
So I see hope if people can see both sides of the argument, unless ofcourse that is what they are
saying is the problem. To see both sides is evil, because it is a delusion that dooms them to hell.
We are called to have the mind of Christ and He knew the perspective the pharisees had of Him and
their failure. So until you can honestly can do this, you are failing to have the mind of Christ.
My heart tells me if you love the Lord then you will also love me. But it appears you hurt and pain
from following legalism makes you paint me your enemy and hate everything I write because that is
how you feel. This is the key point Jesus was making about why loving your enemy is so important.
You will truly know that you are pure, holy, standing in the presence of the King, because this is what
God does all the time.
So I say from the bottom of my heart I love you. Christ is victory over sin, He holds out the hand of life
through love, set free in our hearts, healed and made whole through the cross. It is this love that unites
us in Christ, ministered to each and everyone, one to another, Christ and God to us, and us to God.
L
who is on it? no one
The cross is empty and so is the tomb
maybe if some of you would stop seeing Jesus on the cross, and realize He has had victory over all of satan and his kingdom...the Bible states he made a show of the principalities and powers...maybe, if you would see this and the fact He has broken all curses over your life...take advantage of that...and defeated death...then maybe...some of you would understand what others of us are saying here
HEY HO...LISTEN UP!!!!!!
Jesus is NOT on the cross
Jesus is NOT in the tomb
We have a victorious risen Savior!
HALLELUJAH!!!!! HE IS ALIVE!!!!
they've also fallen prey to the misperceptions of what we're saying.
Every concept or principle, ethic, idea, action can be discussed in different perspectives.
For instance the killing of a person in a foreign country.
1. An act of war, a casualty
2. An innocent murder
3. A freedom fighter heroically dying for a cause
4. Justice for death of another in another community
5. An accident
6. An act of self defence
7. An execution
There are many scenarios one could paint. The concept of innocense of communities
or individuals, a debt owed by actions done a country level or a debt owed by a person.
So the term misperceptions has to be handled carefully. Two groups could correctly describe the
other in terms that make sense to them but insult or upset the other group. They could suggest the
other is lying about them, which in their own language could well be true, but not for the other side.
So I see hope if people can see both sides of the argument, unless ofcourse that is what they are
saying is the problem. To see both sides is evil, because it is a delusion that dooms them to hell.
We are called to have the mind of Christ and He knew the perspective the pharisees had of Him and
their failure. So until you can honestly can do this, you are failing to have the mind of Christ.
My heart tells me if you love the Lord then you will also love me. But it appears you hurt and pain
from following legalism makes you paint me your enemy and hate everything I write because that is
how you feel. This is the key point Jesus was making about why loving your enemy is so important.
You will truly know that you are pure, holy, standing in the presence of the King, because this is what
God does all the time.
So I say from the bottom of my heart I love you. Christ is victory over sin, He holds out the hand of life
through love, set free in our hearts, healed and made whole through the cross. It is this love that unites
us in Christ, ministered to each and everyone, one to another, Christ and God to us, and us to God.
First of all, the quote you mined above was not even addressing nor was it referring to YOU. Here's the quote in full:
Yeah, GotQuestions is a mixed bag - Calvinist underpinnings and they don't have much use for so-called 'Hyper-Grace' either. Unfortunately, they've also fallen prey to the misperceptions of what we're saying.
I've referenced them on occasion, as well, as they do get lots of stuff right
.None of us will always agree 100% on every issue.
-JGIG
Most of your post is gobbledegook (your seven-point list above has NOTHING to do with ANYTHING being discussed on this thread), and then you attempt to paint me as hating you and that it 'appears I hurt and have pain from following legalism'.
To address the first point, here's a quote from the last post I did write about you:
Does this mean that I don't love PeterJens, pray for PeterJens, hope the best for him in his walk (whatever that is)? No, but I and others here cannot stand by 'Oh, Peter, that was such a wonderful post' in the midst of this pattern of machination.
Thank you, PeterJens, for providing another PERFECT example of your pattern of machination here.
As to your second point about me supposedly suffering from following legalism, that's just an indication that you don't read what I write. I'm one of the few here who has NOT followed legalism, but God's Grace has been evident and ever-present in my life since I received Christ at the age of 8. I've seen lots and lots of folks who HAVE suffered under legalism, and God has called me to stand in the gap for many of those folks, but I suffer no mental or emotional defect as you attempt to imply above. Just knock it off, Peter.
You get away with the passive-aggressive abuse like what is written above because you follow up with statements like,
"So I say from the bottom of my heart I love you. Christ is victory over sin, He holds out the hand of life
through love, set free in our hearts, healed and made whole through the cross. It is this love that unites
us in Christ, ministered to each and everyone, one to another, Christ and God to us, and us to God."
No, PeterJens, you don't love me from the bottom of your heart, because you continually play deceptive games like what you've done above. Mixing some good-sounding stuff into your post to make it seem as though you're the conciliatory one is deception. Your abuse is subtle and divisive. Perhaps some self-examination is in order.
-JGIG
What a bizarre post.
