So what about the fourth commandment?

[LaurenTM]

The church is under the New Covenant, established by the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. The Bible nowhere describes Christians setting aside the Sabbath day as the day of worship. The only Scriptures that describe Christians in any sense meeting on the Sabbath are in fact pointing to evangelistic efforts at Jewish synagogues, which met on the Sabbath day. Acts 3:2 records the early Christians meeting every day.

The Bereans studied the Scriptures every day (Acts 17:11). Acts 20:7 and 1 Corinthians 16:2 both mention Christians meeting on the first day of the week. There is no evidence in the New Testament that the apostles or the early Christians in any sense observed the Sabbath day as the prescribed day of worship

Traditionally, Christians have held their primary corporate worship services on Sundays, the first day of the week, in celebration of Christ’s resurrection, which occurred on a Sunday (Matthew 28:1; Mark 16:2; Luke 24:1; John 20:1). It is important to understand, though, that Sunday is not the commanded day of corporate worship, either.

There is no explicit biblical command that either Saturday or Sunday be the day of worship. Scriptures such as Romans 14:5–6 and Colossians 2:16 give Christians freedom to observe a special day or to observe every day as special. God’s desire is that we worship and serve Him continually, every day, not just on Saturday or Sunday.

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[LaurenTM]

Really? According to whom?
God or the Pharisees?

God's commandment says to separate it from the other six days and rest from your labor. I don't see where discussing the Bible would be work.

It's sort of like how we tithe we money instead of cattle like they did in the OT days.

As to "my version" of the Bible, the KJV works pretty well so I doubt I'd bother to create another one.

In this entire thread I've not said anyone else has to keep the Sabbath. I've not said those who don't aren't saved or are going to Hell or anything even close to that. I've simply answered the OP's question with what I believe. Whether anyone decides to join in keeping the Sabbath really makes no difference to me as most of my Christian friends do not. I do find it odd that many of y'all who don't want to keep it get really upset when it's brought up. I think that means its prickling you somewhat.

well, you are not a mind reader, but that usually goes along with someone who thinks they know it all

again, why the personal notations? aren't you better than that?


Using the Israelites as an example of those who were not resting in God’s promises, the writer of Hebrews goes on in chapter 4 to make the application personal, both to the Hebrew Christians and to us: “Therefore, since the promise of entering his rest still stands, let us be careful that none of you be found to have fallen short of it” (Hebrews 4:1).

The promise that still stands is the promise of salvation through God’s provision—Jesus Christ. He alone can provide the eternal rest of salvation through His blood shed on the cross for the remission of sins. God’s rest, then, is in the spiritual realm, the rest of salvation. Faith, the author goes on to assert, is the key to entering God’s rest. The Hebrews had had the gospel preached to them, just as the Israelites knew the truth about God, but the messages were of “no value to them, because those who heard did not combine it with faith” (Hebrews 4:2). Some had heard the good news of Christ, but they rejected it for lack of faith.

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[Officermayo]

well, you are not a mind reader, but that usually goes along with someone who thinks they know it all

again, why the personal notations? aren't you better than that?

What do you mean by "personal notations" and could you please tell me why you say that I think I know it all?

 

[Wall]

if you say you keep the 10 commandments, you make God a liar because He says we can't...that is why Jesus died

Whose a liar?

1 John 2:3-4 (KJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

 

[Wall]

Oh, I get what you're saying.

Like we can be baptized (or not) in any way we choose instead of following Jesus' example.
How we're allowed to decide for ourselves what scriptures need to be taken out of the Bible.
We can go to a class to learn how to speak in tongues.
We can pray to Mary.
We can confess our sins to an intermediate instead of going right to our Savior.

Yep, it's Christianity ala carte these days.

Yeah OfficerMayo

Isaiah 30:9-10 (KJV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP]That this is a rebellious people, lying children, children that will not hear the law of the LORD:
[SUP]10 [/SUP]Which say to the seers, See not; and to the prophets, Prophesy not unto us right things, speak unto us smooth things, prophesy deceits:

It was prophecied these people {the many} would come and do what they do

 

[Grace777x70]

Thanks for clarifying your position.

I DO NOT preach that folks MUST keep the Sabbath. I wouldn't have even brought up the subject. I was replying to an already existing thread. I still feel (for myself) that the Big Ten are not "the Law of Moses" (as I've explained) but I can see what you're saying.

Along that line, what do you think was meant by the statement from the Jerusalem Council saying, "For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day". Acts 15:21

I believe James meant not to bother new Christians with the Law and just have them do these few things (abstain from blood, fornication, ect) because once they're on board they'll be hearing the Law preached in church and they'll learn it then, not now.

What say ye?

James was saying that in every Jewish meeting in every city the Law of Moses was being spoken because they were Jews.

I say that the preaching of the Law is trouble for the Christian and in the early church James and Peter didn't have much understanding of the New Covenant until Paul taught them his revelation that he got from Christ Himself. Jesus explained the gospel to Paul.

The true Christian is dead to the law, released from the Law, is freed from the Law, and not under the Law. To preach the Law of Moses is deadly to the Christian.

We can and should read the law to see Jesus in it as the law is just a mere shadow of the real substance which is Christ Himself. Jesus fulfilled all the Law so read it to see Jesus but to read it as of things we do or don't do - that's a killer to the Christian life in Christ.

Paul who knew the law better then anyone had this to say about the purpose of the law.

The purpose of the law was :

1) To reveal our sinful state. Rom 3:20

2) To inflame sin Rom 7:8

3) To minister death in us Rom 7:10-11

4) To lead us to Christ Gal 3:24

The law is good, holy and spiritual but we are in the flesh. Jesus fulfilled all the law! When we read the law we should be seeing Jesus in it. Jesus did not save us so that we could go back to the law.

But the purpose of the law was not for righteousness or salvation at all, it was to manifest sin in our lives, so that the purpose of grace which is in Jesus is to manifest salvation. Grace does not set aside the law, but completely satisfied it.

People are free to do whatever they want in relation to the Law - it does not make one righteous nor is it for salvation.

If someone wants to observe a particular day or eat or not eat some kinds of foods..etc - then they are free to do so. These have no bearing on one's salvation or righteousness as all that is based on the finished work of Christ.

It's where people are saying "You must observe these things or do these things in the Law or you are not obeying God" - that's where the twisting comes in and it is a perversion of the gospel of the grace of Christ.

 

[Wall]

As to bypassing the NT, I must disagree. What it comes down to is that if there's a contradiction in the interpretation between what God/Jesus says and Paul, I'm going with the former and not the latter.

No need. They all say the same.

2 PETER 3 [15] And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; [16] As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which THEY THAT ARE UNLEARNED AND UNSTABLE WREST, AS THEY DO ALSO THE OTHER SCRIPTURES, UNTO THEIR OWN DESTRUCTION.

According to Peter its hard for the "many" to understand what Paul is talkin bout at times.

ACTS 25 [7] And when he was come, the Jews which came down from Jerusalem stood round about, and laid many and grievous complaints against Paul, which they could not prove. [8] While he answered for himself, NEITHER AGAINST THE LAW OF THE JEWS, neither against the temple, nor yet against Caesar, HAVE I OFFENDED ANY THING AT ALL.

The Jews of Pauls time were saying the same things your now hearing from Lauren. Paul set them straight. He has done nothing to offend the law of the Jews

 

[Grace777x70]

Whose a liar?

1 John 2:3-4 (KJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

Keep reading in John's letter and John tells us exactly what those "commandments " are in the New Covenant.

1 John 3:23 (NASB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.

 

[jcha]

The church is under the New Covenant, established by the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. The Bible nowhere describes Christians setting aside the Sabbath day as the day of worship. The only Scriptures that describe Christians in any sense meeting on the Sabbath are in fact pointing to evangelistic efforts at Jewish synagogues, which met on the Sabbath day. Acts 3:2 records the early Christians meeting every day.

The Bereans studied the Scriptures every day (Acts 17:11). Acts 20:7 and 1 Corinthians 16:2 both mention Christians meeting on the first day of the week. There is no evidence in the New Testament that the apostles or the early Christians in any sense observed the Sabbath day as the prescribed day of worship

Traditionally, Christians have held their primary corporate worship services on Sundays, the first day of the week, in celebration of Christ’s resurrection, which occurred on a Sunday (Matthew 28:1; Mark 16:2; Luke 24:1; John 20:1). It is important to understand, though, that Sunday is not the commanded day of corporate worship, either.

There is no explicit biblical command that either Saturday or Sunday be the day of worship. Scriptures such as Romans 14:5–6 and Colossians 2:16 give Christians freedom to observe a special day or to observe every day as special. God’s desire is that we worship and serve Him continually, every day, not just on Saturday or Sunday.

MORE

The Sabbath is about physically resting and being the sign which God we serve. We should worship everyday.

 

[Wall]

The true Christian is dead to the law, released from the Law, is freed from the Law, and not under the Law. To preach the Law of Moses is deadly to the Christian.

We can and should read the law to see Jesus in it as the law is just a mere shadow of the real substance which is Christ Himself.

ISAIAH 8 [16] Bind up the testimony, seal the law among my disciples.[17] And I WILL WAIT UPON THE LORD, that hideth his face from the house of Jacob, and I will look for him.[18] Behold, I and the children whom the LORD hath given me are for signs and for wonders in Israel from the LORD of hosts, which dwelleth in mount Zion.[19] And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?[20] TO THE LAW AND TO THE TESTIMONY: IF THEY SPEAK NOT ACCORDING TO THIS WORD, IT IS BECAUSE THERE IS NO LIGHT IN THEM.

Dont ya need light to see a shadow?

 

[Bladerunner]

Hi All,,, What Have I missed? Can someone tell me where this thread is at without me having to read all 100 pages of it.