First of all, the quote you mined above was not even addressing nor was it referring to YOU. Here's the quote in full:
Originally Posted by JGIG
Yeah, GotQuestions is a mixed bag - Calvinist underpinnings and they don't have much use for so-called 'Hyper-Grace' either. Unfortunately, they've also fallen prey to the misperceptions of what we're saying.
I've referenced them on occasion, as well, as they do get lots of stuff right.
None of us will always agree 100% on every issue.
-JGIG
Most of your post is gobbledegook (your seven-point list above has NOTHING to do with ANYTHING being discussed on this thread), and then you attempt to paint me as hating you and that it 'appears I hurt and have pain from following legalism'.
To address the first point, here's a quote from the last post I did write about you:
Originally Posted by JGIG
Does this mean that I don't love PeterJens, pray for PeterJens, hope the best for him in his walk (whatever that is)? No, but I and others here cannot stand by 'Oh, Peter, that was such a wonderful post' in the midst of this pattern of machination.
Thank you, PeterJens, for providing another PERFECT example of your pattern of machination here.
As to your second point about me supposedly suffering from following legalism, that's just an indication that you don't read what I write. I'm one of the few here who has NOT followed legalism, but God's Grace has been evident and ever-present in my life since I received Christ at the age of 8. I've seen lots and lots of folks who HAVE suffered under legalism, and God has called me to stand in the gap for many of those folks, but I suffer no mental or emotional defect as you attempt to imply above. Just knock it off, Peter.
You get away with the passive-aggressive abuse like what is written above because you follow up with statements like,
Originally Posted by PeterJens
"So I say from the bottom of my heart I love you. Christ is victory over sin, He holds out the hand of life
through love, set free in our hearts, healed and made whole through the cross. It is this love that unites
us in Christ, ministered to each and everyone, one to another, Christ and God to us, and us to God."
No, PeterJens, you don't love me from the bottom of your heart, because you continually play deceptive games like what you've done above. Mixing some good-sounding stuff into your post to make it seem as though you're the conciliatory one is deception. Your abuse is subtle and divisive. Perhaps some self-examination is in order.
-JGIG
First of all, the quote you mined above was not even addressing nor was it referring to YOU. Here's the quote in full:
Yeah, GotQuestions is a mixed bag - Calvinist underpinnings and they don't have much use for so-called 'Hyper-Grace' either. Unfortunately, they've also fallen prey to the misperceptions of what we're saying.
I've referenced them on occasion, as well, as they do get lots of stuff right
.None of us will always agree 100% on every issue.
-JGIG
Most of your post is gobbledegook (your seven-point list above has NOTHING to do with ANYTHING being discussed on this thread), and then you attempt to paint me as hating you and that it 'appears I hurt and have pain from following legalism'.
To address the first point, here's a quote from the last post I did write about you:
Does this mean that I don't love PeterJens, pray for PeterJens, hope the best for him in his walk (whatever that is)? No, but I and others here cannot stand by 'Oh, Peter, that was such a wonderful post' in the midst of this pattern of machination.
Thank you, PeterJens, for providing another PERFECT example of your pattern of machination here.
As to your second point about me supposedly suffering from following legalism, that's just an indication that you don't read what I write. I'm one of the few here who has NOT followed legalism, but God's Grace has been evident and ever-present in my life since I received Christ at the age of 8. I've seen lots and lots of folks who HAVE suffered under legalism, and God has called me to stand in the gap for many of those folks, but I suffer no mental or emotional defect as you attempt to imply above. Just knock it off, Peter.
You get away with the passive-aggressive abuse like what is written above because you follow up with statements like,
"So I say from the bottom of my heart I love you. Christ is victory over sin, He holds out the hand of life
through love, set free in our hearts, healed and made whole through the cross. It is this love that unites
us in Christ, ministered to each and everyone, one to another, Christ and God to us, and us to God."
No, PeterJens, you don't love me from the bottom of your heart, because you continually play deceptive games like what you've done above. Mixing some good-sounding stuff into your post to make it seem as though you're the conciliatory one is deception. Your abuse is subtle and divisive. Perhaps some self-examination is in order.
-JGIG
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There is no repentance and in order to have unity and try to resolve the many mis-perceptions of what "hyper" means - this foolishness needs to be addressed in some manner.
There still remains the constant "reformulating" of things and then speaking as if these are true to subvert the grace of Christ in our lives - When things are constantly being mis-represesnted it...something is wrong in Denmark. - we unfortunately need to implement Romans 16:17.
There still remains the constant "reformulating" of things and then speaking as if these are true to subvert the grace of Christ in our lives - When things are constantly being mis-represesnted it...something is wrong in Denmark. - we unfortunately need to implement Romans 16:17.
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I get that brothers and sisters truly want to correct wrong and dangerous doctrines like Peter has, not only for his good, but those who may be confused by mixed messages about love and what the true Gospel is, but I can honestly say that since I have decided to put him and other Grace plus works for or to maintain Salvation on ignore, some 6 months ago, I have been much more at peace, and have grown more Spiritually mature. I'd recommend that for anyone else tired, or groaning in Spirit with them.
Peace love and Grace to you all.
Peace love and Grace to you all.
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It is very unfortunate but this has been the same for over 9 months now - something is wrong in Denmark. Conversing with him is just a waste of time and it occupies us from talking about the beauty and grace of our Lord. It is a useless endeavor and scripture warns us from doing this.
We will just pray for him and bless him and let the Lord deal with Him as He will be faithful to Him like He has been to all of us.
We will just pray for him and bless him and let the Lord deal with Him as He will be faithful to Him like He has been to all of us.
F
What a bizarre post.
First of all, the quote you mined above was not even addressing nor was it referring to YOU. Here's the quote in full:
Originally Posted by JGIG
Yeah, GotQuestions is a mixed bag - Calvinist underpinnings and they don't have much use for so-called 'Hyper-Grace' either. Unfortunately, they've also fallen prey to the misperceptions of what we're saying.
I've referenced them on occasion, as well, as they do get lots of stuff right.
None of us will always agree 100% on every issue.
-JGIG
Most of your post is gobbledegook (your seven-point list above has NOTHING to do with ANYTHING being discussed on this thread), and then you attempt to paint me as hating you and that it 'appears I hurt and have pain from following legalism'.
To address the first point, here's a quote from the last post I did write about you:
Originally Posted by JGIG
Does this mean that I don't love PeterJens, pray for PeterJens, hope the best for him in his walk (whatever that is)? No, but I and others here cannot stand by 'Oh, Peter, that was such a wonderful post' in the midst of this pattern of machination.
Thank you, PeterJens, for providing another PERFECT example of your pattern of machination here.
As to your second point about me supposedly suffering from following legalism, that's just an indication that you don't read what I write. I'm one of the few here who has NOT followed legalism, but God's Grace has been evident and ever-present in my life since I received Christ at the age of 8. I've seen lots and lots of folks who HAVE suffered under legalism, and God has called me to stand in the gap for many of those folks, but I suffer no mental or emotional defect as you attempt to imply above. Just knock it off, Peter.
You get away with the passive-aggressive abuse like what is written above because you follow up with statements like,
Originally Posted by PeterJens
"So I say from the bottom of my heart I love you. Christ is victory over sin, He holds out the hand of life
through love, set free in our hearts, healed and made whole through the cross. It is this love that unites
us in Christ, ministered to each and everyone, one to another, Christ and God to us, and us to God."
No, PeterJens, you don't love me from the bottom of your heart, because you continually play deceptive games like what you've done above. Mixing some good-sounding stuff into your post to make it seem as though you're the conciliatory one is deception. Your abuse is subtle and divisive. Perhaps some self-examination is in order.
-JGIG
First of all, the quote you mined above was not even addressing nor was it referring to YOU. Here's the quote in full:
Yeah, GotQuestions is a mixed bag - Calvinist underpinnings and they don't have much use for so-called 'Hyper-Grace' either. Unfortunately, they've also fallen prey to the misperceptions of what we're saying.
I've referenced them on occasion, as well, as they do get lots of stuff right
.None of us will always agree 100% on every issue.
-JGIG
Most of your post is gobbledegook (your seven-point list above has NOTHING to do with ANYTHING being discussed on this thread), and then you attempt to paint me as hating you and that it 'appears I hurt and have pain from following legalism'.
To address the first point, here's a quote from the last post I did write about you:
Does this mean that I don't love PeterJens, pray for PeterJens, hope the best for him in his walk (whatever that is)? No, but I and others here cannot stand by 'Oh, Peter, that was such a wonderful post' in the midst of this pattern of machination.
Thank you, PeterJens, for providing another PERFECT example of your pattern of machination here.
As to your second point about me supposedly suffering from following legalism, that's just an indication that you don't read what I write. I'm one of the few here who has NOT followed legalism, but God's Grace has been evident and ever-present in my life since I received Christ at the age of 8. I've seen lots and lots of folks who HAVE suffered under legalism, and God has called me to stand in the gap for many of those folks, but I suffer no mental or emotional defect as you attempt to imply above. Just knock it off, Peter.
You get away with the passive-aggressive abuse like what is written above because you follow up with statements like,
"So I say from the bottom of my heart I love you. Christ is victory over sin, He holds out the hand of life
through love, set free in our hearts, healed and made whole through the cross. It is this love that unites
us in Christ, ministered to each and everyone, one to another, Christ and God to us, and us to God."
No, PeterJens, you don't love me from the bottom of your heart, because you continually play deceptive games like what you've done above. Mixing some good-sounding stuff into your post to make it seem as though you're the conciliatory one is deception. Your abuse is subtle and divisive. Perhaps some self-examination is in order.
-JGIG
P
I agree with this message totally. But if we take our eyes off the cross we will never understand the cost.
Paul said I preach Christ crucified, don't like to be referred to as "you people".
Did you take the wrath of God upon yourself....no. did you fulfill all that was required....no.
There is a place for everyone at the foot of the cross my dear saint don't ever forget that.
To say that it's meaning has been lost or there is no reason to look upon it is darn right wrong.
If I mistook your post I apologize if not then I do not.