 

[Grace777x70]

ISAIAH 8 [16] Bind up the testimony, seal the law among my disciples.[17] And I WILL WAIT UPON THE LORD, that hideth his face from the house of Jacob, and I will look for him.[18] Behold, I and the children whom the LORD hath given me are for signs and for wonders in Israel from the LORD of hosts, which dwelleth in mount Zion.[19] And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?[20] TO THE LAW AND TO THE TESTIMONY: IF THEY SPEAK NOT ACCORDING TO THIS WORD, IT IS BECAUSE THERE IS NO LIGHT IN THEM.

Dont ya need light to see a shadow?

Apparently we do need the Light in order to see beyond the shadow to see Christ Himself....according to Paul. Come on over to the New Covenant!

Colossians 2:14-17 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.

[SUP]15 [/SUP] When He had disarmed the rulers and authorities, He made a public display of them, having triumphed over them through Him.

[SUP]16 [/SUP] Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day—

[SUP]17 [/SUP] things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.

 

[Yahweh_is_gracious]

Hi All,,, What Have I missed? Can someone tell me where this thread is at without me having to read all 100 pages of it.

I'll sum up all 100 pages for you super quick. Op is right, everyone else is wrong. There, I just saved you a lot of time. Enjoy your Saturday.

 

[Grace777x70]

Hi All,,, What Have I missed? Can someone tell me where this thread is at without me having to read all 100 pages of it.

Some say that if we don't keep their Sabbath day as they do ( Which to them is a Saturday ) then you are not obeying God.

Others say that the Old Covenant is now obsolete and that Christ has fulfilled the Law and that Christ Himself is our Sabbath rest.

Some say that we still need to do the Law and others say that we live by the law of the spirit of Christ in us now because we are in the New Covenant. That we are not under the Law, that we are released from the Law, that we have died to the Law SO THAT we could be joined to Another - Christ Himself.

They also say that they don't need to "obey" Lev. 18:23 to stop having sex with animals as the Law says - the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus will stop us from doing that.

That's about the synopsis of the 100 pages...lol

 

[Wall]

Apparently we do need the Light in order to see beyond the shadow to see Christ Himself....according to Paul. Come on over to the New Covenant!

Colossians 2:14-17 (NASB)
[SUP]14 [/SUP] having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.

[SUP]15 [/SUP] When He had disarmed the rulers and authorities, He made a public display of them, having triumphed over them through Him.

[SUP]16 [/SUP] Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day—

[SUP]17 [/SUP] things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.

Simply read the scriptures posted in posts 1249 to 1254. Oh yeah, id throw that nasb thing in the dumper and buy a bible

 

[Wall]

I'll sum up all 100 pages for you super quick. Op is right, everyone else is wrong. There, I just saved you a lot of time. Enjoy your Saturday.

And may you have a wonderful sabbath day

 

[Wall]

Simply read the scriptures posted in posts 1249 to 1254. Oh yeah, id throw that nasb thing in the dumper and buy a bible

If ya do......you wont even find the word obsolete

 

[Wall]

Hi All,,, What Have I missed? Can someone tell me where this thread is at without me having to read all 100 pages of it.

Theres 2 groups here. The "many"

EZEK.22 [23] And the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,[24] Son of man, say unto her, Thou art the land that is not cleansed, nor rained upon in the day of indignation.[25] There is A CONSPIRACY OF HER PROPHETS in the midst thereof, like a ROARING LION ravening the prey; THEY HAVE DEVOURED SOULS; they have taken the treasure and precious things; they have made her many widows in the midst thereof.[26] HER PRIESTS HAVE VIOLATED MY LAW, and have profaned mine holy things: they have put no difference between the holy and profane, neither have they shewed difference between the UNCLEAN AND THE CLEAN, and HAVE HID THEIR EYES FROM MY SABBATHS, and I am profaned among them.[27] Her princes in the midst thereof are like WOLVES RAVENING THE PREY, to shed blood, and to destroy souls, to get DISHONEST GAIN.[28] And her prophets have daubed them with untempered morter, SEEING VANITY, and divining lies unto them, saying, Thus saith the Lord GOD, when the LORD hath not spoken

And the few

REV.12 [16] And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.[17] And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, WHICH KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD, AND HAVE THE TESTIMONY OF JESUS CHRIST.

 

[Dan_473]

It looks to me like one could easily discuss the theory of 'law-keeping' for a lifetime or more.

not because each approach is equally valid, but because there are just too many avenues to go down, too many possible turns to make... it's an endless maze.

to me, the obvious answer is to talk about the actual practice of 'law-keeping', how it looks in a person's life.

but each attempt I've seen to talk about the actual practice of 'law-keeping' and how the person arrived at those behaviors is met with "that's legalism".

 

[Dan_473]

Simply read the scriptures posted in posts 1249 to 1254. Oh yeah, id throw that nasb thing in the dumper and buy a bible

please talk about which parts of the nasb you disagree with.